House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 20 April 1604

Veneris, 20o Aprilis, 1604

Jermy's Decree.

L. 1. B. FOR the making void of a Decree in Chancery, and of the Assurance made thereupon, by Sir Thomas Jermy Knight, and Dame Joane his Wife, to Sir Mark Styward Knight, of certain Lands and Tenements in the Isle of Ely, in the County of Cambridge.

Weavers.

L. 1. B. For the Ordering of Woollen Weavers and Spinsters, and against Licences to buy Wools, and to transport Woollen Cloth.

Manslaughter.

L. 1. B. For taking away the Benefit of Clergy for some kind of Manslaughter : - Preferred by Mr. Bond, and Speech used by him and others, that some Project and Provision might be thought on, to prevent Quarrels.

Daggers.

A Motion for some Provision, that no Man should wear Daggers.

Simpson's Debt.

B. To secure Simpson's Debt, &c. reported from the Committee by Mr Francis Moore, with Amendments ; which being twice read, the Bill, upon Question, ordered to be ingrossed.

Privilege- Relief of Plaintiffs.

L. 1. B. For the Relief of Plaintiffs in Writs of Execution, where the Defendants in such Writs have been arrested, and set at Liberty by the Parliament.

Extortion.

An Act for the better Execution of Justice; upon a third Reading, much argued, pro & contra, by Sir Jo. Higham, Mr. Hitcham, Sir Tho. Holcroft, Mr. Wyseman, Mr. D. Steward, Mr. Francis Moore, Mr. Ryvers, Mr. Overberry, Mr. Hyde, Mr. Fuller, Mr. Martin, Mr. Yelverton, Sir Geo. Carewe.

Some Additions offered to the Bill; which were twice read, and ordered, upon Question, to be ingrossed, and added : Which was presently done by the Clerk; and the Bill, upon Question, passed.

[b] Mr. James; of Bristowe, in this Dispute, said, he feared this Law would do little Good ; for himself (he said) being in Spaine, did, with others, fall into an Offence, by which he was to forfeit all he had. The Corrigidor (the Officer of the Place so called) had his Broker, who told him and others privately, they must repair to a Place, which he named, and there lay down so much Money; and of this the Corrigidor took no Notice; yet they knew it came to his Use. He left the Application to whom it concerned.

Union with Scotland.

The Dispute, touching the Name, begun again by Sir William Morrice; continued by Mr. Hoskins, Sir Dan Dun, Mr. Lawton, Sir Maurice Berkley, Sir John Bennett, Mr. Holt, Sir Edwyn Sandys, Mr. Secretary Herbert.

All tended to a Conference, and the Course to be held in it; which grew to several Questions. Something was said pro et contra.

Pro. - In the Mouth of a King there is Power; and who shall say, What doest thou ?. Eccles.

A new Name reasonable, and profitable. - A World of Changes. - Quid mirum, cum omnia mutentur, si locorum et rerum nomina immutentur.? - Ex re nomen habet. - Gratia et Beneficium, the greatest Cause of Concord : - The greater Mischief by continuing disjointed and divided. -

The Union proceeded in, many Degrees; therefore the Name not strange.

Let us, like Astrologers, look to the Stars of our State ; see their Motion, their Influence, &c. -

We mistaken, and the King mistaken, in the Proposition. - In taking the Name of Brittaine, we do not take away England. - We take away no Dignities, Privileges, &c. of either Nation.- - England, Scotland, Ireland, the Isles adjacent, in One Union. - The Government of other Countries shall be brought to ours.

Contra. - Amo omen, non amo nomen. - No Union of the Name before the Union in Government. - Ecclesia Anglicana, gens Anglicana. - Frivolous, dangerous, to confer of the Alteration of the Name; for then either must we proceed with Danger, or desist with Shame. - The Adder shall tread upon his Heel, that breaketh down the Hedge. - Scotland was held of England by Homage: The Tenancy, and Seigniory, are come together. - Proceed on God's Name, and let there be two Savings : Saving to England his Honour, and Saving to every honest Heart his Opinion. - Non persuadebor, etiamsi persuaseris.

Mr. Speaker, in Conclusion, being directed thereunto, putteth several Questions:

First, Whether a Conference ? - Resolved.

Whether touching the Union in Name, before the Union in Government be treated and resolved ? - Resolved in the Negative.

Whether touching a Commission, and Nomination of Commissioners ? - Resolved.

The general Committee for the Union to confer with this Limitation and Charge : First, to attend the Repetition or Iteration of their Lordships Motion: The Reasons of their Motion : The Particularities of their Opinions.

To confer, whether there shall be a Commission, and Commissioners nominated.

Whether it be fit to alter the Name, before the Union in Government be treated and resolved.

To treat and debate these Things, as Occasion offers itself; but not to conclude of any thing [c].

The Committee formerly named for Conference touching the Union, appointed to attend the King at Whytehall, at Two a Clock this Afternoon, to understand his gracious Pleasure ; and to hear him explain his own Meaning in the Matter of the Union.

Upon this Occasion were added, Mr. Albany Stepney, Sir Robert Wingfield, Sir Robert Moore, Sir Edwyn Sandys, Sir Maurice Berkley, Mr. Thomas Crowe, Sir Wm.

The first thing desired was a Conference ; which was yielded unto.

Upon the Conference Two things propounded ; the first, Union in Name ; and, Union in Government: The one presently to be conferred on; the other by Commissioners to be appointed.

In the Dispute whereof, many things hath been propounded which properly are to be divided into Two Heads ; the one Manner, the other Matter. The first whereof, being the Manner, containing many Parts:

First, That, upon your coming to the Lords, before you speak, to receive from them the Narration of Overture of those Things by them propounded.

Secondly, To require to be satisfied of the Reasons or Motives moving or persuading the Proposition.

Thirdly, They being Men of State Government, to know their Opinions and Resolutions.

Which done, and yielded unto by them, then to proceed in this Manner.

First, To assent, that for the treating and conferring of the Union in Government, to confer concerning a Commission, and Commissioners to be appointed.

Secodly, If that follow, and succeed; then the Name to be conferred of ; Until which Time, it is yet conceived fit to forbear any Resolution thereof, for those Reasons, which you shall deliver.

Slingsby, Sir Rich. Warberton, Sir Rob. Mansfield, Sir John Ferne, Sir William Fleetwood, Sir Thomas Jermyn, Mr. John Lewys, Sir John Jeffereyes, Sir Thomas Smyth, Sir Henry Goodyeare, Sir Tho. Lane, Sir Rob. Cotton, Sir Henry Hobart, Mr. Serjeant Tanfield, Sir Henry Carey, Sir Thomas Knevytt, Sir Henry Constable, Sir Rich. Spencer, Sir Peter Manwood, Sir Daniel Dun, Sir John Bennett, Sir John Trevor, Mr. D. Steward, Sir Wm. Herbert, Sir Edw. Tyrrell, Mr. Johnson, Sir John Hungerford, Sir Henry Beaumount, Sir Tho. Strickland, Mr. Talbott Bowes, Mr. Sherston, Mr. John Moore, Mr. Dighton, Sir Herbert Crofts, Mr. Pettus, Sir Rich. Haughton.

Any Member of the House, being no Committee, hath Liberty to accompany them to the King.