House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 03 May 1621

Pages 605-606

Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 1, 1547-1629. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1802.

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In this section

Jovis, 3o Maii

Freyford Prebend.

L. 1a. AN Act for the Annexing of Freyford Prebend, being in the Collation of the Bishop of Coventry and Lichfeild, unto the Vicarage of St. Marye's, near the Market-place of the City of Lichfeild, and for the Making the said St. Marye's, Church a Parish Church.

Mohun's Estate.

L. 1a. An Act for the Establishing of some Manors, in the several Counties of Cornewayle, Devon, and Dorsett, upon John Mohun Esquire, Son and Heir apparent of Sir Rey. Mohun, Knight and Baronet, according to the true Intent and Meaning of former Agreements between them had and made.

Trade to France.

L. 1a. An Act for free Trade into the Kingdom of Fraunce.

Wool Trade.

L. 1a. An Act for the Upholding of the good Usage of Wool and Yarn, and for avoiding all Deceits in the Trading therein, for the better Maintenance of Clothing, and preventing Inconveniences, which heretofore and hereafter may hinder the same.


Tuesday next, for Carriages, in the Exchequer Chamber.


The Bill of Arms, Wednesday next.

Ouse Navigation.

L. 2a. An Act for the making of the River Owse navigable from Humber to the City of Yorke: - Committed to Mr. Treasurer, Mr. Secretary, Mr. Mallory, Sir Guy Palmes, Sir Ro. Askew, Sir Gervase Clifton, Mr. Hutton, Sir Tho. Low, Sir Francis Darcy, Sir H. Poole, Sir A. Ingram, Sir Tho. Hobby, Knights and Burgesses of Yorkeshyre, and Lincolne, Lord Clifford, Sir Rich. Yong ; - This Day sevennight, Exchequer Chamber.


L. 2a. An Act for the Restraint of the inordinate Use of Tobacco. -

Sir Ro. Bevill, - against the Prohibition of foreign Tobacco. Whereupon,

Resolved, That, though a Matter ordered in the House, upon Question, yet, if after the same Matter come in again, by Bill, any Member of the House may speak to this Matter, pro or contra, as his Opinion is ; and the said Question, formerly made and passed, concludeth him not.

Sir P. Fretchwill: - Tobacco and Ale now made inseparable in the base vulgar Sort: These accompanied with Idleness, Drunkenness, Sickness, Decay of their Estates, &c. - Commendeth the Clause, inserted in the Condition for Alehouses. - Yet the Use, in some Cases, good; and therefore not to be totally taken away. - Wisheth the Advancement of the Plantation, in respect of Religion, Good of this Kingdom. - Is against the Restraint of planting Tobacco here: Which against the Liberty of the Subject. - Very good and wholesome Tobacco here.

Sir Wm Strowde : - A Disproportion between the Title and the Body of the Bill. -

Committed to Sir Edw. Sands, Sir M. Sands, Lord Candish, Sir Edw. Payton, Mr. Griffyth, Sir Nath. Rich, Mr. Treasurer, Mr. Bertlett, Sir H. Myldmay, Mr. Drake : All, that will come, to have Voice: - Tuesday next, Exchequer Chamber.

Transporting Ordnance.

L. 1a. An Act against the Transportation of Iron Mine, cast Iron Ordnance, and cast Iron Shot.

Fees in Court.

L. 2a. - Fees - Justice -

Sir.H. Poole: - This a timely Bill - The Charge and Abuse, to the Subject, great. - To have this extend to the spiritual Courts, To have it look further backward,

than 1 Jac. for many granted in Queen Eliz. Time, both Offices, and Fees.

Sir Wm. Brereton: - To have this extend also to the County Palatyne of Chester.

Sir Rich. Gravenor: - Many undue Fees encroached by the Officers in the County Palatyne of Chester. - The Judges only not to be trusted with the Tables of Fees.

Sir Guy Palmes: - Against Fees, demanded by Judges Men at the Assises.

Mr. Downes: - That the Clerks of the Crown, in the Palatyne of Chester, bind Men over of Purpose, for great Fees : And great Exactions - To have these therefore limited. To have the Fees established before the End of the Parliament, especially at Westmynster; because the Judges are to take their Information from the Clerks.

Master of the Wards: - This Bill will have many Enemies. - To extend further, than to the King's Time, for avoiding Taxing of the King's Times. - Not to tie the King from raising a new Office; but to have it limited, not to charge the Subjects. To name the Courts at Westmynster by Name. To set the Fees, during the Sitting in Parliament. To take the Time for Fees, that were 1 Eliz. - Fees in ecclesiasticial Courts. - When general, less Exception by Particulars.

Sir Edw. Coke, concordat, for the Extent beyond the King's Time. That Parliaments have dealt heretofore with new Offices. - 21 Ed. III. a Patent made, for Alnaging and Measuring of Worstead, which spoiled by Opening; which, at the Parliament, declared to be void. -

13 H. IV. a new Grant, for Measuring Canvas; a small Fee : yet overthrown by the Judges; confirmed by Parliament. -

22 H. VI. a Prescription of an Office for Packing of Wools. -

. . Edw. IV. a Grant, for Survey of Victuals, void.

21 Edw. Mowle, a Broker, his Patent adjudged void. - When he Recorder, Tyler got a Patent for Survey of Vinegar: Adjudged void. -

For Courts of Justice, more dangerous to erect new Offices. - Like a Circle: Break a Part, all out of Joint. -

Custos Brevium Office not grantable to Two. -

A Resolution in Parliament, 13 H. IV. that a Fee cannot be set in a new Office, without an Act of Parliament.- -

That the King cannot grant a new Office, without a Fee: For then void. Then a Charge, without Profit. - Feareth, this Bill, as drawn, will include some, and exclude others, purposely. -

To have this extend before the King's Time, even to 1 Eliz. for Erection of new Offices in Courts of Justice. -

That the King cannot grant a new Office in Courts of Justice, with a Fee: For that void. -

To commit it; but not above 10 to be of the Committee ; and, if he One, will take special Care.

Mr. Solicitor: - That 40 Eliz. the Judges, in the several Courts, impanelled several Juries; who presented the Fees then anciently due.

Sir H. Anderson: - That this Law may extend to the Palatyne of Durham.

Sir Francis Fane: - That the Receivers, besides the Poundage, exact 3s. for an Acquittance.

Sir Edw. Gyles: - To take into Consideration the Fees of this House.

Sir Wm. Cope: - To provide against Exaction of Fees in Courts of corporate Towns.

Mr. Mynn: - To have Provision here for Lawyers Fees.

Mr. Wyld: - To have the Bill extend to Gaolers Fees; or a new to be made.

Mr. Alford: - Not to clog this Bill. - To have it extend to Westminster Hall Courts only; and to insert the Fees into -

Committed to Sir Edw. Coke, Master of the Wards, Mr. Alford, Mr. Noye, Sir H. Poole, Sir Edw. Gyles, Sir Francis Darcy, Sir Geor. Moore, Sir M. Fleetewood, Sir Rich. Tichborne, Sir Edw. Sands: All, that will come, to have Voice : - Monday next, Star-chamber : And the Committee to have Power to send to the Officers of the several Courts, to bring in their several Fees, in Writing.

Buying Offices.

Mr. Noye : - Nothing now so dear, in this cheap Time, as Officers : As dear now, as Benefices. - To make a Law against Buying and Selling of Offices, which bindeth them to be Extortioners. To lay a Penalty upon the Buyer, Seller, and Broker, of Offices Buying. - A Committee to draw this Bill. -

Sir Edw. Coke, Mr. Noye, Mr. Crew, Mr. Glanvyle, Mr. Solicitor, Mr. Hackwill, Mr. Recorder: - Saturday, in the Middle Temple Hall.

Quarrel between Members.

Lord Clifford remembereth an unhappy Accident between Two Members of the House, who both now absent.

Mr. Alford: - Hopeth they shall end this Controversy this Afternoon.

Jurisdiction of Parliament.

Sir Edw. Coke presenteth, from the Committee, a Direction in Writing, to Mr. Speaker, concerning the Answer to his Majesty about the -

Mr. Secretary: - That his Majesty hath made a Doubt of our Power in these Cases. That here we go about to justify our Power; which, doubteth, may draw a negative Answer from the King, and so bar us for ever. - To let that pass rather sub silentio.

Master of the Wards : - If we to deal only with the King, he so gracious, as nothing doubteth a good Answer from him. - Doubteth, this will be opposed. - That the Desiring the Confirmation of the Judgment, will draw the King, out of an equal Respect to the Lords, and us, to examine it.

House to sit.

Mr. Serjeant Crew and Mr. Serjeant Hitcham desire the Lords [a] will sit a while; because they intend they will shortly send us a Message, of great Importance.

Which yielded unto; but, with Intimation, that we are to attend his Majesty at Two .. Clock.

Jurisdiction of the House.

Sir D. Digges: - That no Cause for the Lords to except against our Proceedings herein; for the King might have done it of himself, without us.

Mr. Hackwill: - Against this Paper, as offered: For the Words, "that the Precedents of future Times shewed, that this did not bind," implieth, that we have Precedents to the contrary; which if we be put to prove, we cannot.

Sir Edw. Mountagew: - Our Intent, rather to insist upon the King's Grace, than upon our own Right. .

Sir Edw. Coke: - If this had been an Act of Parliament, it had taken away all Judicature : Where that clear, by Precedents 8o Eliz. - Fined, imprisoned, &c.

Judgment against Lord Chancellor Bacon.

Mr. J. Warberton and Mr. J. Chamberlayne bring from the Lords a Message: That they now ready to give Sentence against the late Chancellor, if this House, by their Speaker, will come up, and demand Judgment; Which desire to be done instantly.

Answered affirmatively.

Address to the King.

Upon Question, that, contained in the Paper read, the Substance of what Mr. Speaker is to speak to the King.