House of Commons Journal Volume 2: 29 June 1641

Pages 191-193

Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 2, 1640-1643. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1802.

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In this section

Die Martis, 29 Junii, 1641.

Copleye's Bill.

COMMITTEE for Copleye's Bill.

Leave of Absence.

Mr. Shugborough has Leave to go into the Country.

Liberation of a Prisoner.

That John Congrave, Servant to Sir Gerrard Napper Baronet, a Member of this House, shall be forthwith set at Liberty, being now restrained of his Liberty, in the Prison of Newgate; and this Order shall be a sufficient Warrant for the same.

Wales Court of Marches.

2da vice lecta est Billa, An Act concerning the exempting the Four Shires, viz. Hereford, &c. from the Jurisdiction of the Court of the President and Council of the Principality and Marches of Wales; and, upon Question, committed unto the Committee for the Council of the North, and Marches of Wales: And are to meet To-morrow, in the Star-chamber, at Two of Clock post meridiem.

Sir Robert Harley, Mr. Wheeler, Sir Henry Herbert, Mr. Tomkins, Mr. Ellis, Mr. Morgan, Mr. Pierpoint, Mr. Grimston, Mr. Vaughan, Mr. Moore, are added to this Committee.

Earl of Linsey's Fens.

Sir Guy Palmes reports the Cause concerning an Order made in the Lords House, between the Tenants and Assignees of the Earl of Linsey, concerning the Division of Acres in the Fen Grounds in Lincolnshire:

The Earl of Linsey was in Possession of Fourteen thousand Acres of Ground, in this Fen : There was an Order made in the Lords House, that the Earl of Linsey, and all claiming under him, should enjoy those Lands, till the High Court of Parliament did, by Order, hear the Cause there; or that they were otherwise ordered, in some other Court: The Committee, upon this, did conceive, that the Lords did appropriate, and assume to themselves, the sole Hearing of this Cause, excluding the Commons; whereas the Controversy concerning those Lands was, at that time when this Order was made, depending before the House of Commons. The Lords took notice of this Cause, upon a bare Complaint, without Transmission of this Cause; or without acquainting this House, by a Conference, with the same.

This Fourteen thousand Acres of Ground is Fen Land: and many thousand Persons have Interest in it: Several Suits in Law were depending before it came to Parliament.

The Commoners thought fitting to make their Redress to this House, being the Representative Body of the Commons. Therefore the Committee did vote Two Things, none dissenting:

1. That the said Order, made by the Lords 6to April', is a Breach of the Privilege of this House; and that the Commons are not bound by the said Order.

2. That a Conference be had with the Lords, touching the same.

Mr. Maynand, Mr. Ellis, Sir Edw. Ascough, Sir Guy Palmes, Sir Wm. Armyn, Sir Antho. Irby, Mr. Hide, Mr. Vaughan, Mr. Martin, Mr. Nath. Fines, are added to this Committee: And they are to consider of the Proceedings and Order made in the Lords House, in the Business depending between the Tenants and Assignees of the Earl of Linsey, and the Inhabitants and Commoners of the Fourteen thousand Acres, or upwards, lying between * * and Kyme; and likewise the Orders, made in the Lords House, concerning the Towns in Huntingtonshire: And all such Orders and Proceedings, wherein there shall appear any Breach of the Privileges of this House, are referred to this Committee: And they are to search Precedents; and to inquire after the Proceedings of former Times, in what manner they have been, upon all such and the like Causes: And they are also to consider of the Imprisonment of Thomas Abbott, Wm. Clay, Anthony, Richard, and William Roberts, imprisoned by an Order of the Lords; and to report the State of that Business to the House: And are to meet on Thursday next in the Afternoon at Two of Clock, in the Star-chamber: And have Power to send for Parties, Witnesses, Papers, Records, or any thing else, that may conduce to the Business.

Prisoner discharged.

Sir Wm. Saville, according to an Order Yesterday made, was brought to the Bar; and, there kneeling, Mr. Speaker acquainted him, that the House had given Judgment against him, upon a very great Misdemeanour: Yet, upon his Acknowledgment of the Justice of the House, and of his own Offence, they are pleased to discharge him from any further Imprisonment.

Provision of Monies.

3tia vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the speedy Provision of Monies for disbanding the Armies, and settling the Peace between the Two Kingdoms of England and Scotland; and, upon Question, passed; and sent up to the Lords by Mr. Hide.

King's Journey to Scotland.

A Message from the Lords, by Sir Edward Leech and Dr. Bennett;

The Lords desire a free Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, concerning the King's going into Scotland, presently, in the Painted Chamber, if it may stand with the Conveniency of this House.

Answer returned, by the same Messengers;

This House has taken into Consideration their Lordships Message; and will give a present Meeting, as is desired.

Mr. Treasurer, Mr. Pym, Mr. Hollis, Mr. Hampden, Sir Walter Erle, Mr. Martin, are appointed Reporters and Managers of this Conference.

Mr. Treasurer reports the Conference had with the Lords, concerning his Majesty's Journey into Scotland.

"Two Papers were read: Wherein the Scots assent to his Majesty's putting off his Journey yet for a time, though it be prejudicial unto them; but desire that his Majesty may be there in Person, on the Fifth of August."

"That we shall take all convenient Courses, so to order our Businesses, as to conform ourselves to the Time prefixed."

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House holds it fit, to move the Lords to join with this House, in petitioning his Majesty, that he would be pleased not to begin his Journey into Scotland from hence, till the Fourteenth of August.

And likewise to desire the Lords, to appoint the Lords Commissioners of England to acquaint the Commissioners of Scotland with this Resolution, that they may endeavour to accommodate their Businesses accordingly.

House to sit, &c.

That the House sit this Afternoon: And that the Two Bills concerning the Star-chamber and High Commission, be first made; and then the Report concerning the Judges.

Lord Mandeville.

That the Petition of the Lord Mandeville be referred to the Committee for the Queen's Jointure.

Post Meridiem.

Petition from Ireland.

ORDERED, That the Petition of the Inhabitants of the Birnes County, who has been preferred to this House, and cannot be proceeded in with effect, in regard of the great and many Businesses that this House is now engaged in, be recommended to the Parliament in Ireland; to be proceeded in there effectually, according as the Merits of the Cause shall require.

Smith's Cause.

Mr. Ellis reports the Cause of Mr. Smith:

Resolved, upon the Question, That Mr. Smith was illegally suspended by Dr. Lambe; and that Sir John Lambe ought to give him Reparation and Satisfaction for his Damage, sustained by that Suspension.

That the Transmission of this Cause be referred to the Committee where Mr. Bagshawe has the Chair.

Articles against Justice Bramston.

Mr. Hide reports the Articles against the Lord Chief Justice Bramston: The which Articles were first all read together; and then One by One; and all severally voted; and after, the Title was read, and voted; and then the Conclusion was read, and voted; and all, upon Question, ordered to be ingrossed.

Message to Lords.

Mr. Treasurer went up to the Lords with the Message, according to an Order in the Morning.


Mr. Prideaux reports the Bill concerning the Councilboard, and Star-chamber, returned from the Lords at a Conference, with some Additions, Provisoes, and Alterations; the which were here read, and afterwards committed.

Resolved, upon the Question, That these Words, "in any other Court or Courts whatsoever," shall be presented to the Lords, at a Conference.

In the Fifth Addition, and in the Fourth Line, after the Word "whatsoever," that the Clause there following may be omitted wholly; and this Clause added instead thereof; viz. "unless in such Causes, where, by the Statutes of this Realm, they have Power and Authority to commit, or imprison; and that, in the Warrant for such Commitment, Imprisonment, or Restraint, the true Cause thereof be so expressed, as the Courts, to which the same shall be returned, may well judge thereof."


Mr. Treasurer brings Answer, * * * *

King's Journey to Scotland.

A Message from the Lords, by J. Heath and Sir Robert Rich;

The Lords desire a present Conference, by the select Committee of this House, with the Committee of the Lords, concerning the King's Journey into Scotland, in the Painted Chamber, if it may stand with the Conveniency of this House.

Answer returned, by the same Messengers;

This House has taken their Lordships Message into Consideration; and will give a present Meeting, by the select Committee, as is desired.

High Commission Court.

Mr. Glyn reports the Bill concerning the High Commission, returned from the Lords, with some Amendments, Provisoes, and Additions: The which Amendments, Proviso, and Additions, after they had been twice read, were committed to a particular Committee.

By Resolution upon the Question, this Amendment of the Lords is assented unto; viz. that, instead of "hence-forth," forth," these Words shall be inserted; viz." after the First Day of August."

King's Journey to Scotland.

Mr. Pym reports from the Committee appointed to meet with the Committee of the Lords, concerning the Ten Propositions; that now they met concerning the First Proposition, touching the King's Journey into Scotland: That the Lords attended his Majesty with the Proposition of this House, concerning his Majesty's not beginning his Journey till the Tenth of August: The Scots Commissioners desire, that this House would express their Resolution in the Affirmative; and, by that Resolution, fix upon a certain Day, positively, in the Affirmative.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this Answer shall be returned to the Lords;

To desire their Lordships to join with this House, to petition his Majesty, that he will be pleased to stay his Journey into Scotland until the Tenth of August; and that, if then he shall please to take his Journey, this House shall submit unto it.

Star-chamber &c. Courts.

Ordered, That, To-morrow at Eight of the Clock, the House do take into Debate the Bills for the Star-chamber, and High Commission: And Mr. Speaker is to interrupt the House in any other Business, at any time.

Scandalous Ministers.

Ordered, That the Committee for scandalous Ministers be revived, to sit on Friday next at Two of the Clock, in the Court of Wards, as to the Business upon the Petition of Mr. Cradocke; which is referred to that Committee.