House of Commons Journal Volume 2: 27 January 1642

Pages 398-400

Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 2, 1640-1643. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1802.

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Die Jovis, 27 Januarii, 1641.

Thomson's Causes in Exchequer.

ORDERED, That the Court of Exchequer may proceed to the Hearing and Determining the several Causes, depending in that Court, wherein Doctor Thompson is Plaintiff, and Defendant; and settle the Possession as in Justice they shall think fit; notwithstanding any former Order of Restraint, or any other Matter, depending in this House.

Leave of Absence.

Mr. Jo. Arundell has Leave to go into the County.

Tonage and Poundage.

1a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the Granting of a Subsidy to the King of Tonage, and Poundage, and other Sums of Money, payable upon Merchandize exported and imported.

Information concerning Baker.

Ordered, That this Information, concerning Mr. Baker, be referred to the Committee for Informations: And that Mr. Grimston be added to that Committee: And that Mr. Baker be forthwith summoned to appear before that Committee: And that the Party that summons him do make Inquiry what Horses are now in his Stable.

Tendering the Oath.

Ordered, That the Burgesses of the several Cinque Ports and other Ports, shall be injoined by this House to take out the Commission for tendering the Oath of Allegiance and Supremacy.


Mr. Glyn, Sir Jo. Potts, Sir H. Vane, Sir Ro. Pye, Mr. Pury, Sir Gilb. Gerard, Mr. Noble, Mr. Bainton, Sir Tho. Barrington, Sir Ph. Stapilton;

This Committee is to compare this Declaration now presented, and the Declaration printed; and to fit this Declaration for a Preamble to that: And are to withdraw into the Court of Wards.

Ship with Ammunition, &c.

That the Consideration of the Ship, laden with Ammunition and Corn, from Berwick, shall be referred to the Committee for Irish Affairs.

Brooke's Trunks, &c.

Ordered, That it be referred to Mr. Whittacre, Sir Gilbert Gerard, Sir Jo. Francklyn, Sir Walth. Erle, or any Two of them, to search and make stay of the Trunks of Sir Basil Brooke; and to use their best Endeavour for the Apprehending of his Servant: And, being apprehended, that they shall examine him.

Naval Affairs.

Mr. Green reports, from the Committee of the Navy, the Offer that some Merchants made, of furnishing Five Ships, upon such Propositions as the Committee has already consented unto; and that they will desire them to put them in Writing between this and To-morrow.

Resolved, That this House holds it fit to accept and employ those Five Ships, already furnished and provided by the Merchants, upon such Terms as the Committee, appointed to treat with them, shall agree upon.

Resolved, That this House doth undertake to pay all such Sums of Monies as shall become due, for the Setting forth of Ships, upon such Terms as shall be agreed upon by the Committees of this House; and afterwards confirmed by this House.

The Merchants that made these acceptable Propositions were called in: And Mr. Speaker told them, in the Name of the House, that this Offer is a very worthy and acceptable Service to this House, and the Commonwealth; for which he was commanded to return them Thanks, in as ample and as hearty a Manner as possible he could.

Persons recommended by the King.

Mr. Pym reports, that his Majesty commanded the Lord Lieutenant to recommend unto this House Seven Persons for Employment in this Service, as Colonels; viz. Lord President of Munster, Lord President of Connaght, Sir Charles Vavasor, Colonel Wm. Vavasor, Colonel Rich. Fielding, Lieutenant Colonel Edw. Fielding, Sir Mich. Ernley.

Sir F. Fortescue.

The humble Petition of Sir Faithfull Fortescue, Knight, was this Day read: And

It is Ordered, That the said Sir Faithfull Fortescue be earnestly recommended to the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland, for a Colonel's Place, in this Service; this House being very well satisfied, that he is a Man of Honour and Experience, and worthy of such an Employment.

Persons recommended by the King.

Ordered, That the Committee for Irish Affairs do let the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland know, That Three of those Gentlemen, recommended by his Majesty, are already provided for: And that this House has a very good Opinion of Sir Mich. Ernle; and do recommend him unto his Lordship for an Employment: But as for the Two Colonel Fieldings, and Colonel Wm. Vavasor, they hold them Persons altogether unfit to be intrusted with any Employment.

Message to Lords.

Sir Sam. Ofeild went up this Day, with the Message appointed Yesterday, to the Lords.

Killinghall's Petition.

The humble Petition of Ralph Killinghall Gentleman, presented to the King's Most Excellent Majesty, and by his Majesty referred to the House of Commons, December 16 to, 1641, was this Day read: And

It is Ordered, That this Petition, and the Petitioner, be referred to the Committee for Irish Affairs.

Clotworthy's Appointment.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House holds it fit, that Sir Jo. Clotworthy (as his Father before had) shall have the Command of the Bark, and the Boats, to be provided for the Defence and Safety of the Lough, in Ireland, called Lough Neagh, alias Lough Sydney; and that he shall have the like Wages as his Father had: And he is to build the Hulls of the Bark, and the Boats; and to maintain them at his own Charge: But he is to have so much Monies presently allowed him, as shall be necessary for their Rigging, according to the Note agreed upon by the Committee for Irish Affairs.

Sir Jo. Clotworthy is to have, for this Service, as Captain of the Bark and Boats, the Allowance of Fifteen Shillings per Diem. His Lieutenant, Four Shillings per Diem. The Master, Four Shillings per Diem. Master's Mate, Two Shillings per Diem. Master Gunner, One Shilling Sixpence per Diem. Two Gunners, Twelvepence apiece per Diem. Forty common Men, Eightpence apiece per Diem.

Answer from Lords.

Sir Sam. Owfeild brings Answer, That the Lords will be presently ready to take the Examinations, concerning the Twelve Bishops; and have Ordered, That the Bishop of London, and the Earl of Dover, shall be examined; and that the Restraint of Mr. Oneile should be taken off: And that they will give a present Meeting, at a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, in the Painted Chamber, touching the Scotts Propositions and the Affairs of Ireland.

Scotch Propositions.

A Message from the Lords, by Serjeant Whitfield and Serjeant Finch;

That the Lords have sent unto this House a Copy of the Scotts Propositions, concerning Knockfergus, and his Majesty's Answer unto it.


The House went up to the Conference.

Mr. Hampden, Mr. Fines, Sir Ph. Stapilton, and Sir Jo. Clotworthy, are appointed Managers.

King's Answer to Scotch Propositions.

At the Court at Windesore, 26° Januarii, 1641.

HIS Majesty, having perused and considered these Eight Propositions, presented by the Scotts Commissioners, doth willingly consent to them all, except only the Third, which his Majesty doth not approve of; and wisheth the Houses to take that Article again into Consideration, as a Business of very great Importance; which His Majesty doubts may be prejudical to the Crown of England, and the Service intended: And, if the Houses desire it, His Majesty shall not be unwilling to speak with the Scotts Commissioners, to see what Satisfaction he can give them therein.

Edw. Nicholas.

King's Answer to Petition.

Mr. Pierrepoint reports, from the Committee appointed to attend his Majesty, That the whole Committee attended his Majesty: That the Petition was read, according to the Commands of this House: Which, when it was read, his Majesty's Answer was in these Words: That his Majesty would give as speedy an Answer as he could.

Arms, &c.

Ordered, That the Threescore and Nine Barrels of Powder, and One hundred Musquets, and One hundred Carabines, with their Furniture, now aboard the Ship of Abraham White, that came from Berwick, shall be delivered by the said Master to Maurice Thompson and Wm. Benoir; who have contracted with this House to set forth presently Five Ships, for the Service of Ireland: And this House does intend and resolve to deduct so much out of their Freight, as the Value of the Powder, Musquets, Carabines, and Furniture, shall amount unto, to make full Satisfaction for them unto his Majesty, according to the King's usual Rate.

Members to keep their Seats, &c.

Ordered, That every Member of the House be enjoined to keep his Seat: And that they do not speak to the Messengers either coming in or going out.

Message from Lords.

A Message from the Lords, by Serjeant Whitfield and * *.

1. The Lords have commanded us to read unto you a Vote, that passed in their House; which they desire this House would join with their Lordships in.

2. That they have nominated a Committee of Seventeen of their House; and desire that this House would likewise nominate a Committee of a proportionable Number; which they desire may meet To-morrow, at Eight of Clock, in the Painted Chamber: The Power of the Committee they have likewise sent down.

3. They have likewise sent the Queen's Answer to the Message sent unto her Majesty, from both Houses, by the Earl of Newport.

4. That they had asked the Lord Cravon some Questions, according to the Desires of this House: And that he had returned his Answer in Writing.

King's Answer to Scotch Propositions.

.... "Resolved, upon the Question, That those Persons, who gave the King the Advice to give the Answer, which he hath sent to the Third Proposition of the Scotts Commissioners, concerning Carrickfergus, are hereby declared to be Enemies to the King, and both Kingdoms of England and Ireland."

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House doth consent with the Lords in this Vote.

"2. The Power of the Committee is to consider of the King's Answer to the Third Proposition of the Scotts Commissioners, concerning Carrickfergus, and what is fit to be done thereupon: And likewise to use all fit Means to make a Discovery of the Persons who advised the Giving of that Answer."

Resolved, That a Committee of a Proportionable Number shall be appointed, to meet with the Committee of the Lords To-morrow, at Eight of Clock; And to have the like Power as the Lords Committee has.

Queen's Answer to Message.

"3. The Queen, having received a Message from both Houses of Parliament, by the Earl of Newport and the Lord Seymour, intimating unto her, that she had been told, that the House of Commons had an Intention to accuse her of High Treason, and that Articles to that Purpose had been shewn unto her, returns this Answer: That there was a general Report of an Accusation intended against her; but she never saw any Articles in Writing; and, having no certain Author, either for the one, or the other, she gave little Credit thereunto; and much less now, being assured from the House of Commons, that never any such Thing came into their Thoughts: Nor will she believe they would lay an Aspersion upon her, who hath been very unapt, so far, to misconstrue the Actions of any one Person, and much more the Proceedings of Parliament; and shall, at all times, wish a happy Understanding between the King and his People."

"4. Upon better Recollection of myself, I do confess and acknowledge to have been mistaken, in reporting what was delivered me upon Discourse from some Member of the House of Commons; and am most heartily sorry for it; beseeching, with all Humility, the Pardon of the honourable House of Commons, for that my great Mistake."

King's Answer to Scotch Propositions.

Mr. Glyn, Mr. Hollys, Sir Edw. Hungerford, Sir Ph. Stapilton, Mr. Long, Sir Sam. Rolle, Mr. Pierrepoint, Sir H. Vane, Mr. Pym, Sir Jo. Evelyn, Mr. Grimston, Serjeant Wilde, Sir Walth. Erle, Mr. Whittlock, Mr. Cary, Mr. Fines, Mr. Arth. Goodwyn, Mr. Maynard, Mr. Hampden, Mr. Crue, Mr. Reynolds, Sir Ralph Hopton, Sir Tho. Barrington, Mr. Cage, Sir Ben. Rudyard, Sir Wm. Lewis, Sir H. Hayman, Sir Jo. Hotham, Mr. Selden, Mr. Bellassis, Mr. Martin, Sir Jo. Potts, Lord Buckhurst, Mr. Strode, Sir Rich. Onslowe;

This Committee is appointed to meet with the Committee of the Lords, To-morrow Morning at Eight of Clock, in the Painted Chamber: And have Power to consider of the King's Answer to the Third Proposition of the Scotts Commissioners, concerning Carrickfergus; and what is fit to be done thereupon; and likewise to use all fit Means to make a Discovery of the Persons who advised the Giving of that Answer.

Answer returned by the same Messengers: That this House has fully agreed with the Lords in their Vote, touching those that advised his Majesty to give that Answer to the Third Proposition of the Scotts, Commissioners.

They have likewise appointed a Committee of a Proportionable Number to meet with the Committee of the Lords, To-morrow Morning, as is desired.

Proceedings against Duke of Richmond.

This Copy following was brought in by a Member of this House, and avowed by the said Member to agree with the Record in the Lords House, and to be taken out of their Journal.

"Lord Admiral, Lord Chamberlain, E. Bedford, E. Pembrooke, E. Suff', E. Lincoln, E. Holland, E. Leicester, E. Warwick, E. Bolingbrooke, E. Stamford, Visc. Conway, Lord Chandos, Lord Roberts, Lord Brooke, Lord Hunsden, Lord Pagett, Lord St. John de Blettso, Lord Wharton, Lord Howard de Escrig, Lord Spencer, Lord Willoughby de Par', Lord Kymbolton, Lord Grey d' Werke."

"That, in respect the Words spoken by the Duke of Richmond, which were these, "Let us put the Question, whether we shall adjourn for Six Months," tending much to the Prejudice of the King and Kingdom; I do protest against the Vote as not a sufficient Punishment for Words of that dangerous Consequence."

The House fell into a great and weighty Debate of these Words spoken by the Duke of Richmond, and the Consequences thereof.

Upon the Putting the Question, whether this House hath sufficient Cause to accuse the Duke of Richmond to be one of the malignant Party, and an ill Counsellor unto his Majesty;

The House was divided.
Mr. Hollis, Tellers for the Yea, 223.
Sir Philip Stapilton,
Mr. Chancellor of Ex-chequer, Tellers for the Noe, 123.
Mr. Price,

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House hath sufficient Cause to accuse the Duke of Richmond to be one of the malignant Party, and an ill Counsellor unto his Majesty.