Journal of the House of Lords: Volume 16, 1696-1701. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1767-1830.
This free content was digitised by double rekeying. All rights reserved.
DIE Veneris, 15 Januarii.
Hodie 2a lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act for enabling Oliver Neve, of Great Witchingham, in the County of Norfolke, Esquire, to sell Two Houses in London; and for vesting other Lands in the said County, of greater Value, to the same Uses."
Lady Mary Fenwick's Papers:
Letter from her to the Dutchess of Norfolke;
"I designed to have waited of your Grace; but am so ill with a violent Cold, I am not able. If your Grace comes this Way To-day, I beg you'll call here; I shall be at Home. My Lady Carlisle is very ill; I fear her much. If I can't see your Grace To-day, I beg this may assure my Lord and my Lady Peterborow, that what my Lord Monmouth says of Sir John, informing of him, is as false as GOD is true; that he never named him, nor thought of him; and his being so positive in it hurts himself more than I hope he can hurt Sir John by saying it. Lies does not trouble one; but the Respect I have to your Family makes me desirous to satisfy your Grace; and to beg you'll present my humble Service to my Lady Peterborow, and assure her, I grieved I did not see her when she was here, which I did not know till she was gone: I had waited upon her, if my great Misfortunes and ill Health did not hinder; for I am, with all Sincerity, hers and
Lady Mary Fenwick's Examination.
"The Lady Mary Fenwick, being sworn, and asked concerning the whole Matter of the Papers delivered in by her when she was last here; faith, "That, at the Time Sir John Fenwick was before the Commons, the Dutchess of Norfolke sent for her, saying, "She had somewhat to say to her, which much concerned Sir John Fenwick." She the Lady Mary Fenwick, being not well, sent her Cousin Lawson to the Dutchess of Norfolke; who brought her Word, the Dutchess told her, "There had been a great Lord (who was a Privy Counsellor) with her a great while that Day, who told her, "That, if she the said Lady Mary Fenwick desired to save Sir John's Life and Honour, he would put her in a Way of doing it." She returning with this to her, she sent her back again to my Lady Dutchess, to assure that Lord, "There was nothing in the World she desired so much as to know the Way of doing it." My Lady Dutchess told her, "That Lord would be with her in Half an Hour, and she would tell him what I desired;" which was, to know the Way of doing it. The next Morning, she the Lady Mary Fenwick sent Mrs. Lawson, to know what Answer the Lord had given. She said, "He would send it in Writing; and that, if Sir John took that Method, the Bill should certainly not be carried against him; and if he did not, it should certainly be carried against him, for he had the Power of doing it." Soon after, the Dutchess of Norfolke brought her a Paper from my Lord Monmouth, as she told her; and said, "She must have it copied immediately, for she must carry it back again with her." She the said Lady Mary Fenwick was then sick in Bed, and not able to do it herself; so called one Dame into the Room, whose Name is Symmons: My Lady Dutchess gave her the Paper, to copy quickly; and her Grace sat by my Bed-side till it was done. She took it from her, and left the Copy; which is One of the Papers given in here by me.
My Lady Dutchess told me, "That the Lord desired her to go to Counsel with that Paper, to know at what Part of Sir John's Trial it was best to bring it in ?" After my Lady Dutchess was gone, and she the Lady Fenwick had considered that in that Paper there were Things not proper for the Counsel's Advice, nor could she be sure what was there proposed would be performed; Mrs. Lawson went again to the Dutchess of Norfolke, to desire her to know of this Lord, "how she might be sure all those Things might be done; and to have it in short, what was proper to give the Counsel." While Mrs. Lawson was with my Lady Dutchess, Word was brought, my Lord Monmouth was coming into the Room. My Lady Dutchess knowing my Lord cared not to see her, nor the caring to be seen, she put her out at another Door, that she might not meet him. My Lady Dutchess then asked his Lordship all those Questions she the Lady Mary Fenwick had desired, and took his Directions for that short Paper she gave into the House. He said, "That Captain Smith should be produced, and those original Letters which he had seen, and which he intimated were in his Power; but Captain Smith must produce them." He said also, "The King had used Sir John Fenwick basely, by exposing that Paper to the House; for, by the ALMIGHTY GOD, the King knew it before, and that it was true; for he himself had acquainted Him with many Things of that Nature." He the Lord Monmouth said, "The King was the worst of Men, and had used him ill; that, if Sir John Fenwick did not do this that he desired him, he would do it at some Time himself, which was the Reason he would have this Bill." She the Lady Mary Fenwick desiring to know, "If this Bill were thrown out, whether he the said Sir John Fenwick might not be returned to The Old Bayly again?" His Lordship bid my Lady Dutchess tell me, "That he had as much Power there as here; for he often conversed with those People that were of Juries, and he would secure me he should be cleared there." Mrs. Lawson returned with this Answer to me; and while she was giving me the Account, my Lord Carlisle came in; and I desired him, being (fn. 1) by myself, to set down those Instructions she had from my Lady Dutchess; which is the short Paper which is in this House, and which I was to carry to the Counsel. Mrs. Symons copied that Paper the next Morning; and that which my Lord Carlisle writ I burnt. My Lady Dutchess came to me that Morning, and repeated all she had said to Mrs. Lawson, which my Lord Monmouth had told her. I then went to Counsel with that Paper; who told me, "It was not practicable in the House of Commons; but it must, if ever done, be in the House of Lords." I sent, or told my Lady Dutchess, (I know not whether) what the Counsel said. And I had after wards this Paper (now offered and read), which she said my Lord Monmouth dictated to her; (videlicet,) "The Party is of Opinion, with the Counsel, that Sir John must never speak, not only till the House has assured his own Words shall not hurt himself; but till he has the Promise of the House likewise, that they will warmly assist him in what shall be necessary towards discovering the Truth."
"My Lady Dutchess brought me another Paper, which is in this House in the Hand it was given me by her Grace. That I then desired her Grace to know of this Lord, "How I should be sure of those original Letters he spoke of, and of that Captain; and that he himself would give Sir John Fenwick Leave to call on him, as he did on those other Lords he directed him; and that he would justify all this himself." I did not think it reasonable to propose it to Sir John, except I was sure of all this from his Lordship. In this Time I would have spoke to his Lordship myself; and writ a Letter for that Leave to my Lady Dutchess, when I knew he was with her. He refused to speak to me, but said, "He would with Sir Thomas Powys, or any of Sir John's Counsel; and that he would meet Sir Thomas Powys that Afternoon, at my Lady Dutchess's, at what Time Sir Thomas Powys would appoint." I writ to Sir Thomas Powys; and my Lady Dutchess sent it to him by Mr. Welborne; but Sir Thomas Powys excused it, and would not go. His Lordship bid my Lady Dutchess tell me, "He had been looking the Night before for Captain Smith till Two o'Clock in the Morning; but that he had changed his Lodgings, and he believed the Court had put him out of the Way; but he knew one Mrs. Mortimer, that should find him out before Sir William Parkyns was executed." Captain Smith's Lodgings were searched, for these Papers; but he had removed them to Mrs. Mortimer's. My Lady Dutchess told me, "My Lord Monmouth said, "He had been with the King, since this Business of Sir John Fenwick's; that he had told the King, he thought He had hurt Himself and His Friends by exposing that Paper; and that the King seemed to be concerned He had done so." All this while he was very earnest, and came or sent Twice a Day to my Lady Dutchess. In Answer to my Desire to have his Leave to be called, he said, "He could do Sir John more Service without being named; that he was sure those Lords, when called, would own what was so true, which both the King and they knew long before Sir John's Paper." I pressed still to be sure of the Captain and those Letters; but, having no other Assurances than barely these Messages, I sending still to my Lady Dutchess, she sent me Word, "She had not seen my Lord in Three Days; and when she sent to him, he had not come to her." And hearing that he declared himself violent against Sir John; and "that he would crack his Lungs but he would have the Bill carried; not that he believed Sir John deserved it, but for other Reasons he had to have the Bill:" I, finding this, and having no other Assurances than above expressed, desired my Lord Carlisle to carry a Letter to my Lord Monmouth from me, to know why he did this. But my Lord Carlisle advised me to let it alone, and see what he would do in the House of Lords."
7 Januarii, 1696. Mrs. Lawson's Examination;
"Mrs. Elizabeth Lawson, being sworn, and acquainted, "That the House hath had an Account of several Transactions that passed between the Dutchess of Norfolke and the Lady Mary Fenwick, and of several Papers which she is supposed to know somewhat of, that passed between them, relating to Sir John Fenwick:"
"She saith, I was one Day with the Lady Mary Fenwick, when the Dutchess of Norfolke sent to her to come to her, that she might speak with her in a Business that was of great Consequence to Sir John Fenwick; my Lady Dutchess making Excuse "that she was ill of a Cold, and could not go to her:" And my Lady Mary Fenwick, being then ill of a Fever, and in Bed, sent me to the Dutchess of Norfolke, to know what this Business of great Consequence was. When I came to the Dutchess of Norfolke, she was shy of telling me the Business, saying, "She had Direction to tell it only to the Lady Mary Fenwick herself:" Bur, when I had told her how impossible it was for the Lady Mary Fenwick to come to her, she told me, "There had been that Morning with her a Lord, who had proposed to her, that, if Sir John Fenwick would follow the Method he should direct him, he should certainly save both his Life and Honour." I went back to my Lady Mary Fenwick, and told her this from the Dutchess of Norfolke; who sent me back to the Dutchess of Norfolke, to desire her to tell that Lord, whoever he was, "That, as soon as she was satisfied that Proposition would save Sir John Fenwick's Life and Honour, she would contribute to it all that was in her Power." The Dutchess of Norfolke told me, "She expected that Lord in Half an an Hour; and that my Lady Mary Fenwick should have his Answer the next Day." I went back immediately, and told this to my Lady; and the next Day went again to the Dutchess, to know this Answer. The Dutchess told me, "That the Lord said, he would give his Directions in Writing." Being One Night with the Dutchess, when her Servants brought Word "the Earl of Monmouth was coming to see her;" my Lady Dutchess told me, "She believed he would not like to meet me there." And I told her, "I desired not to meet him there." Upon which, I went out at another Door, where I stayed for an Answer of what I had come about; and there I heard my Lady Dutchess and my Lord Monmouth discourse of this Matter. After my Lord had asked my Lady Dutchess about what she had told my Lady Mary Fenwick; I heard my Lord Monmouth say, "Unless there was a Fate upon Sir John Fenwick, and unless he was a Madman, he would not refuse to follow the Directions he had sent him; that he would certainly save his Life and Honour by it; and if Sir John Fenwick would follow these Directions, the Bill that was in the House of Commons would certainly be thrown out; but otherwise would as certainly pass against him." My Lady Dutchess having told me this; I had before desired her to ask my Lord, "That, if this Bill were thrown out there, if Sir John Fenwick was not in Danger of being tried at Common Law?" I heard her ask my Lord this Question. And he answered, "It was no Matter whether he was or no; for he would answer for his Life there, as well as in the other Place; for he had an Interest in those Sort of People." He said likewise, "That the King had used Sir John Fenwick basely, by sending his Papers to the Parliament as false and scandalous, when, by the Almighty God, He knew it all before to be true." He spoke of Ways how this was to be demonstrated in the House; and desired "the Duke of Norfolke might be called on, to tell what Captain Smith had told him of a Correspondence held here with King James by some great Men in this Government, and if his Grace had not acquainted the King with this; and that Captain Smith might be examined, what he knew of it, and of some original Letters which he had shewed or told his Lordship of, then in his Hands." He desired "Sir John Fenwick would call on my Lord Rumney and my Lord Portland, that they would be pleased to say, on Honour, what they knew of Letters of this Correspondence, intercepted and brought to the King; and likewise that the House would humbly address to the King, that He would be pleased to lay before them the Letters He had of this Correspondence." And, to demonstrate the Truth of this, he said, "The Lord Godolphin had carried to the King a Present and a Letter, which he sent to the Queen in France. "This was, to demonstrate that this Correspondence was held with the King's Knowledge of it."
"Mrs. Lawson being called in again, and that Part of her Deposition being read to her which relates to what the Earl of Monmouth said concerning the King; and being asked, "Whether, when she came into the Room after his Lordship went out, she repeated that Part to the Dutchess of Norfolke?" Saith, "I remember not whether I repeated it to her Grace that Night; I cannot be positive. But we have spoke of it together since; and I remember, before I heard my Lord Monmouth speak it, the Dutchess of Norfolke spoke something of it to the Lady Mary Fenwick before me."
Dutchess of Norfolk's Examination;
"Mary Dutchess of Norfolke, being sworn, and shewed the Three Papers delivered in formerly by the Lady Mary Fenwick; and being desired "to give an Account of the said Papers, and of the whole Matter relating to them;" faith, "I am not the wiser for seeing these Papers; for, when they were delivered to me, they were writ in such a Hand, (I told my Lord Monmouth) I could not read them." She faith, "They came not to me all at once, but at several Times." Saith, "It's impossible to give an Account of all the Transaction." Saith, "I never had any Papers but from my Lord Monmouth, which I dispatched away by his Order to my Lady Mary Fenwick as soon as I could go or send to her. The Papers were delivered me at the Times my Lord Monmouth brought me them; but I remember not the Days whereon they were so brought; but when my Lord Monmouth brought those Papers, he told me, "It was with a Design to save Sir John Fenwick's Life and Honour:" But I did not understand his Methods; but did desire my Lord "I might have them in Writing, because of the Badness of my Memory." My Lord the next Day gave them into my own Hand. I was to have had them the Night before; but my Lord made an Excuse to me, "that he could not meet with the Person that was to write them." The Dutchess of Norfolke faith, "That I not being well, and the Lady Mary Fenwick sending Mrs. Lawson to me, she was with me when my Servants gave me Notice of my Lord Monmouth's coming to me; and I saying to her, "that my Lord would not care to see her," and she, being undressed, desired not to see my Lord, but went out at a Door my Lord was not to come in at. I remember I went the next Day to my Lady Mary Fenwick, and acquainted her with it. My Lord was willing and desirous to speak with Sir Thomas Powys; and he was sent to, not in my Lord Monmouth's Name, but in the Name of a Lord who was a Privy Counsellor. But Sir Thomas Powys refused, saying, "That he had promised to plead for his Client; but not to be his Adviser, or concerned in such a ticklish Matter;" or Words to that Effect. She faith, "My Lord Monmouth would have been willing to have spoke with Sir Bartholomew Shore." She faith, "Sir Thomas Powys knew nothing of the Matter he was sent for." She faith, "That, for Three Weeks together, my Lord was sometimes Twice a Day with her; and my Lord seemed to compassionate Sir John, and to think he was hardly used every where: He thought he was hardly used in the House of Commons; and if he would be advised by him, he would put him in a Way to save his Life and Honour; and if he were turned to the Common Law, he might assist him there: If he would follow his Advice, he would endeavour to bring him off; but if he did not, he would certainly suffer." I asked him, "If, it being his Opinion that he was hardly used, and not lying and scandalous, why he would be against him?" He said, "He had his own Reasons for that." I heard my Lord Monmouth say, "The King had, to his Knowledge, been acquainted with all this Matter before." He said, "Several Lords of this House knew the same."
"She faith, "My Lord Monmouth never had any Discourse with her relating to Sir John Fenwick's Trial, till after she had sent him my Lady Mary Fenwick's Letter." She faith, "I understood my Lord Monmouth believed those Papers Sir John Fenwick had given the King to be true; and that my Lord Monmouth's Discourse was only relating to Sir John Fenwick's Confession, believing the Papers to be true." Saith, "I sent Mr. Jones to Sir Bartholomew Shore, to speak with my Lord Monmouth; and he delivered the Message to Sir Bartholomew; but Mr. Jones, falling sick, never returned me Sir Bartholomew's Answer till within these Two or Three Days. I desired my Lord to speak to my Lady Mary Fenwick; but that I could not bring about. His Lordship was willing to speak with Sir John's Counsel; which I desired, to the End I might be rid of this Business, knowing myself uncapable to manage it. When my Lord Monmouth gave me the Papers I sent or carried to my Lady Mary Fenwick, they were so ill writ, I could not read them; but believe my Lord read over some Part of them to me." She faith, "Mrs. Lawson stayed till after my Lord Monmouth was gone, and told me, "She had heard what my Lord had said." And Mrs. Lawson hath since told me, "That she going straight to my Lady Mary Fenwick, and the Lord Carlisle being then there, his Lordship writ down what she said;" and Mrs. Lawson so punctually repeated to me what my Lord Monmouth had said, that she must have heard him speak it." The Paper given in this Day by the Lady Mary Fenwick being shewed her Grace; she said, "It was her own Writing, and was a Copy of what my Lord Monmouth had first writ; and was transcribed by her, and sent to my said Lady Mary."
"Saith, "Being asked formerly, whether I knew Mrs. Symmons, and not then remembering her; I since have understood, that the Person whom my Lady Mary Fenwick employed to transcribe the Paper I carried her, and called Dame, is Mrs. Symons."
"The Dutchess of Norfolke being called in again; and that Part of her Grace's Deposition being read which relates to what the Earl of Monmouth said concerning the King; was asked, "Whether that was all she heard his Lordship say, relating to His Majesty, in this Matter?" Answered, "My Lord Monmouth seemed to blame the King; and thought His Majesty had done hardly by Sir John Fenwick, in exposing his Papers." My Lord expressed himself with a little Heat, as if it had been unjust; but I remember not the particular Expressions, but my Lord spoke in a little Passion. I found his Lordship concerned, when he heard he was named in Sir John Fenwick's Papers, saying, "He was not acquainted with him."
Mrs. Symons's Examination;
"Mrs. Margaret Symons, being sworn, and shewn the Three Papers formerly delivered in by the Lady Mary Fenwick, and asked, "Whether she knew them ?" Saith, "Two of the Papers now shewed her are her Hand-writing; One of them she writ from a Paper, the other from my Lady Mary Fenwick, who had a Paper in her Hand; but whether the read out of that Paper, she knows not. She returned the Original of the Paper she copied to the Dutchess of Norfolke, and believes she copied it true; the Paper she copied from the Original, she observes to be marked (N° 2.); and the Paper she copied from my Lady Mary Fenwick, she observes to be marked (N° 1.).
"She being shewed another Paper, sent by the Dutchess of Norfolke to the Lady Mary Fenwick, and asked, "Whether she knows the Hand?" Saith, "She thinks she saw this Paper before; and that my Lady Mary Fenwick told her, it was of the Dutchess of Norfolk's Writing." Saith, "The Paper she carried, was not the same Hand-writing, but a much smaller Hand."
"John Robins Esquire, sworn, being asked, "Whether there was a Report about the Town, that the Earl of Monmouth was in the Information Sir John Fenwick had made ?" Saith, "I did acquaint my Lord Monmouth, that it was the public Discourse of the Town, That his Lordship was in the Information given by Sir John Fenwick."
"Being asked, "Whether my Lord desired him to inform himself how that Report arose?" He faith, "He did ; and it was on a Saturday, about the latter End of September, he did so; and, I think, on the Monday after, in the Morning, I told his Lordship, "That I was informed by Mr. Symon Harcourt, of the Crown-office, "That Sir John Fenwick had given a List of Names, and his Lordship's Name among the rest." I asking him, "How he came to the Knowledge of this?" He said, "He had it from a Person who had it directly from the Lady Mary Fenwick." I spoke Once to my Lord Monmouth of it at his own House; another Time at Mr. Secretary Trumbull's, who was then in the Room. My Lord sent for me from a Coffee-house to Mr. Secretary Trumbull's, which was the Occasion of my speaking of it there."
"Mr. Mathew Smith, being sworn, is asked, "Whether he did bring any Informations relating to public Affairs to my Lord Monmouth; if he did so, at what Time he did it; and what my Lord Monmouth did thereupon ?" He faith, "That what I brought to my Lord Monmouth, I brought it to him as a Lord of the Bed-chamber then in Waiting." He faith, "It was so far an Account of my Services to the Crown, that I desired the King might be sensible of them, that I might be considered and rewarded for them; and those Accounts I gave in, because I was ready to justify them. I gave my Lord this Account some few Days before the King went to Flanders this last Time. My Lord Monmouth said, "As soon as he had an Opportunity, he would make it known to the King;" but the King was then in an Hurry, going for Flanders. As soon as my Lord came back from waiting on the King to the Sea Coast, my Lord Monmouth did me Honour and Justice, to carry me to Mr. Secretary Trumbull, to lay before him my Correspondence, with the Letters and Answers, which were a Demonstration of my Service." Saith, "I was altogether a Stranger to my Lord Monmouth till that Time." Saith, "I was for Fifteen Months in a Correspondence with a Minister of State, before I acquainted my Lord Monmouth with this: This Minister was the Duke of Shrewsbury." Saith, "That, after the Discovery of the late horrid Plot, I thought it my Duty to let the Duke of Norfolke see Two Letters relating to my Service to the Government; this was while I was in Expectancy to be rewarded." Saith, "My Lord Monmouth and Mr. Secretary Trumbull many Times advised me "to desist from interfering in this Matter, but to rest contented till the King's Return;" which I accordingly have done."
"Being asked, "Whether, some little Time after the King's Return, the King spoke to him in relation to the Dutchess of Norfolke; and what Advice the Earl of Monmouth gave concerning the Dutchess of Norfolke, as to these Affairs?"
"As to the very Time, I cannot well remember; but my Lord Monmouth told me something in relation to the Dutchess of Norfolke; and advised me not to have to do with her Grace, but to keep Matters to myself; that is, in relation to my Correspondency."
"Answer, "My Discourse with Jermy was: He asked me, "How I went on with my Affairs with the Duke of Shrewsbury?" I said, "I would not proceed in public Business; I did not intend to make any Bustle in that Matter, to lay forth my Service in public."
"Being asked, "Upon what Occasion he gave my Lord Monmouth an Account of his Discourse with Mr. Jermy, and what Jermy said to him?" He saith, "I told it my Lord Monmouth, because his Lordship should hear what People said in relation to my Correspondence last Year with the Duke of Shrewsbury." Mr. Jermie said, "This is a good Time for your Appearance, by reason Sir John Fenwick hath named his Grace's Name." I replied, "I did not trouble myself with public Concerns;" or to that Effect. This might be about a Month or Six Weeks since."
"He's asked, "Whether, during the Fifteen Months Correspondency which he saith he had with the Duke of Shrewsbury, he was not referred to an Under Secretary in that Office?" He saith, "That, about January last, my Lord Duke writ Three Letters almost in Ten Days Time; in One of them he excuses himself for his Indisposition; "but, if the Matters were of great Concern, and required Haste, he desired to communicate it to Mr. Vernon, his Chief Clerk, for whose Secrecy and Fidelity he would be answerable; and that, if I consented to talk with him, he desired to have my Answer the next Day, in a Letter by my Servant." And accordingly I returned Answer, "I was willing to comply, to meet with Mr. Vernon, on his Grace's Assurance of Secrecy." My Lord returned Answer, "He did not understand, by my Letter, that I was willing; but, if (fn. 2) I was so, to return him Answer the next Day, by Eight or Nine a Clock." I returned Answer, "I was willing; and sorry his Grace apprehended not so much by my last Letter." My Servant brought me another Letter from his Grace; which was, "that Mr. Vernon lived in Frith Street, in Sohoe."
"Being asked, "Whether, in Pursuance of this, he afterwards conversed with Mr. Vernon in this Matter?" He saith, "Very often; and when I writ Letters to the Duke of Shrewsbury, Mr. Vernon always took Care to deliver them, and to give me Answer in his the said Mr. Vernon's own Hand-writing."
"Being asked, "Whether he knows of any original Letters or Papers relating to any Correspondence between the late King James; and if he doth, from whom, and where the same are?" He saith, "He never had any original Letters from King James. As to the Designs of France for this Year, I had a Copy of a Letter from Mr. John Hewet, a Person who tells me he's employed in receiving and delivering Letters that are brought from France; and I have given a Copy of that Letter to the Secretary of State." Saith, "I have no Letters relating to any Correspondence; nor do I know of any: I know of no Letters directed to any Person."
"Being asked, "If he knows of any Correspondence that is, or hath been, between King James and any Persons that are, or have been, in this Government?" He saith, "He knows of none; he can name no particular Persons."
"Being asked, "Whether he knows of any original Letters of the Duke of Shrewsbury, and to what they relate?" Saith, "He knows of none but what the Duke hath writ to him as he hath had Occasion to communicate Business."
"Being asked, "Whether he ever heard, that Admiral Russell's Name was in that Paper?" Saith, "He hath heard so; and when he did hear so, I answered, "I believed Mr. Russell was perfectly in the King's Interest;" and he now declares he can say nothing against him."
"Being asked, "Whether he knows any Thing of my Lord Duke Shrewsbury?" He saith, "All he knows of the Duke of Shrewsbury, is what relates to my own Correspondence, to which I refer. I heard my Lord Duke Shrewsbury was in Sir John Fenwick's Papers; but I can make out nothing of that."
"Being asked, "Whether he knows of any Correspondence held between the late King James, or any of the King's Enemies whatever, and the Duke of Shrewsbury?" He saith, "He knows of none; but refers to Papers: Knows nothing of the Duke of Shrewsbury of his own Knowledge, but Ingratitude, in not recompensing him for his Service in being the principal Discoverer of the Plot."
"Being asked, "Whether he ever had any Direction or Intimation from any Person, that he should be examined as to what he had said to the Duke of Norfolke, touching the Correspondence between King James and the great Men of this Government ?" He saith, "He hath had no Intimation or Direction; and was surprized at his being summoned ?"
Dutchess of Norfolk's Letter to Lord Keeper:
"Mr. Mathew Smith, sworn, being asked, "Whether the Papers he hath delivered into this House, purporting to be Copies of Letters directed to the Duke of Shrewsbury or Mr. Vernon, be true Copies of such Letters?"
"He saith, "They are Copies of such Letters; but may vary in some Words, but not in Substance." He saith, "When he writes Letters, he generally writes One Copy, which he keeps, of that which he sends." He ties not himself exactly to Words, but to the Matter in the Letter he sends."
"Being asked, "Whether all the Letters, whereof the Papers delivered in are said to be Copies, were delivered to the Duke of Shrewsbury or Mr. Vernon?" He saith, "They were all sent to his Grace's House, or his Office, or Mr. Vernon's House."
"Being asked, "Whether he is sure the Letter of the Nineteenth of February to the Duke of Shrewsbury, delivered in, be a true Copy ?" Saith, "It is true as to the Names and Matter; but cannot say as to Words exactly." He saith, "It was sent on a Thursday Night: That there was an Account in it of Sir George Berkeley, Mr. Charnock, Major Holmes, Mr. Boise, and Mr. Porter's Names."
"Being asked, "Whether Mr. Vernon saw the Letter of the Nineteenth?" He saith, "He writ to Mr. Vernon, that he had a fuller Account, and that he might see it if he pleased; but he desired me to send it in Writing, and he would deliver it to my Lord."
"After being shewed and having perused the Letters of the Fourteenth and Nineteenth of February; being asked, "Whether they were true Copies?" He saith, "They may vary in Words, but not in Matter and Substance: He is certain, Berkeley and Holmes were named in the Letters sent; but as to the others, he is not so certain."
Porter's Examination; 2.
"George Porter Esquire (sworn) being asked, "Whether he hath any Thing to say, that relates to the Earl of Monmouth?" He saith, "He hath nothing particularly to say in relation to the Earl of Monmouth; but what he hath to say particularly relates to the Dutchess of Norfolke, which he thought fit to offer to their Lordships, as thinking it to relate to the same Affair." He saith, "That, about Four Months ago, one Captain Rupert, who formerly belonged to the Duke of Norfolk's Family, came to him the Examinant, and told him, "He could acquaint him with something, which would be very useful to him the Examinant, that had come to his Knowledge." "Which when he asked him what it was; he told him, "That he had been lately in Company with some Women that frequented the Company of the Dutchess of Norfolke; and he had heard among them, that there was a Design among them to bribe a Woman (who had had her Husband killed about Nine Months ago) to accuse the Examinant of that Murder, and to find out Witnesses to prove it upon him." The Examinant asked him, "How he came to know that there was such a Design ?" He told him, "That with a little Pains he could make it out." The Examinant then told him, "He would consider of it; but did not care to meddle at all with any such Matter, especially it some Way relating to my Lord of Monmouth, who was a Man in this Government for whom he had a great deal of Respect, and he had no Mind to make him his Enemy:" And that was the Answer he returned to Captain Rupert. He saith, "That, some Time after, the Dutchess of Norfolke actually sent to Mrs. Norton, to persuade her to take off the Examinant's Evidence, by swearing the Murder of her Husband against the Examinant;" of which, and other Things relating to this Matter, he offered Affidavits. The Earl of Monmouth did desire the Witness Mr. Porter might be asked, "Whether ever he the said Earl spoke to him the Examinant in his Life, or till within these Two Days knew any Thing of what he now informed this House ?" To which the Examinant answered, "That he never had any Acquaintance with his Lordship, other than the Civility of bowing to his Lordship; but, besides those Affidavits which he now offered, there were other Affidavits relating to the Dutchess of Norfolke, taken before the Lord Chief Justice Holt, that were to be left with the Attorney General, in order to prosecute my Lady Dutchess; but those Affidavits which he now offered were taken by Justice Ireton, who was ready without, to justify the same; and that he had nothing else to offer at present, relating to this Matter."
Harcourt's Examination: 3.
"Symon Harcourt Esquire (sworn), being asked, "Whether he knew one Mr. Robins?" He answered, "Yes." Being then asked, "Whether he ever had any Discourse with him about the Persons named in Sir John Fenwick's Paper ?" He answered, "Yes." And being then asked, "What that Discourse was ?" "He answered, "That he had been at The Rainbow Coffee-house, where Persons of his Profession used to be for Conveniency of meeting with their Clients; and while he was drinking a Dish of Coffee, some Gentlemen were talking, at the Table where he sat, about the Business of Sir John Fenwick; and they had named several Lords and others, that Sir John Fenwick had named in his Paper; and that he, sitting by the Table, took out a Paper, in which he used to write down every Day's Minutes, and wrote down there the Names of the Lords as they were talked of: That One in the Company asked, "How this was known to be true, that Sir John Fenwick did name these Persons ?" He answered, "That it was the Town Talk, that my Lady Mary Fenwick reported it so to be;" and that was the Talk of the Coffeehouse: That, when he had drank his Dish, he went away, and met Mr. Robins, and acquainted him what was said in the common Discourse concerning my Lord Monmouth, whom he knew to be Mr. Robins's great Friend and Patron; and that he told it him for my Lord Monmouth's Service, as he thought, that, if it were true, my Lord might know of it; and that was all that he thinks passed between him and Mr. Robins at that Time." Being asked, "Who was the Person that spoke these Things at the Coffee-house?" He answered, "That he could not tell ; there were Six or Seven at the Table." Being then asked, "Whether he did not tell Mr. Robins, that he had this Information from One that had it from my Lady Mary Fenwick?" He answered, "No." Being then acquainted, "That Mr. Robins had declared that he told him he had it from One who had it directly from my Lady Mary Fenwick;" he answered, "That he had it no otherwise than he now declared upon his Oath, nor mentioned it otherwise to Mr. Robins; that he did not know my Lady Mary Fenwick, nor any other that does know her, to his Knowledge."
"Then the Earl of Monmouth desired he might be asked, "Whether he did not a Second Time speak to Mr. Robins, with relation to this News; and desired him that he would enquire further about it?" To which he answered, "That Mr. Robins desired him, if he heard any more of the Matter, he would acquaint him with it; which he told him he would do, if it might be any Service to my Lord Monmouth; and that he did meet Mr. Robins a Day, or Two, or Three after, he cannot tell which; and did then tell him, "That he had heard no more of the Matter."
"Being further asked by the Earl of Monmouth, "Whether he did hear at any other Place, or from any other Persons, than at The Rainbow Coffee-house, any Thing relating to this Affair?" He answered, "He believed he did; and it was this: That he had heard his Lordship (as the Town said) was at Will's Coffeehouse in Covent Garden, where he did complain, that his Lordship heard he was named in Sir John Fenwick's Paper; and that his Lordship afterwards came to that Coffee-house again, and brought a Letter along with him, which he shewed in the Coffeehouse, as from the Lady Mary Fenwick; denying that his Lordship was named in Sir John Fenwick's Paper; and that he was a Man of Honour. But whether his Lordship did so or (fn. 3) no, this Examinant could not tell; but what he now related was Town Talk."
"Being again asked by the Earl of Monmouth, "Whether he had heard it in no other Place but the Coffee-house?" He answered, "He could remember none particularly; but he might hear it in Twenty Places, because it was the common Talk about the Town: That he cannot charge his Memory with any particular Place or Person, for it was a Thing generally talked of; though, he believed, nobody gave any Credit to it." He was then further asked by the Earl of Monmouth, "Whether he desired Mr. Robins to acquaint the Earl with what he had informed Mr. Robins of ?" He answered, "That Mr. Robins did ask him, if he would give him Leave to acquaint my Lord Monmouth with what he had told him?" To which he answered, "With all his Heart, if it would be for his Lordship's Service." But he did not desire Mr. Robins to acquaint the Earl with it; but gave him Leave, if he pleased, so to do."
Monckton's Examination; 4.
"Robert Monckton Esquire (sworn) being asked, "What he had heard Captain Smith say, in relation to the Dutchess of Norfolke and my Lord Monmouth ?" He answered, "That he was much surprized to be called here on this Occasion; but, being accidentally at the Door of this House on Monday last, when my Lord Monmouth desired him to come with him to a Gentleman who desired to speak with his Lordship, which was Mr. Smith, as the Examinant was afterwards informed; who told his Lordship, "That Mr. Jermy desired him to inform him of some Discovery that he had to make." And my Lord Monmouth desired Mr. Smith "not to do it, to any particular Person." Then the Earl of Monmouth desired he might be asked, "What Captain Smith said relating to the Dutchess of Norfolke and his Lordship ?" He answered, "That he remembered not that Captain Smith said any more, than that he spoke not with the Dutchess of Norfolke; or rather, that the Dutchess of Norfolk did not speak with him." The Earl of Monmouth then desired he might be asked, "What his Lordship had said to Captain Smith, in relation to the Dutchess of Norfolk?" He answered, "My Lord Monmouth had advised him not to speak to the Dutchess about this Thing, nor to discover it to her; and that he had often so desired him." Being then asked, "When he heard this?" He answered, "It was on Monday last, being then in Curiosity at the Door of this House; and my Lord desiring him to go with him, because he would not speak with Mr. Smith alone."
Mrs. Bragg's Examination; 5.
"Mrs. Katherine Bragg (sworn), being required "to tell her whole Knowledge concerning any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolke and Mrs. Norton, the Widow of Mr. Norton, in relation to Captain Porter?" She answered, "That my Lady Dutchess of Norfolke sent to her the said Mrs. Norton, upon Pretence to make her her Grace's Woman: That her Grace sent her Steward for her said Mistress, the Steward's Name being Henry Keymer, who brought Mrs. Norton to her Grace; and her Grace told Mrs. Norton, "That, if she would produce Evidence whereby she would prosecute Captain Porter for the Murder of her Husband, she should never want Friends, nor Assistance, nor Money to go on with the Design:" That the Examinant was not present when the Dutchess said this to Mrs. Norton; but that, when Mrs. Norton came Home, she told the Examinant of it, and several others, particularly Ann Tatnall and John Tatnall; and that Two Women came from the Dutchess of Norfolk to Mrs. Norton, who would have her to assist them in coming to the House of Lords at the Time when Sir John Fenwick's Business was in Hand, to cry Vengeance in the Honourable House; which Two Women were the Wives of Cranberne and Keys, who were executed; and all was to attach Captain Porter about the Murder of her Husband; and they brought a Coach, to carry Mrs. Norton to the House for that End; and that still my Lady Dutchess replied, "If she did it, she should neither want Money nor Means." It being asked her, "What Coach it was they brought ?" She answered, "It was an Hackney coach; that she was not by when the Woman said so; but there were Witnesses that would justify it, and her Mistress too; who, with the Examinant, had sworn it before the Lord Chief Justice last Night between Six and Seven a Clock; and that Mrs. Norton had told her this immediately after she came from the Dutchess of Norfolke, who sent for Mrs. Norton Twice; Once her said Steward came, and then a Mourning Coach the Second Time: But Mrs. Norton would not condescend to any Thing, to prosecute Captain Porter for the Murder of her Husband; for she thought he had no Hand in it." And being asked, "How long it is since the Dutchess sent the First Time to the said Mrs. Norton ?" She answered, "It was about Six Months ago."
"William Gwatkin, sworn, being required "to tell his whole Knowledge of any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolk and Mrs. Norton, about Captain Porter ?" He answered, "That, about a Month ago, he was at Mrs. Norton's House; and being there, a Couple of Women came to The Plow in Tuttle-street, Westm'r, which did say, "They came from the Dutchess of Norfolke;" and these Two Women were supposed to be the Wives of Cranborne and Keys; and Mrs. Norton desired the Examinant to go along with her to The Plow to them; and told the Examinant, "That he must not come into the Room to them; but, if he pleased to stand at the Door, she would be thankful to him:" That he went with her accordingly; and, when he came there with her, the Two Women said, "That To-morrow Sir John Fenwick's Trial was to be in the House of Lords; and if she did not come along with them to the House, and cry out Vengeance against Captain Porter for the Death of her Husband, they were all undone:" That Mrs. Norton promised, "That she, her Mother, and Sister, should come to the House;" and in a little Time after they parted, and Mrs. Norton came to the Examinant again: That he stood at the Door all the while, and heard this Discourse. And asked, "Whether he knew any Thing of their being sent from the Dutchess of Norfolke, or whether they only came from the Dutchess's House ?" He answered, "That the Women said, they came from the Dutchess of Norfolk; but he knows not any Thing of their being sent by her; nor knows he directly the Women's Names, having never seen them before; but he believes he might know One of them if he saw her, because she squinted."
Mrs. Norton's Examination;
"Mrs. Elizabeth Norton (sworn), being required "to acquaint the House with her whole Knowledge in relation to any Transaction between herself and the Dutchess of Norfolke, or any other Person, with relation to Captain Porter, about the Death of her Husband ?" She answered, "That the Dutchess of Norfolke sent for her, on Easter Monday last, by her Steward Mr. Keymer; and that she waited on her Grace on Tuesday; when her Grace asked her, "Whether she would be her Grace's Woman, her Husband being dead?" To which the Examinant answered, "That she could not positively tell her own Mind, because she had an House, and a Child, and knew not whether she should put off her House." The Dutchess then asked her, "How her Husband came by his Death ?" And she answered her, "That she had prosecuted One Dutchman for it; and that there was another indicted at The Old Bayly, one Rich'd Kempe." Then the Dutchess asked her, "Whether she had ever heard that Captain Porter had an Hand in the Death of her Husband?" To which the Examinant answered, "That she had never heard any such Thing but from one Mrs. Tatnall." Upon which, her Grace desired the Examinant to send her to her. But the Examinant never did; but hath heard that her Grace sent for her. That the Examinant went not to the Dutchess again till she sent a Coach for her, which was in the Whitson-Week; and then her Grace asked the Examinant, "Whether she had heard any Thing more of the Death of her Husband ?" To which the Examinant answered, "No." The Dutchess then asked her, "Whether she had not heard that Captain Porter was not concerned in it ?" To which the Examinant also answered, "No." To which the Dutchess replied, "That she heard there were many that could testify about it; and particularly that Keys' Wife would swear it." To which the Examinant returned, "That she never had seen Keys' Wife." Upon which a Gentlewoman that was by the Dutchess said, "No! did you never see Mrs. Keys ?" To which the Examinant again replied, "No." Then the said Gentlewoman said, "We will send her to you." Then the Dutchess said to the Examinant, "Mrs. Norton, pray make a strict Inquiry into your Husband's Death; and I will stand by you, and all the Friends I can make: If you will make a strict Inquiry into it, there shall be nothing wanting, but you shall be assisted to prosecute it." To which the Examinant returned, "That if she did believe, or could find out, that Captain Porter was concerned in the Death of her Husband, for all the King had pardoned him, she would put in her Appeal against him, and would sell her Bed from under her to prosecute him for it." To which the Dutchess of Norfolke replied, "That the Examinant spoke like a prudent Wife;" and so said the Gentlewomen who were in the Room, who were Two, but the Examinant knows not their Names; and One of them particularly spoke to the Examinant, "Pray, Mrs. Norton, make Inquiry into this Matter:" And the Dutchess said, "Do, Mrs. Norton; and I'll stand by you." Upon which, the Examinant took her Leave of the Dutchess; and within some very little Time spoke to her Counsellor about what Discourse had passed between the Dutchess and her; who gave the Examinant this Advice, "That she should not go near the Dutchess any more; for the Design of the Dutchess was not so much to have her to be her Woman, as to prosecute Captain Porter for the Death of her Husband."
"Being then asked, "Whether the Dutchess said any Thing to her about Money that should be provided for her ?" The Examinant answered, "That, upon her Oath, the Dutchess did say, she should be assisted with Money, for Prosecution of the Murder of her Husband; and desired the Examinant would find out what Evidence she could." And the Examinant replied, "She could find out none more; but if her Grace, or any other Person, could find any, she would be sure to prosecute it with the utmost she could."
"Being asked, "If she offered any Sum of Money ?" The Examinant answered, "That the Dutchess did say, "That nothing should be wanting of Money, to prosecute the Murder, if found out;" but never offered any Sum of Money."
"Being then desired to describe the Gentlewomen that were with the Dutchess of Norfolk; she answered, "That the one was a good fat lusty Gentlewoman; the other a middle-sized Sort of a Woman; and that, if she saw them, she was sure she should know One of them; she believes she should know both: That the fat lusty Woman said, "She would send Keys's Wife to her;" and the other Woman she should know among a Thousand, if she saw her.
"Being then asked, "When was the last Time she spoke with or saw the Dutchess of Norfolke?" She answered, "That it was in the Whitson-Weeke the last Time she spoke with her Grace, though she cannot tell the particular Day; and that then she sent a Mourning Coach for her; but she cannot say it was her own Coach; but she hath seen her since in her Coach, but hath not spoke to her."
"Being particularly asked, "Whether any Money was offered her by the Dutchess, to find out the Murder, or to lay the Murder on Mr. Porter?" She answered, "That she never offered the Examinant a Farthing of Money to lay it on Mr. Porter; but only to justify the Murder of her Husband."
"Being further asked, "Whether any body else had been with her about Captain Porter's being concerned in her Husband's Death?" She answered, "That there were Two Women came to her about a Month ago, though she cannot tell the particular Day, and sent for her, in her Sister's Name, to The Plow, in Westm'r; and when she came there, her Sister told her, "One of them was Mr. Keys' Wife, and the other Cranbourn's;" and that Keys' Wife told her, "Sir John Fenwick's Trial was to come on the next Day in the House of Lords; and that she should go with them, and cry out for Justice and Vengeance for the Death of her Husband against Mr. Porter; because, Keys' Wife said, her Husband took it upon his Death, that Captain Porter had an Hand in it, and that nothing troubled his Conscience more than that he had assisted Porter in it." But the Examinant not having any Evidence to convince her that Porter was concerned in the Death of her Husband, she did not go to the House."
"She further said, "She knew Mr. Gwatkin; and that he was at her House when she was sent for to The Plow, about taking out Writs against Persons that owed her Husband Money; and her Maid not being at Home when the Examinant was sent for to The Plow, the said Gwatkins took up the Examinant's Child in his Arms, which the Examinant desired the said Gwatkins to carry with her to The Plow; and when he went there, he told the Examinant, "He fat at the Door, and hearkened what the Women said to her;" which she repeated in short to the said Gwatkin; but she cannot say that he told her what he had heard, for she stayed not in the Company; but went away presently, and has not been conversant in Gwatkins's Company since, or any other, as little as she could, because of her own Condition."
"Being then asked, "Whether those Women said, they were sent by any body, and by whom?" She answered, "That she asked them, "How they came to find her out?" And that they said, "They had been with the Dutchess of Norfolk." But she cannot say that the Dutchess sent them to her, though she believes, without Doubt, she did direct them; for One of the Gentlewomen that were with her said, "She would send Keys's Wife to her."
"Being particularly asked, "What Advice Mr. Cresset gave her?" She answered, "That it was, she should go near the Dutchess's House no more, but keep her own House; for, he believed in his Conscience, Mr. Porter never had any Hand in the Death of her Husband; and that the Offer of being the Dutchess's Woman was but a Pretence; she having no Occasion for it, being able to subsist of herself."
"Being likewise asked, "Whether the Dutchess ever mentioned Twenty Guineas, or Threescore, or any particular Sum?" She answered, "No; but only she said, the would stand by her in the Prosecution of her Husband's Death; that she acquainted Counsellor Cresset with it within an Hour and Half after she came from the Dutchess; but whether she made her Maid acquainted with it the same Day, she cannot positively tell; but it might be, she might acquaint her with some of her Mind, she having nobody but her living in the House with her; but that she did acquaint her Maid with no more than what she hath now said here, to her Knowledge."
Tatnall's Examination; 8.
"John Tatnall, sworn, being required to acquaint the House with his whole Knowledge in relation to any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolke and Mrs. Norton, or any other Person, in relation to Captain Porter, about the Death of Mr. Norton?" Answered, "That all he could say or know of this Matter was, that there came a certain Woman to his House; who she was, he knows not; but, asking for his Wife, who happened not to be then at Home, he asked her, "Whence she came?" She said, "From the Dutchess of Norfolke." And he asking her, "What her Business was?" She said, "She came to know, whether the Examinant's Wife could give any Information concerning Captain Porter's being concerned in the Death of Mr. Norton?" Upon which, the Examinant asked her, "Whether she came upon a Trick and Trepan?" She answered, "No." To which the Examinant replied, "If he thought she did, he would give her a good Kick; but that he hath never since seen her, nor believes he should know her if he saw her."
Reed's Examination; 9.
"Mr. Charles Reed (sworn), being required to acquaint the House with his whole Knowledge, in relation to any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolke and Mrs. Norton the Wife of Mr. Norton who was killed, in reference to Captain Porter? He answered, "That Mrs. Norton, on Monday last at Night, made known to him, "That she was once with the Dutchess of Norfolke; and she did desire her to prosecute Mr. George Porter concerning the Death of her Husband, and she would give her a Gratuity for it."
"Being asked, "Whether he knew any Thing about one Mr. Cresset's taking away any Woman out of the Company where he was, who was to give Evidence about this Matter?" He answered, "That one Counsellor Cresset did come and take Mrs. Norton away out of the Company where the Examinant was, at The Bell Taverne, in King-street, Westm'r; and that Mr. Cresset came and asked her, "What she did there?" and told her, "His Cousin was at her House, and wanted her." And so she went away with him."
"Being then asked, "What was the Occasion of their being together at The Bell Taverne at that Time?" He answered, "The Occasion was this: That Mr. Gwatkin had told him, "The Dutchess of Norfolke had sent to some Woman, to prosecute Mr. Porter for the Death of one Mr. Norton;" and accordingly the Examinant, being desired by Mr. Gwatkin, went with him to her, to ask her some Questions about that Matter; and that they met at the Tavern upon the same Account: That Mrs. Norton lives in The Little Armory, in Westm'r."
"Being more particularly asked about the Occasion of meeting at The Bell Taverne; he answered, "That it was, to inquire of her concerning the Evidence and Prosecution, which she was desired by the Dutchess to make against Mr. George Porter, for the Death of her Husband; and that Mr. Porter desired him to go and ask her some Questions about it; the Examinant having acquainted him, "That there was a Design against him, to set aside his Evidence." The First Time he was with Mr. Porter was on Monday Morning last, when he told him of this Matter, and desired him to speak with Mrs. Norton about it; but that he had heard of the Business a Month or Six Weeks before, from Mr. Watkins; but he cannot tell particularly the Day of the Month, not thinking to be examined about it."
"Being asked, "Why he let alone speaking to Captain Porter about it till Monday Morning last?" He answered, "That he did tell one Captain Fisher of it before; but it fell out that he had some Business in the World, and therefore did omit and spoke not of it to Mr. Porter till Monday last."
"Being asked, "Where Captain Fisher lived, and whether it was that Captain Fisher who was the First Discoverer of the Plot?" He answered, "That he did not know whether he was the First Discoverer of the Plot; but it was said, he is an Evidence about the Plot; and that he lives in Dartmouth Street."
"Being then asked, "Where he himself lived, what Profession he was of, and what Employment he followed?" He answered, "That he lived privately in Dartmouth Street, in an House which he paid £.20 per Year Rent for; and that he lived upon what GOD sent him."
Mrs. Tatnall's Examination; 10.
"Ann Tatnall, sworn, being required to acquaint the House with her whole Knowledge in relation to any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolke and Mrs. Norton, or any other Person, in relation to Captain Porter, about the Death of Mr. Norton; answered, "That all the Account she can give is from Mrs. Norton's own Mouth; who told her, "That my Lady Dutchess of Norfolke sent for her in a Mourning Coach;" and that, as soon as she had done with the Dutchess, she made the Examinant a Visit; and told her, "That my Lady Dutchess had sent for her, to desire her "to take Care of prosecuting Captain Porter for the Death of her Husband;" and that she made her Grace Answer, "That she had not wherewith to prosecute to great a Man." That her Grace said thereupon, "That she should neither, want Money or Friends, if she would prosecute him." That the Examinant bid her take Care what she did; for Captain Porter was the King's Evidence. But this was what Mrs. Norton herself told her upon her Oath. That she never saw the Dutchess, except in her Coach in the Street."
"Being then asked, "Whether she had before that Time heard that Captain Porter was concerned in the Murder of Mrs. Norton's Husband?" She answered, "Yes; that she had heard so in an Oilman's Shop in Westm'r, and had told Mrs. Norton of it; and went to the Woman of the Shop, and inquired about it; who was so far from accusing Captain Porter from having any Hand in Mr. Norton's Death, that she said, "She saw the Action when it was done; and that she was sure Captain Porter was not One of the Persons concerned, she knowing him very well."
"Being asked, "What Time it was Mrs. Norton came to her, and told her of the Discourse between the Dutchess and her?" She answered, "She could not exactly tell; but, to the best of her Remembrance, it was Five Months ago; and that she believes that was the Second Time that Mrs. Norton had been with the Dutchess.
Baker's Examination; 11.
"Mr. Nicholas Baker (sworn), being asked, "Whether he could remember, or tell, when was the First Time that he, or any Person concerned for the King, heard of, or was acquainted with, Mr. Goodman's being gone away?" He answered, "That he had, in the best Method he could, recollected himself, and compared his Remembrance with some Gentlemen in the Secretaries Office; and found that Mr. Goodman absented himself upon my Lord Mayor's Day, which was Thursday the Nine and Twentieth of October; and the First Notice he himself had of it was on the Saturday following."
"Being asked, "Whether he found that any one else had any earlier Notice than Saturday?" He answered, "That he knew not what private Intimations might be given to any body; but it was not publicly discoursed of till Saturday, and then he heard it upon The Exchange; and that the Proclamation for the apprehending Mr. Goodman bears Date the Fifth of November, which was the Thursday following."
"John Cresset Esquire (sworn), being required "to give an Account of all he knew of any Transaction between the Dutchess of Norfolke and Mrs. Norton concerning Captain Porter, and what Advice he gave Mrs. Norton on that Matter?" He answered, "That, about Twelve Months since, Mr. Norton was found murdered near Chareing Cross ; and Mrs. Norton acquainted him, "there was a Person taken that was supposed to be concerned in the Murder, and desired him to be present at the Examination before the Coroner;" which he accordingly did; and that, upon Examination, it appeared the Person taken up happened to be coming that Way late that Night; and the Watch and Constables coming by, he endeavoured to hide himself, and therefore was taken up, and afterwards was bailed, and the next Sessions he was tried; but though there was some Evidence that rendered it suspicious, yet there was none that could amount to a sufficient Proof; therefore he was acquitted. But further said, "That the Coroner of Westm'r before that had a Letter sent him, but from whom the Examinant cannot tell, "That if any Person were taken up, and tried for the Death of Mr. Norton, there should not want Evidence;" and there was One Person named in the Letter, as the Examinant remembers, it was one Kempe, who was supposed to have committed the Murder; upon which he was sought after, but was never yet heard of, nor could be taken; for, that Night the Murder was committed, he left his Lodgings, and could never be found." He further said, "He thinks it was about Two Months after this, though he cannot particularly tell the Time, Mrs. Norton came to him, and told him, "The Dutchess of Norfolke had sent to her, to come to her; and that she had been with her;" and that he believed that Mrs. Norton came to him within a few Hours after she had been with the Dutchess. And Mrs. Norton told him, "That the Dutchess asked her, If she had heard any Thing further of the Death of her Husband?" And that she answered, "No." Then her Grace asked her, "If she had heard any Thing of Mr. Porter being concerned in it?" She answered, "Yes; she had heard such a Report, from such a Person;" but who that Person was, he doth not remember. But he doth say, "He himself hath heard such a Report too; for the Thing was talked up and down the Town, for what Reason he could not know. That thereupon Mrs. Norton asked the Examinant, "What she should do in the Matter ?" To which he replied, "That she had done already what became a Woman of Justice and Prudence, in prosecuting her Husband's Murder; and that, having no farther Evidence that he knew of, she would do well not to intermeddle further; but, if there came any People to her to give any further Information in the Matter, she should send them to him, who would examine into it; and, if there were any Colour for it, would take Care to have it prosecuted;" but never any body came to him about it. He further said, "That it was some Time after, but how long he could not tell, Mrs. Norton came to him again, and told him, "That she had been with the Dutchess of Norfolke again, upon her sending for her; and that her Grace asked her, "If she had heard any Thing more about the Murder of her Husband?" And she answered, "No." That then her Grace asked her, "Whether she knew any Thing more about Captain Porter being concerned in it ?" And that the Dutchess told her, upon her answering "No;" "That she should not want Friends and Assistance, to prosecute for her Husband's Death." Then she asked the Examinant, "What she should do?" And he advised her, "That she should not at all concern herself in any such Matter; because there was no Colour, Suspicion, Jealousy, or Ground, of accusing Captain Porter about that Matter; and therefore she would do well, not to meddle any more in it." And she told him, "She would not." But some Time after, as he remembers, about Five or Six Weeks ago, Mrs. Norton came to him again, and told him, "That there had some People been with her, but she did not name who they were, and would have had her appeared in this Honourable House, at Sir John Fenwick's Trial, against Mr. Porter, about her Husband's Death." Upon which, the Examinant asked her, "Whether she knew any Thing of Mr. Porter's being concerned in it?" She answered, "No; nor would not go." To which the Examinant said, "Mrs. Norton, I would not have you meddle any Thing at all in the Matter; for you know not who these People are, nor what the Design may be; and therefore, pray, do not speak or discourse with any Person whatever about this Matter." But how far she observed his Advice, he knows not. And the Examinant further said, "That Mrs. Norton told him, the First Time she had been with the Dutchess of Norfolke, her Grace told her, "Her Woman was sick; and then offered her, the said Mrs. Norton, to make her her Woman;" and that the Dutchess likewise told her, "She was acquainted with her Husband in his Life-time:" But how, or whether upon the Account of his Trade, the Examinant cannot tell."
Dighton's Examination; 2.
"Mr. Christopher Dighton (sworn), being asked, Whether he knew any Thing of an Annuity, or Rent-charge, Mrs.Lawson hath out of Sir John Fenwick's Estate?" He answered, "That, about March, One Thousand Six Hundred Ninety-four, Mrs. Lawson treated with Sir John Fenwick about purchasing an Annuity of One Hundred Pounds a Year, charged upon Sir John's Estate; and that Sir John and my Lady did agree to grant such an Annuity to Mrs.Lawson, for their Two Lives and the longest Liver of them: That the Examinant had looked into the Deed, and found it was so; and that Sir John and my Lady both signed the Deed; and that Mrs. Lawson asked him, "Whether she was safe in her Purchase, in regard my Lady was a married Woman ?" And the Examinant answered her, "That he thought she was safe as to Sir John, during his Life; but he made a Doubt whether she was safe as to my Lady if she survived Sir John because she could not, as he thought, be barred without a Fine; but he knows not that there ever was any Fine levied by my Lady; but says, Five Hundred Pounds was paid by Mrs. Lawson, as the Consideration of the said Grant of the Annuity aforesaid."
Moore's Examination; 3.
"Francis Moore (sworn), being required to acquaint the House, "What he knew of any Person that was endeavoured to be introduced into the Earl of Monmouth's Service by one White, and who that White is, and from whom he said the Person was recommended to be the Earl's Servant?" He answered, "That he thinks it was about Two Months, or somewhat more, that Mr. White, who is Gentleman, or Groom of the Chamber, to the Dutchess of Norfolke, came to the Examinant, and brought a Fellow with him, a Taylor, as he said, and desired he might be entertained in the Service of my Lord Monmouth, as Groom of the Chamber, to snuff the Candles; but that he could not lie in the House, because he had a Wife, and lodged elsewhere. And White told this Examinant, "That, if he could do this for him, he would give him a Guinea, or some such Thing." To which the Examinant answered, "He would do what he could; but he would not take any Thing for it." That thereupon the Examinant spoke to the Countess of Monmouth about it, who, when she heard that the said Person was an Irishman, she would not entertain him."
"Being asked, "What Wages he demanded?" He answered, "That they were not come so far in the Treaty as to settle the Wages, because my Lady would not entertain him. But the said White said, "He would not expect any Wages, for he only desired to come into the House as a Servant."
"Being asked, "How often White spoke to him about it?" He answered, "Four Times, on Friday, Saturday, Sunday, and Tuesday." And likewise said, "Mr. White told him, The Dutchess of Norfolke should speak with my Lord or my Lady about it." To which the Examinant answered, "That, in case her Grace did so, he doubted not but the Thing might be effected; otherwise the Examinant could do no more than speak; which he did; but my Lady would not hear of it: That once he heard the Man's Name, but cannot remember what it was, nor ever saw him but those Four Times, nor knows where to find him; but would endeavour it, if required."
Mrs. Coalbeck's Examination; 4.
"Mrs. Elizabeth Coalebeck (sworn,) being required to give an Account what she knew about Mr. Goodman's Escape, and the particular Time of it, and the Circumstances how she came to know it?" answered, "That she came to my Lady Monmouth on Friday the Thirtieth of October last; and on the Sunday after, my Lady told her, "She heard Mr. Goodman was gone out of the Way." To which the Examinant replied, "Madam, is that News to you? I heard it Two or Three Days before." My Lady asked her, "Where she heard it?" She replied, "It was at the Dutchess of Norfolk's." Then my Lady asked her, "Who told her there?" She answered, "Mr. White; but that she cannot recollect the particular Day when she heard it from White at the Dutchess's; but she is sure, it was either the Thursday or the Friday before the Sunday that my Lady told her of it."
White's Examination; 5.
"Mr. William White (sworn), being asked, "Whether he applied himself to any of the Earl of Monmouth's Servants, to introduce any Person, and whom, into my Lord Monmouth's Service?" He answered, "Yes."
"Being asked, "Whether he was willing to serve without Wages?" He answered, "That he was a Man under some unfortunate Circumstances in the World, and desired to be admitted into my Lord's Service only for Protection; but that he was told, "My Lord would not entertain him, unless he would come to serve him in the Nature of a Porter, he having no Occasion for a Groom of the Chamber;" and that this was told him by Mrs. Coalebeck, who afterwards told him, "That my Lord would not entertain him at all, when he knew he was an Irishman, because both my Lord and my Lady had an Aversion against the Country, and would entertain none of them into their Service;" and that Mrs. Coalebeck did name the Earl, as refusing to entertain him because he was an Irishman; that he believes he came to the Earl of Monmouth's about this Business Two or Three Times; but how often, he cannot tell; and that Mr. Moore the Earl's Gentleman, understanding Ryan to be a Taylor, asked him, "If he would make him a Suit of Cloaths?" And that Ryan said, "If he could be protected as my Lord's Servant (which was all he designed in it), he did not care if he made my Lord's Liveries for nothing; but to live in the House he would not, nor serve in the Nature of a Porter, but only to come Once a Month for Protection Sake."
"Being asked, "Whether he offered Mr. Moore any Gratuity of Two Guineas, to introduce him into my Lord's Service?" He answered, "Yes;" and that Ryan said, "He did not care if he gave Five Guineas, to get himself entertained into my Lord's Service, only to come Once a Month, to appear as a Servant, to cover the Protection; but that he did not offer to be there all Day, and go Home at Night, and come again in the Morning, but lie in the House he would not."
"Being likewise asked, "Whether he did not say, my Lady Dutchess of Norfolke recommended him?" He answered, "That he did take the Liberty to use her Grace's Name; but, upon his Oath, her Grace never gave him any Power so to do; and Mrs. Coalebeck told him, "that it would take more Force, if her Grace's Name were used in it." That it was the last Time the Examinant was at my Lord Monmouth's House about this Matter, that he was told my Lord Monmouth had an Aversion against any Irishman; and that Mr. Moore gave the Examinant some Hopes, or else he would never have come more than once about it; Mr. Moore saying, "He did believe he could work it with my Lord and my Lady;" and that Ryan said, "He would not be troublesome to his Lordship, but would acquiesce in any Answer he gave." He further said, "He had been a pretty while acquainted with Mrs. Coalebeck, my Lady Monmouth's Woman, she coming to my Lady Dutchess's House."
"Being asked, "Whether he knew that Mrs. Coalebeck was at the Dutchess's about that Time that there was News of Mr. Goodman's being gone away?" He answered, "He did not know but that she might be; but he could not say she was."
"Being further asked, "Whether he ever told Mrs. Coalebeck, at the Dutchess's, that Mr. Goodman was gone away?" He answered, "He could not tell whether he did or no; it may be he might, in ordinary Way of Discourse."
"Being then asked, Whether he knew the Wives of Cranborne and Keys?" He answered, "That as for Cranborn's Wife, he knows her not from any other Woman, or that he ever saw her; and for Keys's Wife, he saw her one Day at the Door that goes through Webb's, and she would have recommended a Boy to a Service; but he cannot say he should know her if he saw her again, nor can positively say that he ever saw her but that one Time, or that she ever was, or was not, at the Dutchess's Lodgings."
"Being asked, "Whether he knew Mrs. Norton?" He answered, "Yes; that he knew her in her Husband's Time; but that he does not remember he ever saw her in the Dutchess's House since her Husband's Death." He further says, "That he offered Mrs. Coalbeck to give her Four Guineas, if she could obtain a Protection from my Lord Monmouth; he having Authority from the said Ryon to offer Four or Five Guineas to that End. That Mrs. Coalbeck several Times gave him some Hopes to effect it; but at last told him, "That my Lady would not entertain him any otherwise than as a Porter." And, upon his Oath, he is sure my Lady Dutchess never saw Ryan, so as to know him from any other Man, nor ever spoke with him, nor gave the Examinant any Power to use her Grace's Name in recommending him."
Mrs. Norton's further Examination;
"Mrs. Elizabeth Norton was produced again, and sworn, in the Presence of Mrs. Lawson. And being asked, "Whether she knew Mrs. Lawson, and whether Mrs. Lawson was One of the Gentlewomen that was by at the Dutchess of Norfolk's when she was there?" She answered, "She was not."
Mrs. Solomon's Examination; 6 & 7.
"Mrs. Hannah Solomon (sworn), being asked, "Whether my Lady Dutchess of Norfolke had sent any Messages to desire my Lord Monmouth to come to her, and how often!" She answered, "Several Times; she had heard my Lord's Servants say so; and that she herself Once, if not oftener, did carry such a Message to my Lord, as given to some of my Lord's Servants as received from my Lady Dutchess's Servants; but when it was, she cannot tell."
Moore's further Examination.
"Mr. Francis Moore (sworn before), being asked the same Question, deposed, That several Times my Lady Dutchess of Norfolke's Servants have come to my Lord's, as from the Dutchess, earnestly to desire my Lord to come to her Grace before he went to the House of Lords; and that was since the Fourth of November last."
"Being then shewn a Letter written to the Earl of Monmouth, dated the Nine and Twentieth of November, which was brought by my Lord's Footman Will to my Lord, as coming by the Penny Post, and when his Lordship had read it, he gave it to the Examinant, who marked it at the same Time; and that the Letter now shewn is the same Letter, and the Mark he then writ thereon is the Examinant's own Hand."
E. of Monmouth committed to The Tower, for assisting in the Contrivance of the Papers delivered by Ly. Mary Fenwick, and for undutiful Words spoke of the King:
Resolved upon the Question, That it doth appear to this House, by the Depositions taken in this House, That Charles Earl of Monmouth hath had such a Share and Part in the Contrivance of the Papers delivered into this House by the Lady Mary Fenwick, that for that Offence, and for the undutiful Words which were sworn before this House to be spoken by him of the King, that the said Charles Earl of Monmouth shall be committed Prisoner to His Majesty's Tower of London, there to remain during His Majesty's Pleasure, and the Pleasure of this House.
"It is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That the Gentleman Usher of the Black Rod attending this House do forthwith take into Custody the Body of Charles Earl of Monmouth, and carry him to His Majesty's Tower of London, there to be kept in safe Custody, during His Majesty's Pleasure, and the Pleasure of this House.
"It doth appear to this House, by the Depositions taken in this House, That Charles Earl of Monmouth hath had such a Share and Part in the Contrivance of the Papers delivered into this House by the Lady Mary Fenwick, that for that Offence, and the undutiful Words which were sworn before this House, to be spoken by him of the King; it is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That the said Charles Earl of Monmouth shall be, and he is hereby, committed Prisoner to His Majesty's Tower of London, there to remain during His Majesty's Pleasure, and the Pleasure of this House; and this shall be a sufficient Warrant on that Behalf.
Committee to prepare a Representation to the King, about this Resolution.
Lords Committees appointed to draw what shall be presented to His Majesty, touching the Resolution of this House, and the Commitment of Charles Earl of Monmouth, in relation to the Papers delivered into this House by the Lady Mary Fenwick, and the Examinations taken in this House concerning the same; and report to the House.
Elections, for regulating, Bill.
It is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That the Consideration of the Second Reading of the said Bill, and the Petitions relating thereunto, shall be resumed on Tuesday the Nineteenth Day of this Instant January, at Ten of the Clock in the Forenoon.
L. Hastings versus E. Huntingdon.
It is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That this House will hear One Counsel on either Side thereupon, on Thursday the One and Twentieth Day of this Instant January, at Eleven of the Clock.
E. Lincoln versus Rolle & al.
It is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That this House will hear the Cause wherein the Earl of Lincolne, by Susanna Countess of Lincolne his Mother and Prochein Amy, is Appellant, and Samuel Rolle and others Respondents, by Counsel, at the Bar, on Thursday the One and Twentieth Day of this Instant January, at Ten of the Clock in the Forenoon.
Rex versus Walcot, in Error.
It is ORDERED, by the Lords Spiritual and Temporal in Parliament assembled, That this House will hear the Errors argued, upon the Writ of Error depending in this House, wherein His Majesty by His Attorney General is Plaintiff, and John Walcott Son of Thomas Walcot Defendant, on Monday the Five and Twentieth Day of this Instant January, at Ten of the Clock in the Forenoon; and that Mr. Tanner do then attend with Records, as formerly ordered.
Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum effe usque ad et in diem Lunæ, (videlicet,) decimum octavum diem instantis Januarii, hora undecima Aurora, Dominis sic decernentibus.