BHO

House of Lords Journal Volume 3: 5 March 1624

Pages 245-247

Journal of the House of Lords: Volume 3, 1620-1628. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1767-1830.

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Citation:

Table of contents

DIE Veneris, videlicet, 5 die Martii,

Domini tam Spirituales quam Temporales, quorum nomina subscribuntur, præsentes fuerunt:

p. Carolus Princeps Walliæ, etc.

p. Archiepus. Cant.
Archiepus. Eborum.
p. Epus. London.
p. Epus. Dunelm.
Epus. Winton.
Epus. Petriburg.
p. Epus. Hereforden.
Epus. Wigorn.
Epus. Norwicen.
p. Epus. Roffen.
Epus. Glocestren.
Epus. Carlien.
p. Epus. Co. et Lich.
Epus. Bath. et W.
p. Epus. Bangor.
Epus. Elien.
Epus. Cicestren.
Epus. Oxon.
p. Epus. Cestren.
p. Epus. Landaven.
p. Epus. Sarum.
p. Epus. Exon.
p. Epus. Meneven.
p. Epus. Bristol.
p. Epus. Asaphen.
p. Epus. Lincoln, Ds. Custos Mag. Sigilli.
p. Comes Midd. Mag. Thesaur. Angliæ.
p. Vicecomes Maundevill, Præs. Conc. Domini Regis.
p. Comes Wigorn, Ds. Cust. Privati Sigilli.
p. Dux Buck. Mag. Admirallus Angliæ.
Marchio Winton.
p. Comes Oxon, Magnus Camer. Angliæ.
p. Comes Arrundell et Surr. Comes Maresc. Angliæ.
p. Comes Cantabr. Senesc. Hospitii.
p. Comes Pembroc, Camer. Hospitii.
Comes Northumbriæ.
Comes Nottingbam.
Comes Salop.
p. Comes Kanciæ.
Comes Derbiæ.
p. Comes Rutland.
Comes Cumbriæ.
p. Comes Sussex.
Comes Huntingdon.
Comes Bath.
p. Comes South'ton.
Comes Bedd.
Comes Hertford.
p. Comes Essex.
p. Comes Lincoln.
Comes Suffolciæ.
p. Comes Dorset.
p. Comes Sarum.
p. Comes Exon.
p. Comes Mountgomey.
p. Comes Bridgwater.
Comes Leicestriæ.
p. Comes North'ton.
Comes Warwic.
p. Comes Devon.
Comes March.
p. Comes Holdernesse.
p. Comes Carlile.
p. Comes Denbigh.
Comes Bristol.
p. Comes Anglisey.
Vicecomes Montague.
Vicecomes Wallingford.
Vicecomes Purbeck.
p. Vicecomes Maunsfeild.
Vicecomes Colchester.
p. Vicecomes Rochford.
p. Vicecomes Andever.
Ds. Abergavenny.
Ds. Audley.
Ds. Zouch.
p. Ds. Willoughby de Er.
p. Ds. Delaware.
Ds. Berkley.
p. Ds. Morley et M.
Ds. Dacres de H.
p. Ds. Stafford.
Ds. Scroope.
p. Ds. Duddely.
p. Ds. Stourton.
Ds. Herbert de Sh.
p. Ds. Darcy de M.
Ds. Vaux.
Ds. Windsore.
p. Ds. Wentworth.
p. Ds. Mordant.
p. Ds. St. John de Ba.
p. Ds. Cromewell.
Ds. Evre.
p. Ds. Sheffeild.
p. Ds. Paget.
p. Ds. North.
p. Ds. St. John de Bl.
p. Ds. Howard de W.
Ds. Wootton.
p. Ds. Russell.
p. Ds. Gray de Groby.
Ds. Petre.
Ds. Danvers.
Ds. Spencer.
Ds. Say et Seale.
p. Ds. Denny.
Ds. Stanhope de H.
p. Ds. Carew.
Ds. Arundell de W.
Ds. Haughton.
Ds. Teynham.
Ds. Stanhope de Sh.
p. Ds. Noel.
p. Ds. Brooke.
p. Ds. Mountague.
p. Ds. Cary de Lep.
Ds. Kensigton.
p. Ds. Grey de Werke.

Bp. of Norwich's Leave to be absent.

THE Bishop of Norwich hath Leave to be absent.

Exchange between the Prince of Wales and Sir Lewis Watson.

Hodie 2a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for Confirmation of an Exchange of Lands between the most Excellent Prince Charles and Sir Lewes Watson, Knight and Baronet; and committed unto the

L. Treasurer.
L. President.
L. Bp. of London.
L. Bp. of Duresm.
L. Willoughby of E.
L. Russell.
L. Mountague.
L. Cary of Lepington.
The Lord Chief Justice of the Common Pleas,
Mr. Serjeant Davis,
To attend the Lords.

To meet on Monday next, at Eight in the Morning, in the Painted Chamber.

Committee to attend the King with the Resolution of both Houses.

These Lords were named to be the Committee to present unto His Majesty (accompanied with a Committee of the Commons) the Resolution of both Houses: videlicet,

L. Archbp. of Cant.
L. President.
E. of Oxford.
E. of South'ton.
L. Bp. of London.
L. Bp. of Duresm.
L. Wentworth.
L. Sheffeild.
L. Walden.
L. Russell.
L. Grey of Gr.
L. Say and Seale.

Message to the H. C. for a Meeting of the Committees.

Message sent to the Commons, by Mr. Serjeant Davies and Mr. Attorney General: That the Lords have named a Committee of Twelve of this House, to present unto the King's Majesty the Resolution of both Houses; and do desire the Commons to appoint a Committee of their House to join with their Lordships, and to be here by Ten this Morning, in the Painted Chamber; and to return the Papers which they received Yesterday in the Afternoon at the Committee.

Answer.

Answer returned: That they will return a speedy Answer, by Messengers of their own.

Message from the H. C. that they concur with this House, relative to the Advice to the King, etc.

Message from the House of Commons, by Sir Thomas Edmonds, etc. and others: That the House of Commons have considered of the Reasons added Yesterday by their Lordships Committees unto those of the Commons, touching their Advice to the King, and have approved thereof, and of the Speech also agreed at that Committee to be delivered unto His Majesty by the Lord Archbishop of Cant. They have returned those Papers, which their Committee then received, with many Thanks for the good Correspondency which their Lordships hold with them, which they earnestly desire to be continued; and they have appointed a Committee of Twenty-four to accompany those of their Lordships in this Message to the King.

The Messengers being withdrawn;

Report from the Conference of the Committees concerning the Advice to His Majesty.

The Lord Archbishop of Cant. reported briefly the Reasons which the Commons delivered at their Committee Yesterday, and those also added by their Lordships, by the Prince's Direction; and then delivered the same in Writing unto Mr. Attorney to be read, and also the Speech conceived and agreed on, at the said Committee, to be used by his Grace in the Delivery of their Advice unto the King; the which Reasons follow, in hæc verba:

"Reasons conceived by the House of Commons to fortify their Resolution to advise His Majesty to proceed no further in the Treaties with Spaine.

Reasons conceived by the Commons for advising His Majesty to break off the Treaty with Spain.

"1. First, it is observed, That the State of Spaine, not content with those ordinary Provisions for the Exercise of the Roman Religion by the Infanta and her Family, which other Princes in like Case would have demanded, and which His Majesty with great Reason might at the Beginning of this Treaty have conceived they would have been contented with, have, with great Vehemency, upon Advantage of having the Prince's Person in their Possession, pressed a general Connivance for all His Majesty's Subjects of the Roman Religion, to the great Dishonour of Almighty God, in the Sincerity of His Service in this Realm, and to the apparent Diminution of His Majesty's Sovereignty, by establishing a necessary Dependance for Protection upon a Foreign King and State, and to the great Derogation of the Laws of this Kingdom, and lastly to the Grief and Discouragement of all His Majesty's well-affected Subjects, from whose general Discontent they expected, as well appeareth, a Consequent of no small Mischief.

"2. Secondly, it is observed, That, during the Continuance of this Treaty, and by Reason of the same, the Popish Faction have exceedingly increased in this Realm, both in Multitude and in Boldness; and whereas heretofore they have been divided amongst themselves into the Party of the Jesuits depending upon Spaine, and the Secular Priests otherwise; they are generally now strongly united together, depending no less upon Spaine for Temporal Respects, than upon Rome for Spiritual, which, considering the House of Spaine hath been always a capital Enemy to our Religion (to increase their own Greatness by extirpating the Protestant Party in all Places where they can prevail), cannot be but of most dangerous Consequence to the Safety of the King and this Realm, unless Remedy be provided with Speed for the abating of that Party here at Home, which cannot be during the Time that these Treaties are on Foot.

"3. Thirdly, it is observed, That, by Advantage of these Treaties, and thereby keeping His Majesty in Hope of general Peace, they have contrarily, under Pretence of assisting the Emperor, oppressed the Protestant Party in most Parts of Christendom, being the ancient Allies and Confederates of this Crown, to the endangering not only of the whole State of the Reformed Religion, but also of the common Safety of all the Professors of the same.

"4. Fourthly, during the Time of these Treaties of Love with His Majesty, they have with all kind of Hostility set upon His Majesty's Son-in-law, the Husband of His only and most Royal Daughter; invaded his Towns and Territories in all Places, and in fine disinherited him, with all that Royal Offspring, of all his ancient Patrimonial Honours and Possessions, to the great Dishonour of His Majesty, and extreme Grief of all His well-affected Subjects; and now also at the last, when they should have come to make good the Hope of Restitution, they have laid new Grounds for endless Delays, and turned pretended Difficulties into apparent Impossibilities; not forbearing also now to annex, as a Condition to the weak Hope of their uncertain and imperfect Restitution, that the eldest Son of the Count Palatine should be brought up in the Emperor's Court; so restless are their Desires to work the Overthrow of our Religion by all possible Devices.

"Lastly, it is too apparent how manifoldly, from Time to Time, they have deluded and abused His Majesty with their Treaties, how small Respect they have shewed to the Prince's Greatness and Worth, what Indignity they offered again and again to His Highness, by importuning him, upon all Advantages, to forsake his Religion, contrary to the Custom of all Princes, and contrary to the ancient Laws of Honour and Hospitality, who ought to have been used there with all Princely Freedom, and pressed to nothing unto which he was indisposed, considering with what Confidence, being so great a Prince, he had put himself within their Power; although it pleased God so to guide and fortify his Princely Heart, that he constantly withstood all their Attempts and Machinations, to his own immortal Honour, and to the unspeakable Comfort of all the good People of his Father's Kingdom; whereunto may be added the infinite (fn. 1) disadvantageous and endless Delays in their Treaties, inviting still to new Treaties, and turning all to the Advantage of their own particular Ends, being true to nothing but their own grounded Maxims, with which neither the Match nor Restitution of the Palatinate can possibly consist but upon such Terms as threaten to our State an incurable Mischief.

Motives conceived by this House for breaking off the Treaty.

"And for a further Justification of the Charge of Insincerity in all their Proceedings, these Particulars ensuing, amongst many other, may be produced.

"First, in that Treaty concerning Prince Henrie, after many specious Motions on their Part, it was followed with disavowing their own Ambassador, and a scornful Proposition to the King of that Prince's altering his Religion.

"Secondly, in the Treaty of Brussells, wherein Sir Richard Weston was employed, he found nothing but Delays and Deceits; and, after divers peremptory Commands from Spaine for His Majesty's Satisfaction, they wrought no other Effect than the Siege and Taking of Heidleburgh, so that he was forced to return with a Protestation.

"Thirdly, when the Baron Boscott came hither, to continue the former Treaty, the first News we heard, was the Translation of the Electorate to the Duke of Bavaria, of which both the Baron and Don Carlos protested Ignorance, and that the King of Spaine would make the World see how much he resented such an Affront; yet it plainly appeareth, by the Letter of the Count de Olivares given to the Prince, that the State of Spaine both had Intelligence of it before, and expected it to be effected at that Diet.

"Fourthly, when his Highness was in Spaine, the Count de Olivares shewed him Two Letters, by which it plainly appeared, that, till his coming thither, there was nothing really intended, which they were not ashamed directly to avow to the Prince himself: and that after, for the Requital of so hazardous a Journey, and such an extraordinary Trust, when all Articles were again concluded, they found a new Shift, upon a Junto of Divines, to let the Prince come home without the Lady, for whose Person his Highness had chiefly put himself to that Hazard.

"Lastly, when, upon his Highness's happy Return hither, we had just Cause to expect the uttermost they would do in restoring the Palatinate (the faithful Promise of which was the only Cause that the Prince yielded to that Junto of Divines); the Desposorios being presently to follow, the Bergstrat was delivered to the Elector of Mentz, being won by the King of Spaine's Arms, and Part of it then in Possession of his own Ministers, contrary to an express Article in the Treaty concluded by Don Carlos and the Baron Boscott, wherein it was particularly provided, that no Alteration should be made in those Territories till the general Treaty were at End."

These Reasons, both those of the Lower House, and those added by the Lords, being read, and approved of by the general Vote of the House, nemine dissentiente;

These Reasons to be delivered to His Majesty if required.

And also it being generally Agreed, That the said Reasons should be delivered unto the King, if His Majesty shall demand the same, or else to be returned, and the Advice to be presented unto His Majesty by the Lord Archbishop of Cant. with the same Speech conceived at the Committee;

The Messengers of the Commons were called in again, and answered, That their Lordships do acknowledge this good Correspondency between both Houses, and promise the Continuance thereof; and that their Committees shall presently meet them, to go together unto the King's Majesty, as was appointed.

And so the Committee, now appointed for this Message to the King, had Leave to go.

Phillips arrested. Privilege.

Ordered, Upon the Lord Chamberlain's Motion, That His Majesty's Writ of Habeas corpus cum causa be awarded, to bring the Body of John Phillips, Esquire, before their Lordships, on Tuesday Morning, the 9th Day of this Month, who is arrested and in the Prison of The Compter at Woodstreet, contrary to the Privileges of this High Court.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Sabbati, sextum diem instantis Martii, hora 9a, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Footnotes

  • 1. Origin Disadvantageosness.