House of Lords Journal Volume 8: 26 December 1646

Pages 629-632

Journal of the House of Lords: Volume 8, 1645-1647. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1767-1830.

This free content was digitised by double rekeying. All rights reserved.

Page 629
Page 630
Page 631
Page 632

In this section

DIE Saturni, 26 die Decembris.

PRAYERS, by Mr. Salwey.

Domini præsentes fuerunt:

Comes Manchester, Speaker.

Comes Kent.
Comes Mulgrave.
Comes Sarum.
Comes Suffolke.
Comes Rutland.
Comes Denbigh.
Comes Midd.
Comes Lyncolne.
Comes Northumb.
Comes Stamford.
Comes Warwicke.
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Ds. Wharton.
Ds. North.
Ds. Grey.
Ds. Berkeley.
Ds. Mountagu.
Ds. Hunsdon.
Ds. Dacres.
Ds. Howard.
Ds. Bruce.
Ds. Maynard.
Ds. Willoughby.

Answer from the H. C.

Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Page return with this Answer:

That they agree in communicating the Order concerning the King to the Scotts Commissioners, and to the Meeting of the Committee this Afternoon concerning the Duke of Yorke.

Prisoners in The Tower Petition, for a Maintenance.

Upon reading the Petition of the Prisoners of The Tower of London; desiring "some Maintenance to be allowed them."

It is Ordered, To be recommended to the House of Commons, that some Allowance may be made them, for their Subsistence.

Ald Chambers a Petition.

Ordered, That the Petition of Alderman Chambers shall be taken into Consideration on Thursday next.

Ordinance to pardon Sus. Adams.

The Lord Wharton reported from the Committee, an Ordinance for granting a Pardon to Suzan Adams; which was read Twice, and Agreed to, and Ordered to be sent to the House of Commons for their Concurrence.

Ordinance to pardon Goodman and Hanson.

Ordered, That the same Committee as was appointed for Suzan Adams' Business shall make a Preface to the Ordinance for a Pardon to Wm. Goodman and Ric'd Hanson, setting out the Matter of Fact, and report the same to this House; and the Earl of Suffolke is added to the said Committee.

Paper from the Scots Commissioners about Religion.

The Speaker acquainted this House, "That Yesterday the Scotts Commissioners had a Meeting with the Committee of Religion; and they delivered in a Paper, which was desired to be presented to this House."

The House received the same, and read it.

(Here enter it.)

Ordered, That this Paper be communicated to the House of Commons.

Paper concerning their Army in Ireland.

The Earl of Northumb. reported from the Committee of both Kingdoms Two Papers:

1. Concerning the Scotch Army in Ireland, delivered by Captain Drumond. (Here enter it.)

Ordered, To be sent to the House of Commons, with Recommendations, that Provisions of Monies, &c. may be made for the Scotch Army in Ireland.

They will write to their General to prevent the King's escaping;

"2. We shall, according to the Desire of the Two Houses of Parliament, acquaint the Lord Generall of the Scotch Army (there being no Comittee for the present at Newcastle) with their Apprehensions of the King's goinge beyond Seas, and their Desires that Care be taken to prevent the same.

25 Dec. 1646.

"By Comand of the Comissioners for the Parliament of Scotland.

"Jo. Cheislie."

and that they are ready to confer about the King's Letter.

"3. Your Lordships having comunicated to us His Majesty's Letter, dated from Newcastle, the 20th of Decemb. 1646; we desire to know, whether the Two Houses have as yet taken the same into Consideration, or if your Lordships be ready to advise with us concerning the Contents of it; and if your Lordships be thereunto authorized, we are ready to conferr with your Lordships.

25 Dec. 1646.

"By Comande of the Commissioners for the Parliament of Scotland.

"J. Ch."

Consideration of the King's Letter, desiring to treat with the Houses.

The Question being put, "Whether to go on upon the Consideration of the King's Letter presently?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the King's Letter was read again.

The House was adjourned during Peasure into a Committee, to debate the King's Desire of coming with Safety, Freedom, and Honour.

And the House was resumed.

Then the Vote of the 22th of December was read.

And this Question was put, "Whether the Vote made by this House, and sent down to the House of Commons, concerning the King's coming to One of His Houses, without any further Addition or Explanation, be a fit Answer to that Particular in the King's Letter?"

And it was Resolved in the Affirmative.

Next, the House considered of another Desire in the King's Letter, of His being heard.

Vote for no Treaty to be had on the Propositions.

This Question was propounded, "Whether, in Answer to this Particular in the King's Letter, of desiring to be heard, this House will return, That this House will have no Treaty upon the Propositions?"

Then the Question was put, "Whether this Question shall be put?"

And it was Resolved in the Affirmative.

Then the aforesaid Question was put, and Resolved in the Affirmative.

Protest against it.

Memorandum, That, before the putting the aforesaid Question, these Lords following desired Leave to enter their Dissents, if it was carried against their Votes; which being granted, they do accordingly enter their Dissents, by subscribing their Names.

"T. Lyncolne."

Message from the H. C. with an Order.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir Humphry Tufton:

To desire their Concurrence in the Order for giving the Lord Grey Five Thousand Pounds. (Here enter it.)

Read, and Agreed to.

Message to them, for a Conference about Compositions at Goldsmiths Hall; and with other Particulars.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Leech and Mr. Page:

1. (fn. 1) To communicate to them the Two Votes made this Day, upon some Particulars in the King's Letter, and to desire their Concurrence therein.

2. To desire a Conference with the House of Commons, in the Painted Chamber, at Eleven of the Clock on Monday next, concerning the Obstructions in the Compositions at Gouldsmithes Hall.

3. To desire Concurrence in the Ordinance for making Colonel Manwaring Comptroller of the Customs at Sandwich.

Petitions from the City.

Ordered, That the City Petitions shall be further taken into Consideration on Monday next.

Commissioners of the Great Seal.

Ordered, That the Business of Commissioners of the Great Seal of England shall be taken into Consideration on Monday Morning next.

White to be instituted to Wormingford.

Ordered, &c. That Mr. Doctor Aylett, &c. shall give Institution and Induction unto John White Clerk, Master of Arts, to the Vicarage of Worthermonford, alias Wormingford, in the County of Essex, selvo Jure cujuscunque; the said Mr. White taking the National League and Covenant, and producing his Presentation thereunto under the Hand and Seal of Jeremyab Walgrave, the Patron.

Paper from the Commissioners of the Church of Scotland, about the Settlement of Religion.

"As the other Reformed Churches have bin much comforted with the hopefull Beginings and some happy Progresse of a gloriouse Reformation of Religion in this Kingdome; soe especially the Church of Scotland (which is soe neerly concerned, and must needs expect to partake more then other Churches of the Good or Evill which shall here take Roote) hath greatly rejoyced and given Thanks to God for soe greate Mercy: Neverthelesse, they are alsoe myndfull of the Vowes of God, which are upon all the Three Kingdomes and upon all Sorts and Degrees of Persons therein, according to their severall Places and Callings, to indeavor such a Reformation of Religion in the Kingdomes of England and Ireland, in Doctrine, Worshipp, Discipline, and Government, as is according to the Word of God and the Example of the best Reformed Churches, and to indeavor the neerest Uniformity in all these betweene the Churches of God in the Three Kingdomes, together with the Exterpation of Heresy and Schisme, least, partakinge in other Mens Sinnes, they bee indangered to receive of their Plagues; which Things they did not oblige themselves to indeavor for a Tyme, but constantly till they bee obtayned: Wherefore, in Pursuance of the Ends in the Covenant, and in the Discharge of that Trust which is committed to us, as likewise that some of our Number who are now to retourne into Scotland may bee able to give a further Account to the Parliament of that Kingdome, and to the Commissioners of the Generall Assembly as Edinburgh (both being now assembled), wee have taken this Occasion (without the least presenting to prescribe any Wayes or to impose any Conditions) to renew our most earnest Desires to the Honnorable Houses of Parliament, and to the Reverend Assembly of Divines, for their Part, that all possible Care may bee taken, and greater Diligence used, to expedite the begun Reformation and Uniformity, to supply and make upp those Parts that are yet wanting, and to put on and make effectuall what is already agreed upon. More particulerly wee doe desire that some effectuall Course may bee provided, by Ordinance of Parliament, for the takeing of the solemne League and Covenant by all Persons, as well as in all Places of this Kingdome, and some considerable Penalty or Punishment (such as the Honnorable Houses in their Wisdomes shall thinke fitt) may bee appointed for such as refuse to take it (much more for such as reproach it, or spake or writt against it); and that, by Authority of both Houses of the Parliament of England, the Covenant, Confession of Faith, Directory of Worshipp, Forme of Church Government, and Chatechisinge, may bee setled in Ireland as well as in England, according to the First Article of the solemne League and Covenant. Wee alsoe desire that the Chatechisme (now before the Assembly of Divines) may bee perfected soe soone as is possible; that the Confession of Faith may bee established by Authority of Parliament, and immediatly thereafter sent into Scotland (as the Directory of Worshipp was), to bee agreed unto by that Church and Kingdome, it being the cheifest Part of that Uniformity in Religion which both Kingdomes stand bound by Covenant to indeavor; that Course may bee taken for the better observing of the Directory of Worshipp, which is in many Places of this Kingdome either wholy or in diverse materiall Points neglected; and because the Singing of Psalmes in Churches is a Part of the Publique Worshipp of God, wee desire that the Paraphrase of the Psalmes in Metere, as it is now examined, corrected, and approved, by the Assembly of Divines here, and by the Commissioners of the Generall Assembly in Scotland, may bee likewise authorised and established by Ordinance of Parliament. Wee further desire that speciall Care and speedy Course may bee taken for the choosinge of Ruleing Elders, and the erecting of Classicall Presbyteryes and Congregationall Eldershipps throughout the whole Kingdome (these Things not beinge yet done except in some Places); and that the Censure of Excomunication, and some other Things belonging to the Meeting, Constitution, and Power, of Synods Nationall and Provinciall, and of the subordinate Ecclesiasticall Assemblyes, contayned in the Advise of the Reverend and Learned Assembly of Divines to both Houses of Parliament, and in our Remonstrance, dated March 26th, 1646, delivered alsoe to both Houses (which Things are not yet setled by Ordinance of Parliament), may bee taken into Consideration by the Honnorable Houses, and their Resolution knowne thereupon; and that in the meane while (as well before as after the full Setlement of Church Government) the Civill Power may (accordinge to the Word of God and the Example of godly Majestrates both of old and of late) proceed to the suppressinge of scandalous Doctrines or Practises, which are distructive to the Christian Faith, the Power of Godlynes, or the Peace of the Church, there being nothing more pernicious both to Church and State then the leaveinge of all Men to an Autonomy in Religion; for although it bee farr from our Thoughts to bee soe ridged as to desire, or, by Intention, Councell, or Suggestion, to bee accessary to the troublinge of pious and peaceable Men, who through Scruple of Conscience cannott in all Things come upp to the Rule of Church Government; and as it never was, soe it is not our Purpose, to make any Impediment to the forbeareing of such, soe farre as may agree with the Word of God, stand with the Publique Peace, and not bee structive to the Order and Government of the Church; yet wee cannott choose but discharge our Consciences, in respecting the extreame Necessity that some speedy and effectuall Remedy may bee provided against the seperatinge and withdrawinge from, or gathering Churches out of the true Reforming Churches of this Nation, as if Membershipp therein were unlawfull, as likewise against the Preaching of such as have neither received Ordination, nor have bin offered unto any orderly Tryall, and approved as Candidates or Probationaryes for the Ministry; and above all, against the Infection of pernicious Heresyes, which multiply, growe, and spraed daily more and more, to the greate Dishonnor of God, to the shaking of the very Foundations of the Christian Faith, to the seduceing and destroyinge of many poore Soules, to the hardning and strengthening of the comon Enemy, to the renting and dividinge of Church and State, to the scandalizinge of the Reformed Churches, and to the disappointing of the Ends of the Covenant; soe that it is now high Tyme to purge out (wee cannott say a little Leaven, but) that which hath already leavened a greate Part of the Lumpe, and may (if connived at) quickly leaven the Whole; for which Cause (the Danger being soe greate an imminent) wee cannott forgett to mention the pressing and urgent Necessity of restrayning effectually the unparalell'd scandalous lycentious Printing and Publishing of Bookes, both against Majestracy and Ministrey, and perticulerly against the Authority of Parliament, against the Reverend Assembly of Divines, against the Covenant, and the Publique Nationall Reformation, against the Union of the Kingdomes, against the Church and Kingdome of Scotland, and all the Reformed Churches, yea against Jesus Christ Himselfe, and the Sacred Word of God. All these Things lye sadd and heavy upon our Spiritts; yet wee doe not only pray, but trust that God will soe direct the Councells and prosper the Indeavors of the Honnorable Houses of Parliament, for the Reformation of Religion and Peace of the Church, that their Care and Zeale may appeare to bee greater for the Things of Christ then for their owne Things, to the Glory of God and of His Sonne Jesus Christ the only Head and King of His Church, to the strengthening of the Hearts and Hands of their Freinds, and to the stopping of the Mouthes of their Adversaryes.

"The Perticulers above expressed wee offer to the Honnorable and Reverend Committee, to bee represented to the Houses of Parliament; whose Resolution and Answere therein wee earnestly desire, not only for our owne Exoneration, that wee may seasonably give an Accompt of our Proceedings to those who have entrusted us, and doe expect a further Accompt from us, but alsoe for the Comfort and Encouragment of the Church and Kingdome of Scotland, who waite for and will looke upon the Progresse of the soe-much-desired Reformation and Uniformity in Religion as the cheifest and most comfortable Recompence of all their Paines, Hazards, and Suferings, and as the strongest and surest Bond for keeping fast and firme the happy Union and Conjunction of the Kingdomes against the common Enemyes, which hath bin, and shal bee, our earnest Prayer and faithfull Endeavor; being confident of our Brethren's reciprocall Affections, for continuinge and strengthening of this Union, and for transmitting it to the Generations following.

25 Dec. 1646.

"By Commaund of the Commissioners of the Church of Scotland."

"John Donn."

Remonstrance concerning the Distresses of the Scots Army in Ireland.

"For the Right Honnorable the Members of both Houses of the Committee of both Kingdomes, at Darby House.

"The humble Desires of Captaine Drumond, in Name of the Scotts Army in Ireland.

"The Extreamity of the Necessityes and misserable Condition of the Scottish Army in Ireland cannott bee but very well knowne to this Honnorable Committee; the Particulers whereof being in some Measure represented, both by Letters from the Army, dated Junii 29, as alsoe by a late Paper given in by the Commissioners of Scotland, in November, not yet reported to the Houses; to which he will subjoyne nothing: But whereas he hath bin imployed in Commission from that Army to informe the Honnorable Houses of Parliament of their greate Wants and Sufferings, and to present their Desires for Redresse thereof, and beinge referred by Order from the House of Commons to the Committee of Lords and Commons for Ireland, he hath there constantly attended neere the Space of Six Moneths, without receiveing any Answere to the Particulers delivered to them in Writinge concerning the Releife of that starved Army; yet such has bin his unfained Respects to the Honnorable Houses of Parliament, and sincere Affection to the Publique Service, that, in Expectation of a speedy Dispatch answereable to their present Necessityes he hath made Choise rather to transgresse the Tyme to which his Stay here is lymitted by his Commission, and, notwithstanding severall expresse Commaunds from those that sent him comaunding his Retourne, still to attend the Pleasure of the Houses, then to part from hence without any Answere at all, or such as could give them noe Hopes of Releife, but would undoubtedly have turned their languishinge Hopes into Dispaire, and without all Question produced sad Effects; which he, by his incouraging Letters, has all this Tyme laboured to prevent; and now, without very speedy Remedy bee applyed, cannott bee longer averted: And whereas, after soe long Attendance upon the Committee of Lords and Commons for Ireland, he hath lately received this Answere, That in regard the weighty Affaires of that Kingdome are intrusted by the Parliament to the Honnorable Members of both Houses of this Committee, that he is to make his Application hither, and from thence to receive his Dispatch; he is inforced to make it knowne here, That, unlesse he, with such Answere as this Honnorable Committee shall thinke fittinge, bee dispatched betwixt and the First of January next, he is necessitated and must forthwith repaire to that Army, to give unto them an Accompt of his Labours and Indeavors here, with the bad Successe thereof: And humbly leaves it to the Consideration of this Committee and the Honnorable Houses, what may bee the Event, and what Effects soe unsattisfactory a Report may worke in soe necessitous and distracted an Army; which as he trembles to thinke upon, soe he againe prayes and humbly requests that the Honnorable Houses will take it to their wise and most serious Consideration, that a speedy Answere may bee retourned to

"Your Honnors most humble Servaunt,

"W. Drumond."

Order for 5000 l. to L. Grey.

"Ordered, by the Lords and Commons assembled in Parliament, That Five Thousand Pounds be paid to William Lord Grey Baron of Warke, towards Satisfaction and Reparation of his Damages and Losses sustained by reason of these Troubles, and for his adhering to the Parliament, out of the First Monies that shall arise for the Fine set upon Sutton Esquire, for his Delinquency against the Parliament; and that, in the mean Time, until the said Five Thousand Pounds be raised by the Fine of the said Mr. Sutton as aforesaid, that the said Lord Grey shall receive and enjoy the Benefit and Profits of the Sequestration of the said Mr. Sutton's Estate, upon Accompt, towards Satisfaction and Payment of the said Five Thousand Pounds: And the Committees and Sequestrators, in whose Hands the Sequestration of the said Estate now is, are hereby authorized and required to pay the Profits arising from the said Sequestration unto the said Lord Grey, or his Assignee, in Manner and to the Purposes aforesaid."


House adjourned till 10a, Monday next.


  • 1. Deest in Originali.