House of Commons Journal Volume 1
31 May 1621

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1802

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'House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 31 May 1621', Journal of the House of Commons: volume 1: 1547-1629 (1802), pp. 632-634. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=2569 Date accessed: 19 April 2014. Add to my bookshelf


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Jovis, 31o Maii

Vanlore's Estate.

L. 1a. AN Act to make good a Conveyance of the Manor of Little Munden, in the County of Hertford, made by Peter Vanlore, Esquire, Sir Ch. Caesar Knight, and his Lady, to Edm. Woodhall, Gentleman.

Masters in Chancery.

Sir Julius Caesar, Knight, intreated to let all the Masters of the Chancery know, that the Judgment of this House is, that their Fees shall be no more taken for References ; nor judge Causes.

Sir Edw. Coke : - That the Master of the Rolls will acquaint them with the Order of the House, whereby their Privy Seal condemned. -

Brevia de cursu, which now Cursitors make; and Brevia magistralia, which made by the Masters; and Brevia remedialia, which brings a Fine to the King: - And therefore they to look to it. Some of them were Priests, and yet learned in the Laws ; as Fleta, and others, that were Bishops and Abbots, were also Judges. - That the Master of the Rolls should take out a Copy of the Order here, and see it performed.

Sir J. Caesar promiseth to do it accordingly. And he further intreated, that, if any shall complain of any Decrees or Injunctions against them, where no Bill or Answer, that these things may be reviewed.

Mr. Alford moveth, that most of the principal Bills are made to begin from the End of this Session of Parliament.

Sir Edw. Coke: - That never heard of any End of a Session, but the Statute of Continuance and Repeals, passed; and a Pardon, if Subsidy. -

That 1 H. VII. divers of the principal Lords were attainted by R. III. therefore, by Advice of the Judges, -

33o H. VIII. an Attainder of a Queen, yet no End of a Session. -

The Grievances not ready. - Proclamations for Seizure of Goods, Imprisonment, and that touch Men's Freeholds, greater, than any of the Grievances yet heard.

- Commissions unusual. -

A Petition of Right, to suppress Grievances. - To second this by Bill. This medicina promovens. This honourably to bury them. -

To preserve all Things in State, as now. - A Catalogue of all the State of the Bill. - Every Member to take a Copy, and meditate. - Not now to meddle with tendering the Grievances ; for cannot do it fully in One whole Week. - Instanceth in the Glass Business,

Sir Edw. Mountague concordat now for the Grievances.

- That the Council here may return the King Thanks, for his gracious Favour, in offering to receive our Grievances on Sunday next; yet to let him know, we cannot possibly do it.

Sir H. Poole : - To do this by ourselves. - So Mr. Hackwill. - To have the Catalogue of our Bills, that are passed both Houses, our House, or are ingrossed. -

No Question now, but we may adjourn ourselves. - Doubted, till Sir Edw. Hobby brought forth a Precedentof Queen M. Time. - Like, before, to be done by the Queen - 27o Eliz. a Commission, for Adjournment, read first in the Upper House, and then sent down to this House, by some Judges, and the Master of the Rolls ; and, after they were gone, then this House adjourned itself. - That a Committee appointed, to consider of the Laws, during that Session. -

That the Parliament still continueth, upon an Adjournment ; therefore we, and our Servants, privileged from Arrests : Wages of Knights and Burgesses continueth.

11o R. II. a special Act passed the Royal Assent, but yet a Saving in it, that the passing it should be End of a Session. -

33o H. VIII. - That when the King giveth his Royal Assent to any Bill, that maketh it a Session; therefore, in the Act for Queen K. Execution, a special Provision in the Bill, -

That accordingly, in Queen Marye's Time, an End of a Session made of Purpose, for the Passing a Bill; and they began another, within Three Days after.- -

Thinketh the Difference to be, when a Bill passeth the Royal Assent, and yet the House sitteth after, there no End of a Session ; contra, where the Royal Assent at the End, and the House sitteth not after it.

Sir Edw. Coke: - Regularly every Court is to adjourn itself. - To consider therefore, whether the Commission be to Commissioners only, to adjourn, or to Commissioners and the * To confer of this with the Lords : For a Matter of great Weight to the House.

Sir Sam. Sands: - The King having propounded an Adjournment, that [likely] to be fittest; Danger else of the Bill of Continuance and Repeal of Statutes. - No great Use of the End of a Session. The Bills, we can have now, not much useful for the principal of the Commonwealth; viz. Means to live, for the Subject, and, out of their Livelihood, to supply the King's Wants. - The Adjournments to be made severally by the Houses. The Commissions but declaratory of the King's Pleasure. - To confer with the Lords, to this End : And that Catalogues may be made of the Businesses of both Houses, that so they may not perish in the Interim, through Negligence.

Mr. Secretary: - To view the Commission 27o Eliz. whether it be only declaratory, or absolute to adjourn it; that so we may accordingly apply ourselves to it.

Mr. Solicitor: - 1. To agree, who to speak at the Conference: 2ly, Whether an Adjournment, or Prorogation: 3ly, Whether to offer now any Bills, Grievances, either, or neither : 4ly, To acquaint the King with the Cause, why we cannot now present either : 5ly, To view the Commission; that, if that be prejudicial to our Liberties, we may intreat the King to do nothing now to wrong our Liberties.

Sir D. Digges (named by Sir Edw. Cecil for the Speaker) excuseth himself. - To acquaint the Lords with the great Decay of Trade, Want of Money, &c. Not to refuse Bills; if we may have them.

Resolved, Sir D. Digges shall be the Speaker at this Conference with the Lords.

Sir Edw. Mountague: - Is now of Opinion., at this Time no Bills: And thinketh, the Country will be so best satisfied ; because the Parliament still sitteth, notwithstanding this Adjournment: The other may prove dangerous.

Sir Ro. Phillippes, accordant; - And now to hear the Lords, what they will propound ; and then return hither, and, knowing the Pleausure of the House, then return them Answer, as they dealt with us Yesterday.

Sir Edw. Coke : - The Commission must be only declaratory of the King's Pleasure ; but the Court must adjourn. - To propound this to the Lords, and advise about it; and to desire to see the Commission of 27 Eliz.

Sir Tho. Row: - No Bills. - To propound to the Lords the short Heads of the Want of Money ; wherein there may be something done this Vacation of Parliament.

Mr. Weston : - To take what Bills we can give.

[Mr. Neale,] accordant; Mr. Salter, contra: So Mr. Denny.

Sir Nath. Rich: - To propound, and debate now distinctly, what we shall desire the Lords to join with us in.

Sir Geor. Manners: - That the East India Company may be restrained from exporting any Money.

Mr. Secretary: - That now the only Thing, to be treated [of] in the Conference, is, Bills, or no Bills; for the Commission appeareth to be by absolute Power, and not declaratory only. Therefore the King resolved to hold the same Course now, and wisheth not to meddle in it. - To present Bills ; because we of that Desire at first, and now may have them.

Mr. Mallett: - No Bills now; because doubtful, whether that will end a Session, or not.

Mr. Towerson: - NoBills, nor Grievances: - No Cause of Sorrow, or Discontent.

Sir Tho. Row: - That the Ordnance-makers have now great Store of Ordnance in their Hands. - That, in this Conference with the Lords, we may propound, to have some Course for Stay of all Ordnance within this Kingdom, till the next Access.

Mr. Delbridge: - To propound, in this Conference, the Decay of Trade ; and that, till the next Access, all Merchants may have free Trade. - That the Excess of Impositions extreme: 25 in the C. inward and outward ; 2s. 8d. now upon a Bays, not worth above 20s. where heretofore but 2s. upon a Bays, worth 3 or 4l. 1000 Looms, where now but 200.

Master of the Wards: - That, for the Decay of Trade in Barnstaple, alleged by Mr. Dellbridge, he enquired, and found, not the Custom, but the Trade, double to what in Queen Eliz. Time. - That Trade, in the general, not declined : as great as ever, but not so good, 160,000l. for the. Custom : Not 5000l. per Annum Difference in Three Years. - That the Wars in Fraunce may now much hinder the West Country; but the King cannot yet help this. - Will, against the next Access, prepare a Particular of all the Particulars, what every Port exporteth, but in Quantity and Quality, and what imported to every Port, both in Quantity and Quality.

Sir Edw. Sands agreeth to an Adjournment, without Grievances, or Bills. - Not to palliate here, with the King, but to make to the King a true Remonstrance of the State of the Kingdom; but, in the Country, when we come down, to palliate, and excuse the best we can.

Royal Assent to Bills, not to determine Session.

Mr. Attorney-general and Sir Wm. Byrd bring, from the Lords, a Bill, that this Session shall not determine by his Majesty's Royal Assent to some Bills. - And, that they recommend it to this House, as a Bill very necessary ;

and desire Speed :

Conference concerning Adjournment.

And, that the Lords desire a Re-conference, about the Businesess Yesterday propounded, between both Houses, at Three of the Clock this Afternoon, in the Painted Chamber.

Answer, by the same Messengers, that the free Re-conference yielded to by this House, as is desired.

Sir D. Digges: - l. To hear, and not propose : 2ly, The inclination of the House, an Adjournment, no Session - No Grievances to be meddled with to them. - The Inclination of the House against any Bills to be now presented. - That, if Occasion be, to be delivered, and our Reasons ; viz. 1. The Honour of his Majesty, and to prevent Misconstructions in the Country : 2ly, to maintain the Reputation of the Honour of the House of Parliament, [that,] in so long Time, hath done no more: 3ly, The Contentment of the People, by a speedy Hope of Ease and Redress : 4ly, Because many of the best Bills take Commencement from the End of this Session of Parliament.

Master of the Wards : - Against the first Three Reasons because we, upon the first Message, desired Passage of Bills : - Cannot now [be] well taken, to refuse them, when the King offereth them. -

That hath heard, the Bills of Informers, and Certiorari's wo* a Pardon.

Here there beginning some Heat between the Master of the Wards, Sir Edw. Sands, Mr. Delbridge, and Sir P. Hamond ; the same appeared to arise, by Mistaking of each other's Speeches; and all of them, by the general Voice of the House, were freed from having spoken any thing unfitly.

Mr. Hopton secondeth Sir Tho. Rowe's Motion: - And to move the Lords, at this Conference, to petition the King, that there shall, in this Interim, be no Transportation of Ordnance, or Money : And to provide for Freedom of Trade.

Sir H. Withrington : - To appoint a Committee, to set down the Heads of what shall be propounded in the Conference.

Sir D. Digges: - To have the Manner of the Adjournment propounded to the Lords. - Resolved.

Mr. Hackwill, with Precedents. -

To confer, upon Passing of Bills, or not; and the Reasons and Objections of the House against it; but not concluding.

Sir D. Digges to have Power to Open to the Lords, by way of Declaration, of the Danger may grow to this Kingdom, during this Recess, by Transportation of Ordnance, by Exportation of Coin, and by Want of Freedom of Trade ; for which we were in hand to provide Remedies by Bills: And therefore to advise with their Lordships, of the fittest Course to be now taken, for Redress herein, until the next Access.

Jovis, 31 Maii. Post meridiem.

Conference concerning Adjournment.

SIR D. Digges, - from the Re-conference, that the Lord Treasurer read to them a Catalogue of all the Bills. That he let the Lords know, they could now conclude nothing, without Direction from the House. That a Catalogue of our Bills here was read. - Propounded the Course of Adjournment. - That, being pressed, to know what Bills we would chuse, was forced to let them know the Doubt of this House, whether now to desire any Bills, or no. - That we had spent great Time about Matter of Trade.

Continuing the Session.

Mr. Beecher: - To read the Bill for Continuance of the Session, notwithstanding the Passing of Bills now.