DIE Veneris, 14 die Februarii.
PRAYERS, by Mr. Rayner.
Ds. Grey de Warke, Speaker.
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Answer from the H. C.
Sir Edward Leech, &c. sent with a Message to the
House of Commons Yesterday, return with this Answer:
That they will send an Answer by Messengers of their
Ives to discover the chief of those who endeavoured to get a Petition to the Commissioners for the Treaty; and Mr. Kempe to be attached.
Ordered, That Robert Ives, who voluntarily tendered himself to this House, shall enter into Bond of,
Two Hundred Pounds, to endeavour to find out the
chief Actors of those that endeavoured to draw Multitudes of People (fn. *) to sign a Petition to the Commissioners
at Uxbridge, and afterwards to render himself a true
Prisoner to this House, if it be required by this House.
Ordered, That Mr. Kempe, of Wickham, shall be attached by the Gentleman Usher attending this House,
and kept in safe Custody until this House gives further
Committee for treating with the Swedish Agent.
The Earl of Manchester reported from the Committee
of both Kingdoms, "That the said Committee finds
that the Power that hath been given to this Committee, concerning the receiving of the Propositions
of the Swedish Agent, may be enlarged to a Power
to treat with him, and prepare Things to be offered to
both Houses, if the Houses shall so think fit."
Upon this Report, this House Agreed to give the said
Committee the Power aforesaid; and Ordered, To desire the House of Commons Concurrence herein.
Ordinance for swearing the Sheriff of Lancashire.
The Ordinance brought from the House of Commons Yesterday, concerning swearing the Sheriff of
Lancashire, was read Twice, and Ordered to be committed to the Consideration of these Lords following:
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Any Five, to meet on Monday next, in the Afternoon, at Three a Clock.
Message from the H. C for a further Conference on the Ordinance for putting the Army under the Command of Sir T. Fairfax, &c.
A Message was brought from the House of Commons,
by Sir Rob't Pye Knight &c.
To desire a Free Conference, concerning the late Conference touching the Ordinance for the new Model of
the Army, at such Time as their Lordships shall think
fit; and also to communicate some Things to their Lordships concerning the Forces under Sir Wm. Waller.
Graves's and Balfore's Regiments mutiny.
The Lord General acquainted this House with a Letter from Colonel Graves; signifying, "That Sir Wm.
Balfore's Regiment and his Regiment mutinied, and
refused to march with Sir Wm. Waller."
Message to the H. C. for a Conference about it.
Ordered, That this Letter be communicated to the
House of Commons, at the next Conference; and desire that some speedy Course may be taken, to prevent
And accordingly a Message was sent to the House of
Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Dr. Aylett, to this
The Answer returned was:
That this House will give a present Free Conference,
as is desired, in the Painted Chamber.
Ordinance concerning Jersey.
Next, the Lord Admiral reported from the Committee the Ordinance concerning the Isle of Jersey, as
fit to pass as it is; which being read the Third Time,
it was approved of; and Ordered, To be communicated to the House of Commons, and desire their Concurrence to it.
The Lord Admiral, Earl Manchester, and the Lord
Wharton, are appointed to report the Conference.
The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the
Lords went to the Conference; which being (fn. *) ended,
the House was resumed.
Report of the Conference concerning the Ordinance for putting the Army under the Command of Sir T. Fairfax, and for new modeling it.
The Earl of Manchester reported the Conference (fn. †) ,
to this Effect:
"That the Occasion of this Conference was, concerning the last Additions to the Proviso in the Ordinance for the new Model of the Army, which consisted of Two Parts: The Manner of the taking the
Covenant by the Officers and Soldiers, to which the
House of Commons Agreed to: The Second Part
was the disabling Part, to which they did not Agree to,
because the Proviso for taking the Covenant was far
stronger as they brought up altered before; yet their
Lordships sent them a new additional Clause, with
a Penalty inflicted, which is in no other Case inflicted;
and it is a Clause of an unusual Nature, for it puts
the Officers in an Incapability of further Employment, and so disables (fn. ‡) them forever. Besides, they
hold it inconvenient to enjoin it with a Penalty of
Disabling, in regard of the Time, when at this Time
many Officers refuse to obey the Commands of Parliament, as, they said, would appear by a Letter from
the Commissioners for mustering the General's Army,
and a Letter from Sir Wm. Waller, and another from
Colonel Graves; which being read, Mr. Browne said,
That in the Proviso there is sufficient Course taken
for those as shall refuse to take the Covenant, without the disabling Part; that the House of Commons
were of the same Mind as their Lordships were, that
all shall take the Covenant; they will derogate nothing from the Covenant; only differ, not to disable
all that will not take the Covenant: There is Care
(fn. ‡) taken in the Proviso, that such as refuse their Names
shall be returned to the Houses; and then will be a
Time to consider what to do with them.
"But, if it be objected that both Houses have excluded their Members respectively from sitting in the
House until they have taken the Covenant, (fn. ||) why
then not a disabling for the Officers in the Army?
Which may receive this Answer, That, though the
Houses will not admit Men to be of their Counsels
before they have taken it, yet they may admit Men to
be their Servants. Therefore the House of Commons desired their Lordships Concurrence in the
Proviso, without the disabling Part; and that the
Letters may be referred to the Consideration of the
Committee of both Kingdoms, to take some speedy
Resolved, upon the Question, That the Debate of the
Reasons of this Conference concerning the Ordinance
for the Model of the Army shall be deferred until Tomorrow Morning.
Ordered, That the Consideration of the Three Letters be referred to the Committee of both Kingdoms.
Answer to the H. C. concerning this Conference.
The Answer to be returned to the House of Commons was:
To let them know, that, this Business being of great
Consequence, their Lordships have put off the Debate
of it till To morrow Morning, and then their Lordships
will take it into speedy Consideration; and that this
House agreed to refer the Consideration of the Three
Letters to the Committee of both Kingdoms.
The Lords went into the Painted Chamber, to give
the House of Commons this Answer as aforesaid.
House adjourned till 9a cras.