House of Lords Journal Volume 8
25 January 1647

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1767-1830

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'House of Lords Journal Volume 8: 25 January 1647', Journal of the House of Lords: volume 8: 1645-1647 (1767-1830), pp. 686-688. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=34198 Date accessed: 01 August 2014.


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DIE Lunæ, 25 die Januarii

PRAYERS, by Mr Sallowey

Domini præsentes fuerunt

Comes Manchester, Speaker

Comes Northumb
Comes Worwicke
Comes Kent
Comes Midd
Comes Lyncolne
Comes Suffolke
Comes Rutland
Ds Grey
Ds North
Ds Howard
Ds Maynard
Ds Hunsdon
Ds Willoughby
Ds Berkeley

Letter &c from the Parliament of Scotland

The Speaker acquainted the House, "That this Morning he received a Letter from the Parliament of Scotland, which was opened, and read, and likewise a Declaration and another Paper were read

(Here enter them)

The House was adjourned into a Committee during Pleasure, to read them, and take the particular Desires into Consideration

The House was resumed

Votes concerning the Safety of the Kings Person, and the Succession and that there shall be no Change in the Constitution

And the House expressed their Sense upon these Particulars by these Votes

"Resolved, That there be no Harm, Prejudice, Injury, nor Violence, done to His Royal Person

Resolved, That there be no Change of Government, other than has been these Three Years past

Resolved, That His Posterity be in no Ways prejudiced in their lawful Succession to the Crown and Government of these Kingdoms"

The Question being put, "Whether these Votes now expressed shall be sent in a Letter to the Kingdom of Scotland?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative

Desires of the Scots for the King to be pressed to agree to the Propositions;

1 The House was adjourned into a Committee during Pleasure, and the Desire of the Kingdom of Scotland was read, "That a Committee of both Kingdomes be appointed to attend His Majesty, and presse Him further for granting the Propositions of Peace, and in case of His Refusall, to advise and determine what is further necessary for continuing and strengthning the Union betwixt the Kingdoms according to the Covenant and Treaties, and that no Peace nor Agreement be made ether Kingdome with the Kinge without the other, according to the late Treaty betwixt the Kingdomes"

Agreed to

For those Scot who have Places about the King to keep them;

2 That such of the Scottish Nation as hes Place or Charge about the Kinge (excepting such as stand excepted in the Propositions of Peace) may attend and exercise the same, and that none shall be debaried from having Accesse to attend His Majesty who have Warrard from the Parliament of ether Kingdom respectively, or from the Comittee of ether Parliament thereunto authorised"

for each Kingdom to assist the other,

3 It is desired, that one Kingdom assist the other, in case they be troubled from within or from without for this Agreement"

Agreed to

and for an Allowance to support their Forces employed against the Irish Rebells.

4 That the Kingdome of England would speedily condiscend and agree upon some Competency of Entertainment for the Forces which we are necessitated to keepe up to suppresse the Irish Rebeils, whom b the large Treaty they are bound to suppresse"

Message to the H. C. to sit awhile

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Mr Hakewill

To desire them they would fit a while, for their Lordships have some Business of Consequence to impart to them

Resolutions concerning the Desires of the Scots.

To the First Cause of the Second Desire, it is Resolved, That, when the King's House comes to be settled, their Lordships will do that which shall be thought fit, Regard being had to this Desire of the Parliament of Scotland

To the Second Clause of the Second Desire, it is Resolved, That this House agrees to the Second Clause of the Second Desire, with this Addition, "That when any Committee or Commissioners from the Kingdom of Scotland have Occasion to address themselves to the King, that they first give Notice thereof to the Committee or Commissioners of the Parliament of England"

Resolved, That this House agrees to the Third Desire

To the Fourth Desire, it is Resolved, That the House have been, and will be, ready to make good the Treaty between the Two Kingdoms, and will be ready to confer with any Committee as they shall authorize, concerning the Particulars

These Papers to be communicated to the H. C. and an Answer to the Scots to be prepared.

Ordered, That the Papers received this Day be communicated to the House of Commons, at a Conference, and acquaint them with the Votes of this House thereupon, and desire their Concurrence therein, and in case they shall agree, then to let them know, that this House thinks it fit that a Committee be appointed to frame the said Votes into a Letter, to be sent unto the Parliament of Scotland, in Answer thereunto

Committee to join with One of the H. C. for that Purpose

The House nominated these Lords following, to join with a proportionable Number of the House of Commons, for the Purpose aforesaid

Comes Warwicke.
Comes Northumb.
L Viscount Say & Seale
Comes Lyncolne
Comes Manchester
Ds North

Any Three.

Message to be H. C. for a Conference about it; and to sit P.M.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Edward Leech and Mr Hakewill

1 To desire they would fit this Afternoon

2 To desire a Conference, in the Painted Chamber, this Afternoon, at Four of the Clock, concerning some Papers received from the Kingdom of Scotland

Steward and De Franchi.

Ordered, That the Judges Report concerning Mr Steward's Business shall be taken into Consideration on Saturday Morning, and Counsel be heard, if it be de sired, concerning the same

Goring House to be prepared for the Fr. Ambassador.

The Speaker acquainted the House, "That Monseu Belheure, the French Ambassador, sent to him, to him know of his coming to London, and that, soon as his Attendants and Accommodations com from Newcastle, he intends to desire Audience of the Houses"

Hereupon it is Ordered, That the House of Commons be put in Mind of the former Message sent down to them, for Goringe (fn. *) house to be made ready for him

Letter from the Parliament of Scotland, with the following Declaration and Desires.

For the Right Honnorable the Speaker of the House of Peeres; to bee comunicated to both Houses of the Parliament of England assembled at Westm'r.

Right Honnorable,

Our Commissioners at London and Newcastle haveinge receaved from the Honnorable Houses the Vote of the First of January, and communicate the same to us, wee have considered of it as a Business of very greate Concernment to both Nations; and therefore have resolved upon the enclosed Declaration and Desires, whereby it will appeare how willing wee are to comply with the Resolutions of both Houses, how desireous to remove all Jealousyes, for strengtheninge the Peace and Union, and maintayninge a good Understanding betwixt the Kingdomes, soe firmely tyed by solemne League and Covenant; and how confident that they will sattisfy our reasonable Desires, and make the Integrity of their Proceedings and Resolutions in all this Business concerninge His Majesty appeare, either by Declaration or otherwayes, as in their Wisdome they shall thinke fitt, whereby noe Occasion of Calumny may bee left to the wicked Enemyes of either Nation. And as God hes blessed the joynt Endeavors of both dureinge our Armyes Aboad in that Kingdome soe it will bee a greate Encouragment for us to hope for the Continuance of the same Blessing for Tymes comeing, that our Resolutions bee knowne to bee one, att our Removeinge, in relation to all the Ends contayned in our mutuall League and Covenant: And if any Difficulty occure there (for gaininge of Tyme), wee desire that the Honnorable Houses may bee pleased to send particular Instructions to their Commissioners at Newcastle, with whome wee shall authorize ours to concurre, for the just Sattisfaction of both Kingdomes. Wee rest

Your affectionate Freind and Servaunt,

Ed'r. 16 Januarii, 1647.

"Crafurd Lindsay,

"Pr't Parliament.

For the Parliament of England."

Declaration of the Kingdom of Scotland, for the Safety of the King's Person, and the Succession in his Family; and approving of His being removed to Holdenby.

"Declaration of the Kingdome of Scotland.

Whereas it pleased God to joyne the Kingdomes of Scotland, England, and Ireland, in a solemne League and Covenant, for Reformation and Defence of Religion, the Honnor and Happines of the King, and their owne Peace and Safety, and, in Pursuance thereof, the Scottish Army being in the Kingdome of England, the King's Majesty came to their Quarters before Newarke, and professed He came there with a full and absolute Intention to give all just Sattisfaction to the joynt Desires of both Kingdomes, and with noe Thought either to continue this unnaturall Warre any longer, or to make Devision betwixt the Kingdomes; but to comply with His Parliaments, and those entrusted by them, in every Thinge, for setling of Truth and Peace, and that He would apply Himselfe totally to the Councells and Advises of His Parliaments; which He did not only professe verbally to the Committee of Estates with the Scottish Army, but alsoe in His severall Letters and Declarations under His Hand to the Committee of Estates of Scotland, and unto the Two Houses of the Parliament of England, respectively: In Consideration whereof, and of the Reallity of His Intentions and Resolutions, which He declared did proceed from noe other Ground then the deepe Sense of the bleeding Condition of His Kingdomes, the Committees of the Kingdome of Scotland and Generall Officers of the Scottish Army declared, to Himselfe and to the Kingdome of England, their receiveinge of His Royall Person to bee in these Tearmes (which is the Truth, notwithstandinge what may bee suggested or alleadged to the contrairy by any within or without this Kingdome); and presented to Him, that the only Way of His owne Happines, and Peace of His Kingdomes, under God, was to make good His Professions soe solemnly renewed to both Kingdomes: Thereafter; not only were Propositions of Peace (which after serious and mature Deliberation were agreed upon) tendred to Him in the Name of both Kingdomes, for His Royall Assent thereunto; but alsoe (fn. *) the Chiefe Judicatoryes of this Kingdome, both Civill and Ecclesiastick, made their humble and earnest Addresses to His Majesty, by Supplications, Letters, and Commissioners for that End, and fully represent all the Prejudices and Inconveniencyes of the Delay or Refusall of His Assent; and in perticuler, that this Kingdome would bee necessitated to joyne with the Kingdome of England, conforme to the League and Covenant, in providing for the present and future Security of both Kingdomes, and setling the Government of both, as might most conduce to the Good of both. And the Parliament of Scotland, being now to retire their Army out of England, have againe, for their further Exoneration, sent Commissioners to represent their renewed Desires to His Majesty, with the Danger may ensue by His Delay or Refusall to graunt the same; and that, till then, there was Danger to the Cause, to His Majesty, to this Kingdome, and to the Union betwixt the Kingdomes, by His comeing into Scotland; and that therefore there would bee a joynt Course taken by both Kingdomes concerning the Disposall of His Person: And considering that His Majesty, by His Answere to the Propositions of Peace in August last, and alsoe by His late Message sent to the Two Houses, and by His Warrant communicated to the Estates of this Kingdome, hes expressed His Desires to bee neare to the Two Houses of Parliament; and seing alsoe the Parliament of England have communicated to the Scotts Commissioners at Newcastle, and by them to this Kingdome, their Resolution that Holdenby House, in the County of Northampton, is the Place which the Houses thinke fitt for the King to come unto, there to remaine with such Attendants aboute Him as both Houses of Parliament shall appoint, with Respect had to the Safety and Preservation of His Royall Person, in the Preservation and Defence of the true Religion and Libertyes of the Kingdomes according to the Covenant: Therefore, and in regard of His Majesty's not giveing a sattisfactory Answere to the Propositions as yet, and out of their earnest Desire to keepe a right Understanding betwixt the Kingdomes, to prevent new Troubles within the same, to sattisfy the Desire of His Majesty, of the Two Houses of the Parliament of England, and of this Kingdome, for His Residence in some of His Houses neere the Parliament of England, to prevent Misinformation, and to give Sattisfaction to all, the Estates of the Parliament of the Kingdome of Scotland doe declare their Concurrence for the King's Majesty' goeing to Holdenby House, or some other of His Houses in or aboute London as shal bee thought fitt, there to remaine untill He give Sattisfaction to both Kingdomes in the Propositions of Peace; and that, in the Interim, there bee noe Harme, Prejudice, Injury, nor Violence, done to His Royall Person; that there bee noe Change of Government, other then hes bin these Three Yeares past; and that His Posterity bee in noe Wayes prejudiced in their lawfull Succession to the Crowne and Government of these Kingdomes. And as this is the cleere Intention and full Resolution of the Kingdome of Scotland, according to their Interest and Duty, in relation to the King's Majesty, soe they are confident (from the same Grounds and manifold De clarations of the Parliament of England) that the same is the Resolution of their Brethren; and at such a Tyme they doe expect a renewed Declaration thereof, and that they will give brotherly and just Sattisfaction to the Desires herewith sent; like as the Kingdome of Scotland doe hereby assure their Brethren of England, that it shal bee their constant Indeavor to keepe, continue, and strengthen, the Union and Peace betwixt the Kingdomes, according to the Covenant and Treatyes, extracted from the Records of Parliament, subscribed by the Earle of Crafurd and Lindesay, High Treasurer of Scotland, and President to the Parliament; wittnessinge thereunto the Subscription and Signe Manuell of me, Sir Alexand'r Gibsone of Dury Knight, Clerke of our Soveraigne's Rolls, Register, and Councell.

"Alex. Gibsone,
Cl's Reg'ri."

Their Desires for the Propositions to be pressed to the King, for the Scots about the King to hold their Places, &c.

"Desires of the Kingdome of Scotland.

"That the Committee of both Kingdomes bee appointed to attend His Majesty, and pressing Him further for graunting the Propositions of Peace; and, in case of His Refusall, to advise and determine what is further necessary, for continueinge and strengthening the Union betweene the Kingdomes, according to the Covenant and Treatyes; and that noe Peace nor Agreement bee made by either Kingdome with the King without the other, according to the late Treaty betwixt the Kingdomes.

"Next it is desired, that such of the Scottish Nation as hath Place or Charge aboute the King (excepting such as stand excepted in the Propositions of Peace) may attend and exercise the same; and that none shal bee debarred from haveing Accesse to attend His Majesty, who have Warrant from the Parliaments of either Kingdome respectively, or from the Committee of either Parliament thereunto authorised.

"It is desired, that the One Kingdome assist the other, in case they bee troubled from within or from without, for this Agreement.

"That the Kingdome of England would speedily condiscend and agree upon some Competency of Entertainment for the Forces which wee are necessitated to keepe upp, to suppresse the Irish Rebells, whome by the large Treaty they are bound to suppresse.

Ed. 16 Janu. 1647.

"Craford & Linsey,
Pre. Par."

Post meridiem.

PRAYERS, by Mr. Sallawey.

Domini præsentes fuerunt:

Comes Manchester, Speaker.

Comes Kent.
Comes Midd.
Comes Rutland.
Comes Suffolke.
L. Viscount Say & Seale.
Comes Warwicke.
Comes Northumb.
Ds. Howard.
Ds. Willoughby.
Ds. North.
Ds. Hunsdon.
Ds. Maynard.
Ds. Bruce.
Ds. Dacres.

Answer from the H. C.

Sir Edward Leech and Mr. Hakewill return with this Answer:

That the House of Commons will sit this Afternoon, and give a Conference, as is desired; and they will send an Answer to the rest by Messengers of their own.

Heads for the Conference about the Declaration, &c. from the Scots.

The Speaker, at this Conference, is to let them know, "That this House hath received a Letter, with a Declaration and Desires from the Parliament of Scotland, which their Lordships take as a great Testimony of their Reality and Faithfulness; upon which this House hath made Votes, wherein the Concurrence of the House of Commons is desired; and if they shall agree therein, to let them know, that this House hath named a Committee of Six Lords, to draw up a Letter, according to those Votes, to be sent to the Parliament of Scotland; and desire they would nominate a proportionable Number of their House, to join with them therein, and to meet as soon as may (fn. *) be, that so the Answer may be sent away speedily, in regard the Scotts Garrison do quit Newcastle on Saturday next."

The House of Commons being ready in the Painted Chamber, the House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed.

Eales's Suit against the Stationers stayed, for seizing scandalous Books in his Shop.

This Day Eales and the Master and Wardens of the Company of Stationers were called in, to know upon what Ground the said Eales arrested the Stationers.

And it appeared by the Declaration, that the Action was for Battery.

And it was alledged by the Stationers, "That it was because they proceeded in seizing of scandalous Books, according to an Ordinance of Parliament."

And the Question being put, "Whether to stay the Proceedings at Law, till this House be more fully informed of the Business?"

It was Resolved in the Affirmative.

Adjourn.

House adjourned till 10a cras.

Footnotes

Deest in Originali
* Deest in Originali
* Origin. to the.
* Deest in Originali.