House of Lords Journal Volume 4
5 August 1641

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1767-1830

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'House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 5 August 1641', Journal of the House of Lords: volume 4: 1629-42 (1767-1830), pp. 341-344. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=35667 Date accessed: 21 August 2014.


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Contents

DIE Jovis, videlicet, 5 die Augusti.
Lord Rich's Privilege. Camock arrested. Durham House Bill. Exchange between the Bp. of Durham and E. of Pembroke. Message from the H. C. touching the Impeachment of the Judges. Answer. Lords to report the Conference. Lady Marleigh's Petition for Privilege, about her Recusancy. Conference concerning the Six Judges reported. Message to the H. C. that the Lords will proceed in the Impeachment of the Six Judges. Judges that are impeached not to go Circuits. Lord Bruce introduced. Report from the Committee to draw up Propositions for a Conference concerning a Regency. Message to the H. C. for a Conference concerning the Regency. Committee for Defence of the Kingdom. Dependency of Ireland on this Kingdom. The King's Answer about staying the Irish Business till their Letter is considered. Answer from the H. C. Lords to report the Conference. Sir Wm. Middleton's Petition about cutting the Banks of the New River. Delinquents sent for. Committee for Trade. Conference about the Regency reported. Steward's Petition. Message from the H. C. to sit P. M. Answer. Printed Paper concerning the Protestation. Adjourn. Post meridiem. Bill to prevent Riots in the Fens in Lincolnshire. Durham House Bill. Exchange between the Bishop of Durham and E. of Pembroke. Justice Heath's Petition about the Manor of Solam. Message from the H. C. for a Conference about disbanding the Armies. Answer. Lords to report the Conference. Conference reported. Money due to Durham, Newcastle, and Northumberland. Report of the Scots Propositions. The English Lords Commissioners Answer. Propositions and Answers approved of. Adjourn. Footnotes

DIE Jovis, videlicet, 5 die Augusti.

PRAYERS.

Lord Rich's Privilege.

Camock arrested.

Upon Complaint made this Day to this House, "That Thomas Camocke, menial Servant to the Right Honourable the Lord Rich, a Member of this House, was arrested, at the Suit of Thomas Phillips, by one Henry Sims, Serjeant, contrary to the Privileges of Parliament:" Hereupon it is Ordered, That the said Thomas Camocke shall be forthwith released, and be free from his present Restraint or Imprisonment; and that the said Tho. Phillips and Henry Sims shall be sent for, to answer the said Complaint in this House.

Durham House Bill.

Exchange between the Bp. of Durham and E. of Pembroke.

Hodie 1a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for the assuring of a Messuage, called Duresme House, alias Durham House, and certain Stables, Part of the Possession of the Bishop of Duresme, situate in the Parish of St. Martyn's in the Fields, in the County of Midd. unto the Right Honourable Phillip Earl of Pembrooke and Mountgomery, and his Heirs, and of a Yearly Rent of One Hundred and Forty Pounds per Annum, to the said Bishop of Duresm and his Successors, in Lieu thereof.

A Message was sent from the House of Commons, by Sir Tho. Barrington:

Message from the H. C. touching the Impeachment of the Judges.

To desire a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, touching the Impeachment of the Judges.

Answer to the said Message was:

Answer.

That their Lordships will give a present Meeting, in the Painted Chamber, as is desired.

Lords to report the Conference.

The Lord Privy Seal, the Lord Bishop of Lincolne, and the Lord Roberts, were appointed to report the Conference.

Lady Marleigh's Petition for Privilege, about her Recusancy.

Upon the Petition of the Lady Margerett Wooton, Baroness of Marleigh, complaining of an Indictment and Conviction of Recusancy prosecuted against her, contrary to Privilege of Parliament; it is Ordered, That a Certiorari do issue forth, to return the Indictment into this House; and that a Writ of Error may also be brought, to reverse the Conviction, if any Error shall be found therein; whereupon their Lordships will proceed according as they shall think fit.

Then this House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Lord Bishop of Lincolne reported the Conference, to this Effect:

Conference concerning the Six Judges reported.

"That the House of Commons had formerly brought up Six Impeachments against Six several Judges, One whereof was for High Treason; the Proofs of which Impeachments will not arise from Witnesses, but out of Records, which have been voted by this House already to be illegal, &c. It was further said, That the House of Commons do understand, that several Commissions are lately made to these Judges, who are impeached for divers Misdemeanors, to go Circuit in several Counties of this Kingdom; but they conceive that their Names will be unacceptable, and their Persons unwelcome; and, being thus impeached, to become Judges of Mens Lives and Estates, will be a Thing of great Offence and Distraction.

"Therefore the House of Commons desired, That all the Commissions granted to the peccant Judges may be superseded; and that their Names may be no more used in Commissions; and, when the great Affairs now in Agitation be dispatched, they desired their Lordships to take their Impeachments into Consideration, and proceed therein according to Justice."

Ordered, That this House consents to both these Requests of the House of Commons, touching the aforesaid Judges.

Then a Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Rich and Sir Edward Leech:

Message to the H. C. that the Lords will proceed in the Impeachment of the Six Judges.

To let the House of Commons know, That their Lordships have agreed, that the peccant Judges shall not be put into any Commissions; and that, as soon as this House is at Leisure, their Lordships will proceed in their Impeachments.

Judges that are impeached not to go Circuits.

Ordered, That the Lord Keeper do take Care that the Judges which are impeached have no Commission to go Circuits; and, if any be granted already, to recall them.

Lord Bruce introduced.

This Day the Lord Bruce was introduced in his Robes, brought in between the Lord Kymbolton and the Lord Howard de Charlton; and, having delivered his Writ and his Patent, dated the 2d of August 1641, they were delivered to the Clerk; and his Writ being read, he (fn. *) was brought, by the Lord Great Chamberlain, the Earl Marshal, and Garter, and placed upon the Seat as the lowest Baron.

Report from the Committee to draw up Propositions for a Conference concerning a Regency.

After this, the Lord Keeper reported the Heads which the Committee drew up Yesterday, for to be propounded to the House of Commons at the Conference, being the Particulars that are thought fit the Commissioners should have Power to pass in the King's Absence, if Need be, and to be expressed in a Commission to be granted to certain Lords, who are to (fn. *) be enabled by a Parliamentary Power, until His Majesty's Return from Scotland:

"1. To pass the Royal Assent to the Act of the Treaty between the Two Kingdoms.

"2. To pass the Royal Assent to any Bill for raising of Money, as there shall be Occasion.

"3. For raising of Forces for Service at Sea and Land, to resist Foreign Invasions, and Seditions or Commotions at Home, with Things necessarily incident thereunto.

"4. Any Bill for Tonnage and Poundage, or other Duties, upon the Exportation or Importation of Commodities.

"5. A Bill for the Preservation of the Mines of Saltpetre, and making of good Gunpowder for the Defence of this Kingdom.

"6. A Power to pass the Subsidy granted by the Clergy.

"7. An Act of Parliament to be passed, to enable and fortify this Commission."

Message to the H. C. for a Conference concerning the Regency.

These Seven Heads, being read, were approved of; and a Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Serjeant Fynch and Serjeant Glanvile:

To desire a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, concerning the Business of the Custos Regni.

Committee for Defence of the Kingdom.

Ordered, That the Committee for the Defence of the Kingdom do meet this Afternoon, at Three a Clock.

Dependency of Ireland on this Kingdom.

Ordered, That the King's Counsel do search Records and Precedents concerning the Dependency of Ireland upon this Kingdom, and attend the Lords Committees with them.

The King's Answer about staying the Irish Business till their Letter is considered.

The Earl of March reported to this House, "That His Majesty is pleased to like well of the Advice of this House, concerning the staying of the Acts of Grace and Favour, which were to be passed for the Kingdom of Ireland, and will give Order it shall be done accordingly, until this House hath considered of the Letter sent to the Lord Keeper from the Speaker of the Lords House in Ireland."

The Answer to the Message was:

Answer from the H. C.

That the House of Commons will give a Meeting presently, as is desired, in the Painted (fn. *) Chamber.

Lords to report the Conference.

The Lord Privy Seal, the Earl of Bath, the Lord Viscount Say & Seale, and the Bishop of Lincolne, were appointed to speak at the Conference, and to report the same.

Sir Wm. Middleton's Petition about cutting the Banks of the New River. Delinquents sent for.

Upon reading the Petition of Sir William Middleton, Baronet, "complaining of some ill-disposed Persons, that have lately cut the Banks of The New River, by which Means, in this Time of Drought, and greatest Need of Water, the City of London is now unprovided, to the very great Prejudice and Danger of the said City, especially if any sudden Fire should happen;" it is thought fit, and so Ordered, That certain Persons specially complained of in this Petition, videlicet, John Culpecke, Ralph Johnson, Tho. Howard, Henry Hunsden, Robert Barker, and Tho. Keelinge, shall forthwith appear in this House, to make Answer to the said Complaint, which they are charged withall by Sir William Middleton; and, if he doth not prove that they are guilty of the said Offences, then the said Sir William Middleton is to bear their Charges, which they shall sustain in this Cause.

Committee for Trade.

Ordered, That the Committee for Trade do meet, and take into Consideration the Engrossing and excessive Rates of Sea Coals.

Conference about the Regency reported.

The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Lord Privy Seal reported, "That he told the House of Commons at the Conference, That this House hath taken into Consideration the Commission of the Custos Regni, and found some Difficulties in (fn. †) it; therefore, instead thereof, have thought of a Commission, which should be granted to some Lords during the King's Absence out of the Kingdom; and the Heads of the Commission he read to them, and delivered them to the House of Commons, who will consider of them."

Steward's Petition.

Ordered, That the Petition of Mr. Walter Steward be received into this House, and considered of (fn. *) when the Petition of Jo. de Franchi is heard before the Committee for Petitions.

A Message was sent from the House of Commons, by the Lord Craneborne:

Message from the H. C. to sit P. M.

To let their Lordships know, That the House of Commons intends to sit this Afternoon, and desires that this House will sit likewise.

The Answer returned was:

Answer.

That this House will (fn. †) sit this Afternoon, at Five a Clock.

Printed Paper concerning the Protestation.

Ordered, That the Printed Paper concerning the Protestation, set forth by the House of Commons, shall be debated To-morrow Morning.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in post meridiem hujus instantis diei, hora 5a, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Post meridiem.

PRAYERS.

Bill to prevent Riots in the Fens in Lincolnshire.

Hodie 2a vice lecta est Billa, An Act against the cutting of Banks and Sluices in Kyme Eae, in the County of Lincolne.

Committed to the same Committee as was appointed for the former Bill, adding the Lord Privy Seal and the Earl of Warwicke thereunto; and the Committee to meet on Wednesday, next, in the Afternoon.

Durham House Bill.

Exchange between the Bishop of Durham and E. of Pembroke.

Hodie 2a vice lecta est Billa, An Act for assuring of a Messuage, called Duresme House, alias Durham House, and certain Stables, Part of the Possession of the Bishop of Duresme, situate in the Parish of St. Martyn's in the Fields, in the County of Middlesex, unto the Right Honourable Philip Earl of Pembrooke and Mountgomery and his Heirs, and of a Yearly Rent of One Hundred and Forty Pounds per Annum, to the said Bishop of Duresme and his Successors, in Lieu thereof.

And committed to these Lords following: videlicet,

L. Privy Seal.
L. Marquis of Hertford.
L. Chamberlain.
Comes Bedford.
Comes Sarum.
Comes Dover.
Lord Viscount Say & Seale.
Epus. Winton.
Epus. Lincolne.
Epus. St. Asaph.
Epus. Bristoll.
Epus. Rochester.
Epus. Peterborough.
Ds. Wharton.
Ds. North.
Ds. Kymbolton.
Ds. Brooke.
Ds. Howard de Estcrick.
Ds. Savill.
Ds. Bruse.
Justice Heath and Assistants.
Serjeant Whitfeild,

Their Lordships, or any Five or more of them, to meet To-morrow Morning, at Eight a Clock, in the Painted Chamber; and the Dean and such of the Prebendaries of Duresme as are now in Town are to have Notice to attend their Lordships at the same Time.

Justice Heath's Petition about the Manor of Solam.

Upon reading the Petition of Sir Robert Heath, Knight, One of His Majesty's Justices in the King's (fn. *) Bench, desiring the Benefit of the General Order of this House (touching Possessions), for the Manor of Solam, in the County of Cambridge; it is Ordered, That the said Mr. Justice Heath shall have the said General Order under the Clerk's Hand; and that it shall be as useful and advantageous unto him, concerning the said Manor, as though it had been made in his particular Case only.

Message from the H. C. for a Conference about disbanding the Armies.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir William Lewis:

To desire a present Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, touching the disbanding of both Armies.

The Answer returned hereunto was:

Answer.

That this House will give a present Conference, as is desired, in the Painted Chamber.

Lords to report the Conference.

The Lord Privy Seal, the Earl of Bath, Bishop of Lincolne, the Lord Wharton, and the Lord Howard de Charlton, were appointed to report the Conference.

Conference reported.

Then this House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Lord Privy Seal reported the Effect of the Conference: videlicet,

Money due to Durham, Newcastle, and Northumberland.

"That the County of the Bishoprick of Durham and the Town of Newcastle are contented to receive the Eight and Twenty Thousand Pounds, owing to them by the Scotts, from the Parliament. Likewise the County of Northumberland accepts well of the Ten Thousand Two Hundred Pounds, owing by the Scotts, to be paid by the Parliament: and that, by including the aforesaid Sums, they are ready to pay the Scotts the Eighty Thousand Pounds, Part of the Brotherly Assistance; but desire the Scotts Commissioners may be moved, to receive Twenty Thousand Pounds thereof at London; and the rest shall be sent to them to Newcastle, and paid there. Lastly, that the Lords Commissioners, may give Notice hereof to the Scotts Commissioners, that they may give Information to their General, to prepare for the disbanding of the Scotts Army."

Ordered, That the Lords Commissioners do propound these Desires of the House of Commons to the Scotts Commissioners, and return their Answer herein.

Report of the Scots Propositions.

Then the Earl of Bristoll reported the Propositions and Articles given in by the Scottish Commissioners after the Lord Lowdon's Return from the Parliament of Scotland; which were read, as followeth: videlicet,

"That the Treaty of Peace may be brought to a speedy and happy Close, we do offer to your Lordships Consideration the Particulars following:

"1. That, as soon as the Scottish Army shall remove out of England to Scotland, the English Garrisons of Barwicke and Carlile may remove simul et semel.

"2. Lest Malefactors, who have committed Murder and the like Crimes, crave the Benefit of the Act of Pacification and Oblivion, for whom it is no Ways intended, there would be an Exception from the said Acts of all legal Pursuits intended, or to be intended, within the Space of One Year after the Date of the Treaty, against Thieves, Horners, Outlawers, Fugitives, Murderers, Broken Men, or their Receptaries, for whatsoever Thefts, Rifes, Hardships, Oppressions, Depredations, or Murders, done or committed by them, and all lawful Decreets given, or to be given, by the Parliament, or any Commissioners to be appointed by them for that Effect, who shall have Power to dignosce and take Cognition whether the same falls within the said Act of Pacification or Oblivion, or not.

"3. It is desired, That the Demand concerning the not making or denouncing War with Foreigners, without Consent of both Parliaments, may be condescended unto by the King and Parliament of England; which is ordained and universally observed in all mutual Leagues, which are both offensive and defensive; and because the Wars denounced by one of the Kingdoms with Foreigners, although made without Consent of the other Kingdom, will engage them by necessary Consequence; or, if the Consideration of this Proposition shall require longer Time than the present Condition of the important Affairs of the Parliament may permit, and lest the speedy Close of the Treaty be thereby impeded; it is desired, that this Demand, with the other Two Articles of the same Nature, the one concerning Leagues and Confederations, and the other concerning mutual Supply in Case of Foreign Invasion, may all Three be remitted to Commissioners, to be chosen by both Parliaments, who shall have Power to advise and treat thereupon for the Good of both Kingdoms, and report to the Parliament respectively.

"4. It is desired, that the Articles concerning Trade and Commerce, Naturalization, mutual Privilege and Capacity, and others of that Nature already demanded, may be condescended unto by the King and Parliament of England; and namely, that Demand anent the pressing of Men and Ships by Sea or Land: Or, if Shortness of Time and Exigence of Affairs may not permit the present Determination of these Demands, it is desired, that the same (except so many of them, as are already agreed unto by the Commissioners for Trade) may be remitted to the Commissioners to be chosen by both Parliaments, who shall have Power to treat and advise thereof, for the Good of both Kingdoms, and to make Report to the Parliaments respectively; and that the Charters or Warrants of the Scotch Nation, for Freedom of Shipping in England or Ireland, from all Customs, Imposts, Duties, and Fees, more than are paid by the Natives of England or Ireland, granted by King James, under the Great Seal of England, upon the Eleventh Day of April, in the Thirteenth Year of His Reign, and confirmed by King Charles upon the Nineteenth of April, in the Eighth Year of His Reign, may be enacted and ratified in this Parliament.

"5. That the Extracts of Bonds and Decreets upon Record and Registers in Scotland may have the like Faith and Execution as the French Tabellions have in England and Ireland, seeing they are of a like Nature, and deserve more Credit; and, if this cannot be done at this Time, that it be remitted to the former Commission from both Parliaments.

"6. The Manner of safe Conduct for transporting the Monies from England or Scotland, by Sea or Land, would be condescended upon, in such Way as the Charges be not exorbitant, and may be presently known.

"7. The Tenor of the Commission for conserving of Peace would be condescended unto, together with the Times and Places of Meeting, and whole Frame thereof; the Draught whereof, when it is drawn up in England, is to be represented to the Parliament of Scotland, that they may make the like Commission, and name their Commissioners for that Effect.

"8. The Parliament of Scotland do join their earnest and hearty Desires, and craves the Parliament of England's Concourse, that none be placed about the Prince his Highness but such as are of the Reformed Religion.

"9. That an Act of Parliament of Public Faith for Payment of the Two Hundred and Twenty Thousand Pounds, which is Arrear of the Brotherly Assistance, may be presently framed and expedited, according to the Terms agreed upon.

"10. It is desired, that the Quorum, to whom the Scotts should address themselves for Payment of the Two Hundred and Twenty Thousand Pounds, be condescended upon.

"11. That the Order for re-calling all Proclamations, &c. made against His Majesty's Subjects of Scotland, be drawn up and intimate in due Form and Time with the Public Thanksgiving, at all the Parish Churches of His Majesty's Dominions.

"12. It is desired, That the Articles concerning the Castle of Edinburgh, and other Strengths of that Kingdom, may be understood to be, that the same shall be disposed of for the Weal of the Kingdom, as the King and Parliament shall think expedient."

The English Lords Commissioners answer:

The English Lords Commissioners Answer.

"That, upon the disbanding of the Scottish Army, the Garrisons of Barwick and Carlile shall be removed, according to the Articles of the Treaty in that Behalf.

"The Second Article is condescended unto, according to the Proposition added to the Act of Pacification.

"The Third Demand, concerning making of War with Foreigners, with the other Two Articles concerning Leagues and Confederations, and concerning mutual Supply and Assistance against Foreign Invasion, is agreed to be referred to Commissioners, to be chosen by His Majesty and the Parliaments.

"As likewise the Fourth, Fifth, and Sixth Articles, concerning Trade, Commerce, Naturalization, mutual Privileges and Capacity, and other of that Nature, and the Demand concerning the Extract of Bonds and Decreets, and the Manner of safe Conduct for transporting the Monies from England to Scotland, are all referred to be taken in Consideration by the Commissioners to be appointed by both Parliaments, who shall have Power to advise and treat thereupon, and report to the Parliaments respectively.

"It is just that the Tenor of the Commission for conserving of Peace should be agreed on by mutual Consent; but the Closing of the Treaty not to stay hereupon, but to be left to the Commissioners to be named.

"To that Desire concerning such as should be placed about the Prince, the King hath already given a clear and satisfactory Answer.

"That there be an Act of Parliament of Public Faith for securing the Payment of Two Hundred and Twenty Thousand Pounds, which is Arrear of the Brotherly Assistance, is just; and Order is given for it accordingly; and it shall be communicated with the Scottish Commissioners that it may be a perfect Security.

"The Tenth, for appointing a Quorum for attending the Payment of the Money, is already moved to the Parliament, and will be done as is desired.

"The Eleventh Article is very just; and Order shall be given accordingly, for re-calling all Proclamations, and for Public Thanksgiving.

"This Twelfth Article, for the Castle of Edinburgh and other Strenghts of Scotland, is to be settled betwixt His Majesty and the Commissioners of Scotland, or by His Majesty and Parliament of Scotland."

Propositions and Answers approved of.

Which being read, this House approved both of the Propositions and the Answers; and Ordered they should be communicated to the House of Commons Tomorrow Morning, at a Conference.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Veneris, videlicet, 6m diem instantis Augusti, hora nona, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Footnotes

* Deest in Originali.
* Bis in Originali.
Deest in Originali.
* Deest in Originali.