House of Lords Journal Volume 4
11 August 1641

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1767-1830

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'House of Lords Journal Volume 4: 11 August 1641', Journal of the House of Lords: volume 4: 1629-42 (1767-1830), pp. 358-360. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=35673 Date accessed: 17 April 2014. Add to my bookshelf


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Contents

DIE Mercurii, videlicet, 11 die Augusti.
Lilborne versus Claxton. Ld. Howard Leave to be absent. Smith versus Busby in Error. Judges to go the Circuit. Message to the H. C. for a Conference about sending a Letter to the Ld. General. Sir John Conyers recommended by His Majesty. Answer from the H. C. Exempting Four Counties from the Marches of Wales. French Ambassador desires Leave to levy Troops, for his Master, in England. Ld. Brooke Leave to be absent. Ld. Morley for the Murder of Captain Clarke. Message from the H. C. concerning the Impeachment against the Thirteen Bishops. Answer. Message to the H. C. for a Conference about the Charge against the Thirteen Bishops. Hans Towns. Sir Richard Wiseman released. Answer from the H. C. Conference about the Charge against the Bishops reported. Message from the H. C. to sit P. M. Answer. Propositions about the Treaty with the Scots. Answers to these Propositions. Adjourn. Post meridiem. Letter from the H. C. to the Lord General. The same sent from this House. Vote of the H. C. for disbanding the Army. Voted also by the Lords. Message to the H. C. about the Letter to the Lord General, and for a Conference about disbanding the Armies. Answer. Captain Ogle sent for, for Contempt of the House. Message from the H. C. for a Conference about the Scots Propositions. Answer. Ld. Savile Leave to be absent. Conference about the Scots Propositions reported. Letter from the Lord General read. Arms and Ammunition taken by the Scots to be restored. Adjourn. Footnotes

DIE Mercurii, videlicet, 11 die Augusti.

PRAYERS.

Lilborne versus Claxton.

Ordered, That the Petitions and Complaints between Lilborn and Claxton shall be heard before the Lords Committees for Petitions, on the Second Thursday after Allhollantide next.

Ld. Howard Leave to be absent.

Ordered, That the Lord Howard of Charlton hath Leave to be absent for a Month or Six Weeks.

Smith versus Busby in Error.

Forasmuch as the Cause between Smith and Busby, upon a Writ of Error depending in this House, hath been attended several Days with Counsel; it is now Ordered, That the said Cause shall be argued by Counsel on the Second Tuesday in the next Meeting of Parliament; and that the Judges be desired to be then present at the said Argument; and that the Parties, with their Counsel on both Sides, do attend this House the same Day.

Judges to go the Circuit.

Ordered, That Mr. Baron Henden and Mr. Justice Mallet have Leave to be absent from this House, to prepare themselves against their going Circuit.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Baron Henden and Justice Mallet:

Message to the H. C. for a Conference about sending a Letter to the Ld. General.

To desire that the select Committee of their House concerning the Ten Heads may meet with the same Committee of Lords, about agreeing upon the Letter, which is to be sent to the Lord General, touching disbanding our Army, and other Particulars concerning the Army.

Sir John Conyers recommended by His Majesty.

The Lord Chamberlain signified, "That the King had commanded him to let this House know, That, upon the disbanding of the Army, His Majesty recommends Sir John Conyers to the Consideration of the Parliament, being a Man of good Desert, and hath done very good Service, in taking great Care and Pains to keep the Horse in good Order."

The Messengers sent to the House of Commons return with this Answer:

Answer from the H. C.

That they will (fn. *) give a Meeting presently, by the select Committee for the Ten Heads, as is desired.

Exempting Four Counties from the Marches of Wales.

Ordered, That the Committee concerning the Bill for exempting of the Four Counties from the Jurisdiction of the Marches of Wales shall meet on Tuesday next come Sevennight, and consider of the said Bill; and, if any of the King's or Prince's Counsel do attend the Committee, and desire to be heard, they shall be heard; whereof the Counsel are to have Notice of the aforesaid Day.

French Ambassador desires Leave to levy Troops, for his Master, in England.

Then was read the Desire of the French Ambassador, for Leave to transport and levy Six Regiments of Foot, and Ten Companies of Horse, all English, for the Service of the French King.

Ld. Brooke Leave to be absent.

Ordered, That the Lord Brook hath Leave to be absent from this House for Ten Days, about his necessary Occasions.

Ld. Morley for the Murder of Captain Clarke.

Upon Affidavit made by Eliz. Clarke, Widow, "That she hath attended since the 4th of July last, for to have a Day of Trial against the Lord Morley, for the Death of Captain Clarke; besides her great Charge in feeing of Counsel, and keeping her Witnesses in Town, whereof Five material Witnesses are lately gone into the Country upon their own necessary Occasions, and will not return until about Michaelmas; therefore she desired that the Trial may be put off until Michaelmas next:" Hereupon it is Ordered, That (fn. †) the Lord Morley shall have Sight of this Affidavit this Night; and, if his Lordship do not shew Cause to the contrary To-morrow Morning to this House, the Trial shall be put off until after Michaelmas, and all Proceedings in other Courts to cease in the Interim.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir Arthur Hasilrigg, Baronet:

Message from the H. C. concerning the Impeachment against the Thirteen Bishops.

To put their Lordships in Mind of the Impeachment brought up formerly from the House of Commons against Thirteen Bishops. He was commanded to let their Lordships know, That the House of Commons are ready to make the said Impeachment at this Bar; and they desired that their Lordships will appoint a Time when the said Thirteen Bishops shall make their Answer in this House, in the Presence of the House of Commons.

Answer.

The Answer to this Message was: That their Lordships will take it into present Consideration, and will send an Answer by Messengers of their own.

Upon this, the House fell into Debate whether the Impeachment brought up from the House of Commons, against the Thirteen Bishops, were not too general for the Bishops to make Answer to; and, after much Consideration herein, the House Resolved, To have a Conference with the House of Commons concerning the same.

Message to the H. C. for a Conference about the Charge against the Thirteen Bishops.

And a Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Rich, and Mr. Page:

To desire a present Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, touching the Bishops Impeachment.

The Lord Privy Seal,
Co. Bathon, and
The Lord Viscount Say & Seale,

Were appointed to speak at the Conference.

The Matter of the Conference was: "To offer to the Consideration of the House of Commons, whether the Charge brought up by them against the Thirteen Bishops, for the several Crimes, is not too general for the Bishops to make Answer unto, or this House to ground a Judgement upon; if it be so, then to propound to them, that they form a particular Charge in Writing against the said Bishops, upon the verbal Charge which they have brought; or, that the King's Attorney, by Order from the Lords, do draw up a particular Charge against them ex parte Domini Regis, unto which the said Bishops may make particular Answers, and the Lords proceed to Judgement thereupon."

Hans Towns.

Ordered, That the Lord Viscount Say & Seale, Lord Bishop of Lincolne, Lord Wharton, Lord Kymbolton, Lord Brooke, and the Lord Herbert de Cherbery, (fn. *) calling to them Dr. Reeves, the King's Advocate, to assist them, do draw up a Letter, fit to be given in Answer to the Letter of The Hanse Town, and present the same to this House, to receive Approbation.

Sir Richard Wiseman released.

Ordered, upon the Request of the Lord Howard de Charlton, That Sir Richard Wiseman, committed to The Gate-house for misdemeaning himself to his Lordship, be released of his present Imprisonment.

The Messengers return with this Answer from the House of Commons:

Answer from the H. C.

That they will give a present Meeting, in the Painted Chamber, as is desired.

Conference about the Charge against the Bishops reported.

The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, this House was resumed; and the Lord Privy Seal reported, "That he had delivered the Matter of the Conference to the House of Commons, as he was commanded; and the House of Commons (fn. †) are gone to their House, to consider of it, and will return an Answer in convenient Time."

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir William Armin:

Message from the H. C. to sit P. M.

To let their Lordships know, that the House of Commons intends to sit this Afternoon, and they desire this House would please to fit likewise.

The Answer hereunto returned was:

Answer.

That this House will fit this Afternoon, at Four a Clock.

Propositions about the Treaty with the Scots.

The Earl of Bristoll reported certain Propositions or Memorials, which were delivered to the Lords Commissioners from the Commissioners of Scotland, as are fit to (fn. ‡) be perfected upon the Treaty:

"1. The Exemplifications of the Treaty, and of the Act for securing the Remainder of the Brotherly Assistance, to be written in Secretary.

"2. That a Commission may be granted from the Parliament, for Examination of Witnesses in the Process of the Incendiaries, conform to the Paper given to the Earl of Bristoll.

"3. A Licence to the Army to march through Barwicke, because the Waters are out, that they cannot march over the River Tweede, and so cannot appoint a certain Day for the passing over.

"4. To get an Order for Delivery of Two and Forty Thousand Pounds, Part of the Eighty Thousand Pounds; and that the Remainder of the Eighty Thousand Pounds detained for Payment of what is due to the Northern Counties may be secured by Order of the Parliament, so as it may relieve the Scotts at the Counties Hands, if so much shall be found justly owing unto them by those who are intrusted on both Sides with the Accounts; and, if there be not found so much justly owing to the Counties, that the Overplus be paid to the Scotts, and that they may have Acquittances from the Counties.

"5. That the Time for the removing the Scottish Army is to begin after the Receipt of the Arrears, and Payment of the Eighty Thousand Pounds, in Manner aforesaid; and that it is conceived the same will be paid unto them before the 15th Day of August; and that they have Five Days thereafter to draw the Army together into one Body at a Rendezvous, and making themselves ready, with all their Necessaries, to march; and there is thereafter Five Days allowed them to march to Scotland, which will be the 26th of August Instant, during which Space the Maintenance of the Army, of Eight Hundred Fifty Pounds per Diem, for Relief of the Northern Counties, is to be allowed, and paid before the Army march.

"6. To condescend that the Commission for Conservation of the Peace, and the Commission for the Treaty concerning Trade and Intercourse betwixt the Two Kingdoms, do go on; all the remanent Articles to be referred to that Treaty.

"7. To think upon the Warrant and Manner of recalling the Declaration and Proclamations made against His Majesty's Subjects of Scotland; and the Manner and Time of the Public Thanksgiving for the happy Peace and Union of the Kingdoms.

"8. That Order be given to the Northern Counties, for carrying their Artillery, Ammunition, and Baggage, to the River of Tweede."

The Answers to the said Propositions or Memorials made by the Lords Commissioners were these: videlicet,

Answers to these Propositions.

"1. The First is already Ordered, as is desired.

"2. The Second is referred to the Lord Mandevile's Care.

"3. The Third is to be propounded to the Houses of Parliament.

"4. The Fourth is, or shall be presently, performed by the Earl of Warwicke.

"5. To the Fifth, the Days in particular are to be set down by the Parliament.

"6. To the Sixth, Order shall be given accordingly; of (fn. *) which the Lord Mandevile will take Care.

"7. It shall be moved to the Parliament, that Order may be taken accordingly; but the Scotts to be over.

"8. For this Eighth, it may be recommended to the Gentlemen of those Counties, to write their Letters for the Performance of what is desired."

This House agreed to all these Propositions.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque post meridiem hujus instantis diei, hora 4a, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Post meridiem.

PRAYERS.

Letter from the H. C. to the Lord General.

The Letter which the House of Commons sent to the Lord General, subscribed by their Speaker, was read; and it is Ordered, That the like Letter should be sent from this House, subscribed by the Speaker of this House, to the Lord General: videlicet,

"May it please Your Excellency,

The same sent from this House.

"Your Excellency hath lately received Order from the House of Lords assembled in Parliament, for the speedy disbanding of the Horse of His Majesty's Army, which they hope is in good Forwardness. His Majesty hath now given His Royal Assent to the Acts for the Conclusion of the Treaty, and the securing of the remaining Part of the Brotherly Assistance; and all the Arrears due to the Scottish Army are upon the Way to Newcastle. I am therefore commanded, by the House of Lords, to convey to your Excellency their earnest Desires, that you will, with all possible Speed, disband all the Regiments of Foot, and the Train of Artillery of His Majesty's Army, His Majesty hath been graciously pleased to declare His Royal Assent therein; and your Excellency will therewith receive an Order for the doing thereof. I shall only add, That the Scotts Commissioners are engaged to the Parliament, that, immediately upon the Receipt of those Arrears, that Army shall march away to Scotland, for which their General hath received a Command from the Parliament of Scotland: This House, being very consident of your Lordship's Care in the great Business, do promise to themselves a speedy and a happy Conclusion thereof, for which your Excellency may justly expect their hearty Thanks; and that it will be an acceptable Service to His Majesty, may appear by His Majesty's Message to this House, a Copy whereof you will receive herewith. which (fn. *) is, by the Command of this House, sent by

11th of August, 1641.

"Your Excellency's humble Servant."

Vote of the H. C. for disbanding the Army.

After this was read the Vote of the House of Commons, concerning the disbanding of the Army and the Artillery.

Resolved, upon the Question, by this House,

Voted also by the Lords.

That all the Foot and the Train of Artillery of His Majesty's Army shall forthwith be disbanded, as well as the Horse.

Then a Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Robert Rich and Mr. Page:

Message to the H. C. about the Letter to the Lord General, and for a Conference about disbanding the Armies.

To let them know, that this House doth join with them, in sending a Letter to the Lord General, concerning the speeding of the Army; and that this House hath voted the disbanding of the Foot and Train of Artillery of His Majesty's Army, as well as the Horse; and lastly, to desire a Free Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, touching some Things propounded by the Scotts Commissioners, concerning the disbanding of their Army.

The Messengers returned with this Answer from the House of Commons:

Answer.

That they will return an Answer, by Messengers of their own, in convenient Time.

The Lord Wharton, Lord Brook, and the Lord Savill, were appointed to speak at this Conference.

Captain Ogle sent for, for Contempt of the House.

Whereas Complaint was made, "That Captain Ogle had spoke some unfitting scandalous Words of this House;" it is Ordered, That he may be sent for, by the Gentleman Usher attending this House, to appear and answer the same before this House.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Hampden:

Message from the H. C. for a Conference about the Scots Propositions.

To let their Lordships know, that they are now ready to give their Lordships a Meeting, touching the Conference concerning the Scotts Propositions.

The Answer hereunto returned was:

Answer.

That their Lordships will give a Meeting presently, in the Painted Chamber.

Ld. Savile Leave to be absent.

Ordered, That the Lord Savill hath Leave to go into the Country.

Conference about the Scots Propositions reported.

The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the House was resumed; and the Lord Savill reported "That he had delivered to the House of Commons, at this Conference, those Things which he had in Command to do."

Letter from the Lord General read.

Then a Letter was read, sent to the Lord Chamberlain from the Lord General.

Arms and Ammunition taken by the Scots to be restored.

Ordered, That the Lords Commissioners do speak with the Scotts Commissioners from this House, That all the King's Arms and Ordnance and Ammunition, which were taken, shall be restored, and remain at Newcastle, and not be carried away by the Scotts, and likewise all other Arms belonging to the Kingdom.

Adjourn.

Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem Jovis, videlicet, 12m diem instantis Augusti, hora 9a, Dominis sic decernentibus.

Footnotes

* Deest in Originali.
Origin. they.
* Origin. called.
Origin. as.
Deest in Originali.
* Deest in Originali.
* Origin. as.