DIE Mercurii, videlicet, 10 die Novembris.
Conference of Yesterday reported Instructions to the Committee in Scotland, relative to the Affairs of Ireland.
The Lord Keeper reported the Effect of the Conference, which was Yesterday with the House of Commons:
"That Mr. Pym delivered, by Command from the
House of Commons, divers Heads agreed upon by
them, which are Instructions to be sent to the Committees of both Houses now attending His Majesty in
Scotland, which the House of Commons desires their
Lordships to join with them in the same. The Instructions were read, in hæc verba: videlicet,
"1. You shall humbly inform His Majesty, that the
Proposition made to the Parliament of Scotland, concerning their Assistance for suppressing the Rebels in
Ireland, hath been fully considered and debated, by
both Houses of Parliament here; and their wise and
brotherly Proceedings and Expressions are apprehended
and entertained by us, (fn. *) not only with Approbation,
but with Thankfulness; wherefore we desire that His
Majesty will be pleased, That you may, in the Name of
the Lords and Commons of England, give public Thanks
to the States of the Parliament of Scotland, for their
Care and Readiness to employ the Forces of that Kingdom for the reducing the rebellious Subjects of Ireland to their due Obedience to His Majesty and the
Crown of England.
"2. You shall further make known to His Majesty,
That, in respect of the great and almost universal
Revolt of the Natives of Ireland, cherished and fomented (as we have Cause to doubt) by the secret
Practices and Encouragement of some Foreign States,
ill affected to the Crown; and that the Northern Parts
of that Kingdom may with much more Ease and Speed
be supplied from Scotland than from England; we
humbly advise and beseech His Majesty to make Use
of the Assistance of His Parliament and Subjects of
Scotland, for the present Relief of those Parts of Ireland which lye nearest to them, according to the
Treaty agreed upon and confirmed in both Parliaments, and this affectionate and friendly Disposition,
now lately expressed, as is more particularly specified in the Fifth Article.
"3. You shall present to His Majesty the Copy inclosed
of the Declaration, which we have sent into Ireland, for
the Encouragement of His good Subjects there; and,
for the more speedy and effectual opposing of the
Rebels, and in Execution and Performance of our
Expressions therein made of Zeal and Faithfulness to
His Majesty's Service, we have already taken Care
for Fifty Thousand Pounds to be presently borrowed,
and secured by Parliament: We have likewise resolved
to hasten the Earl of Leicester, Lord Lieutenant of
Ireland, very speedily to repair thither, and forthwith
to raise a convenient Number of Horse and Foot, for
securing Dublin and The English Pale, with such other
Parts as remain in His Majesty's Subjection, intending
to second them with a far greater Supply.
"4. We have further Ordered and directed, That
His Majesty's Arms and Ammunition, lying in the
City of Carlile, shall be transported into the North
Parts of Ireland, for the Supply of Carrickfargus, and
other His Majesty's Forts and Garrisons there; and
that a convenient Number of Men shall be sent from
the North Parts of England, for the better Guard
and Defence of those Forts and Countries adjoining;
and that a larger Proportion of Arms and other Ammunition shall be speedily conveyed out of His Majesty's Stores of West Chester, to be disposed according
to the Direction of the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland,
for arming the Men to be sent from England, and such
other His Loyal Subjects as may be raised in Ireland.
"5. And because we understand that the Rebels are
like, with great Strength, to attempt the Ruin and
Destruction of the British Plantation in Ulster, we
humbly advise His Majesty, by the Counsel and
Authority of His Parliament in Scotland, to provide,
That One Regiment, consisting of a Thousand Men,
furnished and accomplished with all necessary Arms
and Ammunition as shall seem best to their great Wisdoms and Experience, may, with all possible Speed, be
transported into Ireland, under the Command of some
Worthy Person, well affected to the Reformed Religion, and the Peace of both Kingdoms, and well enabled, with Skill, Judgement, and Reputation, for such
an Employment; which Forces we desire may be quartered in those Northern Parts, for opposing the Rebels, and Comfort and Assistance of His Majesty's
good Subjects there, with Instructions from His Majesty, and the Parliament of Scotland, that they shall,
upon all Occasions, pursue and observe the Directions
of the Lord Lieutenant, his Lieutenant General, or
the Governors of Ireland, according to their Authority
derived from His Majesty and the Crown of England.
"6. And as touching the Wages, and other needful
Charges, which this Assistance will require, we would
have you, in our Name, to beseech His Majesty to
commend it to our Brethren, the Estates of the Parliament of Scotland, to take it into their Care, on the
Behalf of His Majesty and this Kingdom, to make
such Agreements with all the Commanders and Soldiers to be employed as they would do in the like
Case for themselves; and to let them know, for our
Parts, we do wholly rely upon their honourable and
friendly Dealing with us, and will take Care that Satisfaction be made accordingly.
"7. Lastly, you shall represent to His most Excellent Majesty this our humble and faithful Declaration,
That we cannot without much Grief remember the
great Miseries, Burthens, and Distempers, which have,
for divers Years, afflicted all His Kingdoms and Dominions, and brought them to the last Point of Ruin
and Destruction; all which have issued from the cunning, false, and malicious Practices of some of those
who have been admitted into very near Places of
Counsel and Authority about him, who have been Favourers of Popery, Superstition, and Innovation, Subverters of Religion, Honour, and Justice, Factors for
promoting the Designs of Foreign Princes and States,
to the great and apparent Danger of His Royal Person, Crown, and Dignity, and of all His People, Authors of false Scandals and Jealousies betwixt His
Majesty and His Loyal Subjects, Enemies to the Peace,
Union, and Confidence, betwixt Him and His Parliament, which is the surest Foundation of Prosperity and Greatness to His Majesty, and of Comfort
and Hope to them; that, by their Counsels and Endeavours, those great Sums which have been lately
drawn from the People have been either consumed
unprofitably, or in the Maintenance of such Designs
as have been mischievous and destructive to the State;
and, whilst we have been labouring to support His
Majesty to purge out the Corruptions and restore the
Decays both of the Church and State, others of their
Faction and Party have been contriving by Violence to
suppress the Liberty of Parliament, and endanger the
Safety of those who have opposed such wicked and
"8. That we have just Cause of Belief, that those
Conspiracies and Commotions in Ireland are but the
Effects of the same Counsels; and, if Persons of such
Aims and Conditions shall still continue in Credit, Authority, and Employment, the great Aids which we
shall be enforced to draw from His People, for subduing the Rebellion in Ireland, will be applied to the
fomenting and cherishing of it there, and encouraging
some such like Attempt by the Papists and ill-affected
Subjects in England; and, in the End, to the Subversion of Religion, and Destruction of His loyal Subjects
in both Kingdoms; and do therefore most humbly
beseech His Majesty to change those Counsels, from
which such ill Courses have proceeded, and which have
caused so many Miseries and Dangers to Himself and
all His Dominions; and that He will be graciously
pleased to employ such Counsellors and Ministers as
shall be approved by His Parliament, who are His
greatest and most faithful Council, that so His People
may with Courage and Confidence undergo the Charge
and Hazard of this War, and, by their Bounty and
faithful Endeavours (with God's Favour and Blessing),
restore to His Majesty and this Kingdom that Honour,
Peace, Safety, and Prosperity, which they have enjoyed in former Times.
"And, if herein His Majesty shall not vouchsafe to
condescend to our humble Supplication, although we
shall always continue, with Reverence and Faithfulness
to His Person and to the Crown, to perform those
Duties of Service and Obedience to which by the
Laws of God and this Kingdom we are obliged;
yet we shall be forced, in Discharge of the Trust
which we owe to the Sate, and to those whom we represent, to resolve upon some such Way of defending
Ireland from the Rebels, as may concur to the securing of ourselves from such mischievous Counsels and
Designs, as have lately been, and still are, in Practice
and Agitation against us, as we have just Cause to believe; and to commend those Aids and Contributions
which this great Necessity shall require, to the Custody
and disposing of such Persons of Honour and Fidelity
as we have Cause to confide in."
Representations of the Commons about ill Counsels.
Next, Mr. Pym said, "He was to speak touching
the ill Counsels, which he laid down in several
"1. First, That the Dangers which come to a State
by ill Counsels are the most pernicious of all others.
It is usual to compare Politic Bodies with the Natural.
"The Natural Body is in Danger divers Ways,
either by outward Violence, and that may be foreseen and prevented, or else by less-appearing Maladies, which grow upon the Body by Distemper of the
Air, immoderate Exercise, Diet, etc. And, when the
Causes of the Disease are clear, the Remedy is easily applied; but Diseases which proceed from the
inward Parts, as the Liver, the Heart, or the Brains,
the more noble Parts, it is a hard Thing to apply
Cure to such Diseases.
"Ill Counsels, they are of that Nature, etc. for the
Mischiefs that come by evil Counsels corrupt the
Vital Parts, and overthrow the Public Government,
"2. Second Step. That there have been lately, and
still are, ill Counsels here in this Kingdom, and about
the King: 1. That there hath been lately, you will
not doubt, when the main Course of Government
hath been so employed, as Popery thereby hath
been maintained, the Laws subverted, and no distinguishing between Justice and Injustice; and that
there is still Reason to doubt, is apparent, by Courses
taken to advance mischievous Designs, but that His
Majesty's Wisdom and Goodness kept them from the
Heart, though they were not kept out of Court; so
the principal and most mischievous Designs have
been practised by such as had near Access unto
His Majesty, though not to His Heart; and the
Apologists and Promoters of ill Counsels are still
"3. The Third Step. That the ill Counsels of this
Time are in their own Natures more mischievous
and more dangerous than the ill Counsels of former
Times. Former Counsels have been, to please Kings
in their Vices, from which our King is free; and
sometimes for racking of the Prerogative; if it
had gone no further, it had brought many Miseries,
but not Ruin and Destruction: But the ill Counsels
of this Time were destructive to Religion and Laws,
by altering them both; therefore more mischievous
in their own Nature than those of former Times.
"4. Fourth Step. That these ill Counsels have proceeded from a Spirit and Inclination to Popery, and
have had a Dependance in Popery, and all of
them tend unto it. The Religion of the Papists is
a Religion incompatible with any other Religion,
destructive to all others, and doth not endure any
Thing that opposes it; whosoever doth withstand their
Religion, if they have Power, they bring them to
Ruin. There are other Religions that are not right,
but not so destructive as Popery is; for the Principles
of Popery are destructive to all States and Persons
that oppose it, with the Progress of these mischievous
Counsels; they provide Counsellors, fit Instruments
and Organs, that may execute their own Designs, and
to turn all Council to their own Ends; and you find
that, now in Ireland, that those Designs that have been
upon all the Three Kingdoms do end in a War for the
Maintenance of Popery in Ireland, and would do the
like here if they were able; they are so nutritive as
to turn all to their own Advantage.
"5. Fifth Step. That, unless these ill Counsels be
changed, as long as they continue it is impossible that
any Assistance, Aid, or Advice, that the Parliament
can take to reform, will be effectual for the Public
Orders and Laws, but dead if not put in Execution.
These that are the Instruments of State, they put
Things into Action in good Order; but, if acted by
evil Men, while these Counsels are on Foot, we can
expect no Good; it is like a Disease that turns Nutritives into Poison.
"6. Sixth Step. That this (fn. *) is the most proper Time
to desire of His Majesty the Alteration and Change
(fn. *) of the evil Counsellors, because the Commonwealth
is brought into Distemper by them, and so exhausted
that we can endure no longer.
"Next Reason why we cannot admit of them is, to
shew our Love and Fidelity to the King, in great and extraordinary Contributions and Aids. When God doth
employ His Servants, He doth give some Promise to
rouse up their Spirits. Reason now to expect the
King's Grace in great Abundance. This is the Time
where the Subject is to save the Kingdom of Ireland,
with the Hazard of their Lives and Fortunes; and
therefore expect from His Majesty, in a more large
and bountiful Manner than at other Times, a Time of
great Agitation and Action. Their State is ready by
Preparation to annoy us; and ill and false Counsels at
Home may quickly bring us to Ruin. As we have
Weakness at Home, so we ought to discern the Actions abroad, where great Provision is made; and a
Carelessness and Improvidence herein, when our Neighbours are so provided, and have such great Fleets
at Sea as will open a Way to sudden Ruin and Destruction before we can be prepared; and therefore
now the fittest Time to move the King.
"7. The last Step. That this Alteration of Counsels will bring great Advantage to the King in His
own Designs. In all our Actions, our Prayers unto
God should be, that His Name should be glorified:
So our Petitions to His Majesty should bring Honour, Profit, and Advantage to Him, by a Discouragement to the Rebels, a great Part of their Confidence
resting in the evil Counsels at Home, as by the Examinations appeareth.
"A great Encouragement to the King's good Subjects
at Home (who hazard their Lives, and give Aid and
Contribution, to have Things governed for the Public
Good). It will make Men afraid to prefer Servants
to the King that are ill Counsellors, when they shall
come to the Examination of a Parliament; for manytimes Servants are preferred to Princes for Advantage of Foreign States.
"Next, this will put an Answer into the King's Mouth
against all (fn. *) Importunity, That he is to prefer none
but such as will be approved on by Parliament.
Those that are honourable and most ingenuous are
aptest to be troubled in this kind; and, not to deny,
therefore, the King may answer, He hath promised
His Parliament not to admit of any but by Advice in
Parliament. This will answer them all.
"These domestic, but next Advantage, it makes us
fitter to enter into Union and Treaty with Foreign
Nations and States, and to be made Partakers of the
Strength and Assistance of others. It will fortify us
against the Designs of Foreign Princes. There hath
been common Counsel at Rome and in Spaine, to reduce us to Popery. If good Counsel at Home, we
shall be the better prepared to preserve Peace and
Union and better Respect from abroad.
"Lastly, it will make us fit for any noble Design
Order for securing Fifty Thousand Pounds to the City.
"An Order was made by the House of Commons,
dated the 9th of November 1641, That an Ordinance
of Parliament may pass, to engage the Honour, Credit, and Authority, of both Houses of Parliament, for
the securing and repaying to the City the Fifty
Thousand Pounds, with Interest, desired to be borrowed of them for the Occasions of Ireland; and that
a provisional Act shall pass, with all Speed, for Repayment of the said Sum, with Interest, within Six
Next, an Ordinance of Parliament was read, in hæc
Ordinance for Stay of the Passage of Irishmen to the Rebels.
"Whereas there is just Cause to conceive that divers
ill-affected Persons here, being Natives or Inhabitants
of the Kingdom of Ireland, do intend to pass over
thither, to join with the Rebels; it is Ordained by
the Lords and Commons in Parliament, That no
Irishman shall pass out of any the Ports of this Kingdom, to return into Ireland, without special Licence
of the Committees of both Houses for Irish Affairs,
or the Lords of His Majesty's most Honourable
Privy Council, or of the Lord Lieutenant of Ireland: It is further Ordained, That no Arms,
Munition, or Powder, shall be transported, without such Licence as is aforesaid: It is likewise Ordained by the said Lords and Commons, That whereas, upon the Perusal of divers Letters, and other Intelligence here, there is just Cause to suspect that divers
of His Majesty's Subjects in Ireland have had some
Hand in the Conspiracy and Rebellions of the Irish,
That the Lord Lieutenant shall certify, from Time
to Time, during his Abode in England, into Ireland,
the Names of such suspected Persons, and the
Grounds and Reasons of the Suspicion; and that
thereupon the Lords Justices of Ireland, and the
rest of His Majesty's Council there, shall enter
into Examination of the said Parties, and shall have
Power to commit them to Prison, till the Truth may
be fully discovered, that so they may be cleared if
they be innocent, or, if they be found guilty, may
be proceeded against, according to the Laws: And
that this Ordinance of Parliament shall be a sufficient
Warrant to the Lord Lieutenant, Lords Justices, and
A Message was brought up from the House of Commons, by the Lord Phillip Herbert:
Message from the H. C. for a Conference about the Irish Affairs.
To desire a present Conference (if it may stand with
their Lordships Conveniency), by a Committee of both
Houses, touching the Affairs of Ireland.
The Answer hereunto returned was:
That their Lordships will give a present Meeting, in
the Painted Chamber, as is desired.
Ld. Admiral acquaints the House with the King's Directions about Ships to guard the Irish Coasts.
The Lord Admiral signified, "That he had Command
and Directions from His Majesty, to send some Ships
for the Guarding of the Irish Coasts, and also some
Ships to keep the narrow Seas, because His Majesty
conceives that the Rebellion in Ireland is fomented
from abroad, and that they expect some Supply from
Foreign Parts." And his Lordship desired to have the
Directions from the Parliament herein what to do.
Hereupon it is Ordered, To have a Conference
with the House of Commons about this Business.
Conference about Irish Affairs reported.
The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the
Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the
House was resumed; and the Lord Keeper reported the
Effect of the Conference, as followeth:
Propositions of the H. C.
"That the House of Commons proposed divers Orders, made by them, to their Lordships Consideration,
which they think fit to be put into Execution, touching the Affairs of Ireland:
No Irish Soldiers to go beyond Sea.
"1. The House of Commons declares, That they
were misinformed concerning the List of the Soldiers
to go beyond Sea, being informed they were Walloones
and other Strangers; and that the Intention of their
House was not to give Way to any Irish to be transported; neither doth the Order of their House extend to any Persons Subjects of the King, but only
to Strangers: Therefore desires that such of them as
are suspected Persons may be examined.
Coin for Ireland.
"2. That it was delivered, That the House of Commons had Resolved, That the Merchants, who have
made the Proposition to their House of Transporting
Coin in Specie into Ireland, for the present Occasions
of that Kingdom, shall have Liberty to transport so
much only as the Lords and Commons in Parliament
shall, from Time to Time, give them Order and Directions for paying it there as it passes by Proclamation; and that all Sums so transported shall be registered in the Custom-house; and that they shall
bring Certificates from the Ports where they shall land
the said Monies, that they have landed so much there.
And that the House of Commons desires their Lordships to join with them in this Order.
Supply for Ireland.
"3. That the House of Commons have agreed, that
Mr. Henly and Mr. Hawkridge are to pay to Sir Adam
Loftus the Sum of Twenty Thousand Pounds; that
is, Six Thousand upon Sight, and the other Fourteen
Thousand within Fourteen Days after that Fifteen
Thousand Pounds shall be paid here; and the
said Mr. Henly and Mr. Hawkridge are to receive
Ten Thousand Pounds in Hand, Five Thousand more
at Six Days, and Five Thousand more at Two
Months; and they are to have a Licence for the
transporting of Twenty Thousand Pounds of Spanish
Money; and they are to have the Use of such
Shipping as is appointed to transport Money for the
present Service in Ireland, and are to make Entry of
the said Sum in the Custom-house here, and are to
bring Certificate from the Ports in Ireland, where they
shall land the said Monies, that they have landed so
Committee for Irish Affairs.
"4. That the House of Commons desire that Sir
Robert Kinge and Colonel Culpepper may be added to
those that are appointed Assistants to the Committees
for the Irish Affairs.
Servants of the Royal Family to take the Oaths.
"5. That the Servants belonging to the King, Queen,
Prince, or to any of the King's Children, may, according to the Law, take the Oaths of Supremacy
Magenis and Comyn, concerning the Irish Rebellion.
"6. That the House of Commons had received, from
the Mayor of the City of Chester, an Information of
one Thomas Cremor, against one Magennis and Redmond Comyn, for speaking insolent and dangerous
Words touching the Rebellion of Ireland: They desire that the said Magenis and Redmond may be brought
up to the Parliament severally, and not be permitted
to speak with one another; and that they may be examined upon such Interrogatories as shall be prepared
by the House of Commons; and that the rest of the
Persons that were in their Company, and fled, may be
pursued with Hue and Cry, and apprehended; and
such Irishmen that shall be stayed in the Ports may be
examined, upon such Interrogatories as shall be presented by the House of Commons.
Papists to be recalled from Ireland.
"7. That the House of Commons desired, that their
Lordships would give them Answer touching the Proposition formerly brought up, concerning the issuing
out of a Proclamation in Ireland, to recall such Papists
Home here, as have, within One Year last, gone into
Ireland, except the Earl of St. Albanes and others who
live there upon their ancient Inheritance."
This being done; this House read the Propositions severally over again, and gave particular Answers thereunto, as followeth:
Answer to the last Propositions.
To the First. Agreed to; and Ordered, That the
Lord Chief Justice of the King's Bench shall have Power,
by virtue of this Order, to call before his Lordship, and
examine, Mr. Bourke and Edmond Moore, by what Authority they were employed by the Spanish Ambassador
for the raising of Men, and whether they have any Monies in their Hands delivered unto them for the paying of Soldiers; and further Ordered, That all such
Persons, mentioned in a List sent from the Commons
House, that are any Ways suspicious, shall be likewise
examined by his Lordship, and the said Examinations to
be returned unto this House.
To the Second. Agreed to.
To the Third Order. Agreed to.
To the Fourth. Agreed to.
To the Fifth. Agreed to.
To the Sixth. Agreed to.
Proclamation to be issued for English Papists to return from Ireland.
To the Seventh. Agreed to; and Ordered, That
the King's Attorney General shall forthwith make a
Draught of a Proclamation, "That such English Papists
as, within One Year last past, removed themselves
into Ireland (except the Earl of St. Albanes, and such
other Persons as have their ancient Estates and Habitations there) may, by Proclamation, be commanded to
return into England, within One Month after the Proclamation there made, or else some Course shall be
taken by Act of Parliament for Confiscation of their
Estates; which said Proclamation is to be presented
unto His Majesty in Scotland, that He may from
thence send His Warrants and Directions for issuing
out the said Proclamation in the Kingdom of Ireland."
Then this House Resolved, To let the House of Commons know, That their Lordships had agreed to their
Message to the H. C. for a Conference about an Answer to their last Propositions.
A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by
Dr. Bennett and Dr. Littleton:
To desire a Conference, by a Committee of both
Houses, touching an Answer to the Propositions brought
up at the last Conference.
The Messengers returned with this Answer:
That the House of Commons will give a present Meeting, as is desired, in the Painted Chamber.
The House was adjourned during Pleasure, and the
Lords went to the Conference; which being ended, the
House was resumed; and the Lord Keeper reported,
"That he had acquainted the House of Commons with
their Lordships Consent to their Propositions."
Soldiers that were concealed in St. Katherine's.
Ordered, That it is referred to the Committees for
the Irish Affairs, to consider how to dispose of the Soldiers, which are in St. Katherin's; and how the Guard
that watches them shall be paid; and how the Soldiers
shall be provided for, to keep them from Want of
Some of the Instructions to be sent to the Committee in Scotland, assented to.
After this, the House took into Consideration the Instructions which are to be sent into Scotlande, to the
Committees there; and the several Articles being read,
the House gave these Resolutions, as followeth:
To the First Article. This House assented to.
To the Second. Agreed to.
To the Third. Agreed to.
To the Fourth. Agreed to.
To the Fifth. Agreed to.
1000 Scots for Ireland.
Resolved, upon the Question, by the major Part, That
there shall go a Thousand Scotts out of Scotland, for the
repressing of the Rebellion in Ireland.
To the Sixth. Agreed to.
Ordered, That the Debate of the remanent Propositions is deferred until To-morrow.
Dominus Custos Magni Sigilli declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque in diem crastinum,
videlicet, diem Jovis, 11m diem instantis Novembris, hora
11a Aurora, Dominis sic decernentibus.