Wednesday, December 24, 1656.
An Act for naturalizing of Lewis du Moulin, doctor of
physic, (fn. 1) and others, read three times together: such as I have
not known before.
Resolved to pass for a law, and that his Highness's consent
be desired thereunto.
Sir William Strickland reported the amendments from the
Committee, to whom the Bill was referred for settling upon
Judge-Advocate Whalley, and Mr. Erasmus Smith, lands
in Ireland, fallen to them by lot as adventurers there.
Lord Ardes's and Lord Glainboise's lands were fallen by lot
to the said adventurers; (fn. 2) but the Committee reported that
other lands are set out in lieu of those lands.
Major-General Disbrowe and Lord Lambert proposed that
they be set out by any three or more of his Highness's
council, whereof the Lord Deputy to be one.
Mr. Robinson. The amendments are quite otherwise than
the Bill. It is a matter of great concernment. Here are
9000 acres, English measure, settled upon them; for Irish
measures are double, and you leave it to them to make their
election. Surely they will not chuse the worst. If you give
such large exhibitions, I doubt you will find some fall short;
they that come last. Other public debts are to be satisfied
out of Irish lands. I would have these gentlemen performed
with to a penny; but I would have no more given them than
is their contract. I like not those general terms, " all other
advantages." I desire it should either be recommitted, or put
in more particular terms. Here are 5000 Irish acres.
Sir William Strickland. I hope it is put into the hands of
such persons as will be very faithful to you, in seeing that no
more be set out than is due.
Colonel Jones. By the orders of the House, the member
concerned ought to withdraw. You must be careful in the
measure, for you may be much mistaken in that, for Irish
acres are double others.
Mr. Attorney-General. Unless the member be accused
of some crime, he need not withdraw. In such cases the
member stands up in his seat, and makes his defence, and
then is to withdraw.
Major-General Bridges. There is no such difference in the
measure as is represented to you.
Major-General Goffe. Put all the amendments to the
question together in the gross.
Resolved, that the lands be set out by three or more of
the council, whereof the Lord-Deputy, or Chief-Governor
of Ireland, to be one. Amendment upon amendment.
Captain Scotten. Seeing you have left out the house of
Portumna, (fn. 3) I desire that you would assign them a house in
Mr. Speaker pressed that a house should be assigned
Resolved, to agree with the Committee, in all these amendments.
Resolved, that this Bill be engrossed.
Sir Lislebone Long. Sir Thomas Viner, (fn. 4) and several other
citizens are attending without, with a petition; I desire they
may be called in.
Alderman Foot. I desire to second that motion, that the
petitioners may be called in It seems, it is a contrary petition to what came in yesterday. (fn. 5)
Mr. Bampfield. An Act for raising of maintenance for a
minister, at Newport, in the Isle of Wight. Read a first
Colonel Sydenham and Sir William Strickland proposed,
that it might be read a second time, upon Friday next.
Sir Edward Rhodes. I desire you will not appoint it on
Friday; that is the day appointed for the Scotch business.
Mr. Attorney-General. It may be read in the morning,
the first business.
Resolved, that this Bill be read a second time, on Friday.
Sir Christopher Pack proposed to call in the petitioners.
Mr. Speaker. I hope you intend to call in those noble
citizens that wait at the door, as soon as this Bill is read.
Mr. Bampfield brought in another Bill to the same purpose,
for Exeter; intitled, " An Act for promoting, and more frequent preaching of, the Gospel, and maintenance of ministers in the City of Exeter, and uniting of parishes and
parish Churches within the said City of Exeter."
Mr. Speaker. Observe this Bill. It is of more concernment than the former. It is for the uniting of parishes, &c.
Observe this clause: " The Mayor and Burgesses there, to
have the Advowson of these places, for them and their successors for ever; and for settling all the Dean's and Dean
and Chapter's lands adjoining."
Mr. Nathaniel Bacon, was glad to hear the House so
zealous for providing a future maintenance for ministers,
whilst others were taking it away; but desired it might be
committed to fill up the blanks.
Resolved, that this Bill be read a second time, upon Wednesday.
Sir Thomas Viner, and about twenty more citizens, called
in. They opened their petition: "A Petition of the President
and Governors of the Corporation for the Poor of the City of
It was against the brokers' (fn. 6) buying of stolen goods, and
not entering them.
Alderman Foot. In King James's time, a registry was
settled for entry of all such goods, whereby many robberies
and burglaries were discovered.
Captain Baynes. The brokers do so grind the faces of the
poor, by unreasonable exactions, sixty per cent, nay double,
every year. This is not in the petition. I desire these may
Mr. Godfrey and Dr. Clarges proposed, that this might be
taken into consideration, for it was a very great grievance; and
that it might not only extend to the City, but to the liberties.
Mr. Church proposed, that it might extend all the nation
Major-General Kelsey proposed, not to clog the business.
Mr. Robinson. This brocage is a great grievance; but I
know not how it will be remedied, unless you take away the
livelihood of thousands of poor people. Though they pay
exactious rates, both for the clothes and monies borrowed of
the brokers; yet the poor people make it their subsistence.
If you take that away, many will perish for want of sustenance. Instanced in oyster-women, (fn. 7) and the like.
Alderman Foot and Sir Christopher Pack said, that it
ought to be referred to the Committee of Trade.
Major-General Kelsey. The way to lose the business is, to
commit it thither. I desire it may rather be transferred to
the Committee for the other petition of the city.
Colonel Mathews. I never knew any Committee dispatch
business more cleverly than that Committee.
Resolved, that this petition be referred to the Committee
Resolved, that the business of brocage be referred to the
Captain Baynes. I believe it will be offered to the Committee how useful would be a small bank for the relief of poor
people, upon pawns of this kind, so that these brokers will
fall to the ground of course.
The Master of the Rolls and Mr. Solicitor General. This
Corporation was settled in the Long Parliament; but none
but freemen's children can be received.
I desire that the poor of the country giving monies with
their children, may be received into this Corporation.
Mr. Robinson proposed to refer the Bill to this Committee
to consider of the constitution of this Corporation.
Alderman Foot and Mr. Recorder. If we must receive the
poor of the country, we must have more houses built.
Resolved, that it be referred to the same Committee to
consider of a way for provision for the poor in the country.
Mr. Lister reported the amendments to the Bill for the
probate of wills. (fn. 8)
1st Amendment. Salary of judges at 200l. per annum.
Resolved, to agree with the Committee in this amendment.
2d. That the clause for making it a Court of Record be
3d. That all wills concerning lands shall be registered
with the registrar.
Mr. Solicitor-General, Mr. Attorney-General and Lord
Chief-Justice, were against the registering of such wills, for it
would be the way to encourage forgery. Ecclesiastical courts
never had cognisance of such wills. This concerns men's inheritances, which cannot be determined but by witnesses
before a jury. That clause may very well be left out and
the Bill stand.
Mr. Speaker. This is an independent clause, and may be
left out without prejudice to the Bill. Make it thus, that
where land is divised in the will, the Court may not keep the
Mr. Fowell. Lands passed by will, are not testimentary.
I need not prove it unless I will.
Captain Baynes proposed to agree with the Committee.
The Master of the Rolls. The seal of the probate is good
enough for the goods, and is evidence in any court, but for
lands it cannot be evidence, and, therefore, the original will
must remain in the devisee's hands. It may be any of our
cases. No man knows who shall be first.
Mr. Robinson. This registering of wills, I fear me, will
not be sufficient, unless you make it a Court of Record. I
cannot be satisfied that the clause before you is enough for
that purpose. I desire you would adjourn for the present,
and debate it to-morrow morning.
Major-General Disbrowe, Lord-Chief Justice and Major
General Howard proposed that it might be recommitted.
The Speaker offered to amend it at the chair.
Resolved, that this Bill be recommitted, and that all the
gentlemen of the long robe may be added.
Per Mr. Pedley. Resolved, that the Report from the
Committee for Rodney's petition be upon Wednesday next.
Per Lord Lambert. Resolved that the Bill for General
Monk (fn. 9) be read a second time on Friday.
It was moved to have a Report from the Committee for
Civil law on Wednesday, and the question being put, Mr.
Speaker declared the affirmative, but Mr. Robinson stood up
and was unsatisfied. The House divided but it was yielded,
Resolved, that the Report from the Committee for the
Civil Law be brought in on Wednesday next.
Resolved, to add several members to several Committees.
I was this afternoon with Captain Lister's Committee in
the Inner Court of Wards; who only ordered Serjeant Maynard to be sent for, and adjourned till Friday at three.
In the same place sat the Committee for the citizens' petition.
In the Speaker's chamber, Major-General Howard, Mr.
Briscoe, Mr. Fenwick, and I, at a sub-Committee for the
Borders. (fn. 10)
In the same place, upon a sub-Committee, where Mr
West had the chair, to examine Mr. Thomas Duckett about
the probability of his project for the new way of tanning and
dressing leather, and improving of lands, according to some
proposals before the Committee of Trade. The Committee
approved of his ways in many particulars.