House of Commons Journal Volume 2
28 February 1642

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1802

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'House of Commons Journal Volume 2: 28 February 1642', Journal of the House of Commons: volume 2: 1640-1643 (1802), pp. 458-461. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=3932 Date accessed: 23 July 2014.


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Die Lunæ, ultimo Feb. 1641.

PRAYERS.

Nottingham Petition.

THE humble Petition of Inhabitants of the County of Nott', whose Names are underwritten, was read; shewing many Obstructions, caused by Serjeant Boone, to hinder the Preferring of the Petition from the County: Which is annexed to the said Petition.

Mr. Thornehagh and Mr. Ireton, who subscribed the Petition, were called in; and did avow the Petition, and the Truth of it of their own Knowledge.

Resolved, upon the Question, That Gilbert Boone, Serjeant at Law, shall be forthwith sent for as a Delinquent, by the Serjeant at Arms attending on this House.

Resolved, That the Lord Keeper shall be moved, from this House, to be put out of the Commission of the Peace, Gilbert Boone, Serjeant at Law: And Mr. Valentine is to move the Lord Keeper to this Purpose.

The Gentleman that preferred the Petition were again called in: And Mr. Speaker told them, **** "They do perceive in it a great deal... Care of the Commonwealth, and of Respect to this House; and of Judgment in Discovery of this Man: For which he was commanced to return you Thanks."

A Message from the Lords, by ****;

King's Answer concerning of the Prince.

"The Lords have received an Answer from his Majesty, concerning the Prince; and withal, upon the Information of the Lord Chamberlain, of the great Indisposition and State of Health; and that he was come from the Prince to attend the Recovery of his Health; and the King hath taken the Care of the Prince; and will take the Prince along with him in his intended Journey."

Speeches against the House.

"We are likewise to acquaint you, from the Lords, with the Delivery of some Letters by the Lord Portland to the Lords House, concerning some uncomely Speeches against this House, by one Symond Basse, and others: The House hath sent for them; and have communicated to this House the Letters and Examinations."

King's Answer concerning the Prince.

Mr. Hide informed the House, that himself and Sir Wm. Poole, being commanded by this House, attended his Majesty at Canterbury, with the Desire of both Houses concerning the Prince; and, That Evening, his Majesty gave us a Paper in Answer to it: But immediately called us again; and told us, If we could not reach London so early on Saturday, before the Houses rise, that then we should attend him at Greenwiche on Sunday: Which we did accordingly: And his Majesty commanded us to give him that Paper back again; and gave us This Answer in Writing: Which the Lords have sent hither.

King's Answer concerning the Militia.

A Message from the Lords, by the Master of the Rolls and Judge Mallett;

The Lords having received his Majesty's Answer, concerning the Militia, in regard of the great Speed and Expedition it requires, have sent you the Originals; and desire you to take Copies of it: And in regard it is a Matter of so great Weight, have resolved to meddle with no other Business till this be done: And desires this House to give all Expedition unto it: And have adjourned till Two... Clock in the Afternoon.

King's Answer concerning the Prince.

His Majesty's Answer to the Reasons he received, by way of Message, from both Houses, concerning the Prince his Son, was read, in hæc verba; viz..

1. THAT His Majesty intended, at his Remove from Hampton-court, with his Royal Consort the Queen, towards Dover, that the Prince his Son should stay at Hampton-court till His Majesty returned to some of His Houses: And thereupon, as soon as His Majesty resolved upon a certain Day to be at Greenwich, He commanded that His Son should attend him there; which was no way contrary to His former Intention.

2. That His Majesty was very sorry to hear of the Indisposition of the Marquis Hertford, being the Person upon whom He principally relies for the Care of His dearest Son; but, if that Indisposition should have lasted, His Majesty could no ways think fit that his Want of Health should have hindered the Prince from waiting upon His Majesty, according to His Command: and, therefore, would have been much offended if the Prince had failed of meeting His Majesty according to his Appointment.

3. To the Fears and Jealousies, His Majesty knows not what Answer to give, not being able to imagine from what Grounds they proceed: But, if any Information hath been given to that Purpose, His Majesty much desires that the same may be examined to the Bottom: And then He hopes that these Fears and Jealousies will be hereafter continued only with reference to His Majesty's Rights and Honour.

King's Answer concerning the Militia.

His Majesty's Answer to the Desires of both Houses, concerning the Militia, was read, in hac verba; viz.

HIS Majesty having, with his best Care and Understanding, perused and considered That which was sent Him from both Houses for the Ordering of the Militia, presented unto Him, to be made an Ordinance of Parliament, by the giving of the Royal Assent; as He can by no means do it, for the Reasons hereafter mentioned, so He doth not conceive Himself obliged by any Promise made in His Answer of the Second of this Month to the Petition of both Houses, to yield the same."

His Majesty finds great Cause to except against the

King's Answer concerning the Militia.

Preface or Introduction to that Order, which confesseth a most dangerous and desperate Design upon the House of Commons of late, supposed to be an Effect of the bloody Counsel of Papists, and other evil-affected Persons; by which many may understand, looking upon other printed Papers to that Purpose, His coming in Person to the House of Commons on the Fourth of January, which begot so unhappy a Misunderstanding between Him and His People: And, for that, though He believes it, upon the Information since given him, to be an apparent Breach of their Privilege; and hath offered, and is ready, to repair the same for the future, by any Act shall be desired of His Majesty; yet He must declare, and require to be believed, that he had no other Design upon that House, or any Member of it, than to require, as He did, the Persons of those Five Gentlemen His Majesty had the Day before accused of High Treason; and to declare, that he meant to proceed against them legally and speedily: Upon which He believed, that this House would have delivered them up. And His Majesty calls Almighty God to witness, that He was so far from any Intention or thought of Force or Violence, although the House had not delivered them according to His Demand, in case whatsoever, that He gave those His Servants and others who then waited upon His Majesty, express Charge and Command that they should give no Offence to any Man; nay, if they received any Provocation or Injury, that they should bear it without Return: And His Majesty never saw, nor knew, that any Person of His Train had any other Weapons but His Pensioners and Guard, those with which they usually attend His Person to Parliament; and the other Gentlemen, Swords: And therefore his Majesty doubts not but His Parliament will be so regardful of his Honour herein, that He shall not undergo any Imputation by the rash or indiscreet Expressions of any young Men then in His Train; or by any desperate Words uttered by others, who might mingle with them, without his Consent or Approbation.

For the Persons nominated to be Lieutenants of the several Counties of England and Wales, his Majesty is contented to allow that Recommendation; only concerning the City of London, and such other Corporations as by ancient... have granted unto them the Power of the Militia, His Majesty doth not conceive that it can stand with Justice or Policy to alter the Government in that Particular: And his Majesty is willing forthwith to grant every of them (that of London, and those other Corporations excepted) such Commissions as he hath done this Parliament to some Lords Lieutenants by your Advice: But if that Power be not thought enough, but that more shall be thought fit to be granted to those Persons named than by the Law is in the Crown itself, His Majesty holds it reasonable, that the same be, by some Law, first vested in Him, with Power to transfer it to these Persons; which He will willingly do: And whatever that Power shall be, to avoid all future Doubts and Questions, His Majesty desires it may be digested into an Act of Parliament, rather than an Ordinance; so that all his loving Subjects may thereby particularly know both what they are... do, and what they are to suffer for their Neglect; that there may be the least Latitude for his good Subjects to suffer under any arbitrary Power whatsoever.

As to the Time desired for the Continuance of the Power to be granted, His Majesty giveth this Answer; That He cannot consent to divest Himself of the just Power which God and the Laws of this Kingdom have placed in him, for the Defence of his People; and to put it into the Hands of others, for any indefinite Time: And, since the Ground of this Request of his Parliament, was to secure their present Fears and Jealousies, that they might, with Safety, apply themselves to the Matter of His Message of the Twentieth of January, His Majesty hopeth, that His Service to them, since that Time, in Yielding to so many of their Desires, and in agreeing to the Persons now recommended unto Him by His Parliament, and the Power before expressed to be placed in them, will wholly expel those Fears and Jealousies; and assureth them, that, as his Majesty hath now applied this unusual Remedy to their Doubts, so, if there shall be Cause, He will continue the same to such Time as shall be agreeable to the same Care He now expresseth to them.

And, in this Answer, His Majesty is so far from receding from any Thing He promised or intended to grant, in His Answer to the former Petition, that His Majesty hath hereby consented to all was then asked of Him by that Petition; concerning the Militia of the Kingdom, except That of London, and those other Corporations; which was, to put the same into the Hands of such Persons as should be recommended unto Him by both Houses of Parliament. And His Majesty doubts not but the Parliament, upon well weighing the Particular of this His Answer, will find the same more satisfactory to their Ends, and the Peace and Welfare of all his good Subjects, than the Way proposed by this intended Ordinance; to which, for these Reasons, His Majesty cannot consent. And whereas His Majesty observes, by the Petitions from both Houses, presented to Him by the Earl of Portland, Sir Tho. Heale, and Sir William Savile, that, in some Places, some Persons begin already to intermeddle of themselves with Militia, His Majesty expecteth, that His Parliament should examine the Particulars thereof; it being a Matter of high Concernment, and very great Consequence: And his Majesty requireth, that if it shall appear to His Parliament, that any Person whatsoever have presumed to command the Militia, without lawful Authority, they may be proceeded against according to Law.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this Answer of his Majesty is a denial to the Desires of both Houses of Parliament concerning the Militia.

Resolved, upon the Question, That those that advised his Majesty to give this Answer, are Enemies to the State, and mischievous Projectors against the Safety of the King, and Peace of this Kingdom.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this Denial is of that dangerous Consequence, that, if his Majesty shall persist in it, it will hazard the Peace and Safety of all his Kingdoms, unless some speedy Remedy be applied by the Wisdom and Authority of both Houses of Parliament.

Resolved, upon the Question, That such Parts of this Kingdom as have put themselves into a Posture of Defence against the common Dangers, have done nothing but what is justifiable, and is approved of by this House.

Resolved, upon the Question, That if his Majesty shall remove into any remote Parts from his Parliament, it will be a great Hazard to the Kingdom, and a great Prejudice to the Proceedings of the Parliament.

Resolved, &c. That this House holds it necessary, that his Majesty may be desired, that the Prince may come unto St. James's, or to some other convenient Place near about London, and there to continue.

Resolved, &c. That the Lords be desired to join with this House, in an Humble Request unto his Majesty, that he will be pleased to reside near his Parliament, that both Houses may have a Conveniency of Access unto him upon all Occasions.

Resolved, &c. That the Lords be desired to join with this House, in some fit Course of Examination, to find out who were the Persons that gave his Majesty this Advice, that they may be removed from his Majesty, and brought to condign Punishment.

Resolved, &c. That no Charter can be granted by the King, to create a Power in any Corporation over the Militia of that Place, without the Consent of Parliament.

Resolved, &c. That the Lords shall be moved to join with this House in these Votes.

Resolved, That the Lords shall be desired to appoint a select Committee, that may join with a Committee of a proportionable Number of this House, to consider what is fit farther to be done upon these Votes, or upon any thing else that may arise upon his Majesty's Answers to the Desires of both Houses, concerning the Militia; or upon this Message concerning the Prince.

Resolved, &c. That a Conference shall be desired with the Lords; and that these Resolutions upon his Majesty's Answer shall be the Heads of this Conference.

Conference, &c.

Mr. Arth. Goodwyn is appointed to go to the Lords, to desire a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, concerning his Majesty's Answer, this Day sent to both Houses, to the Desires of both Houses concerning the Militia.

He is likewise to desire, that Sir Geo. Hamilton, and the Son of the Lord Nettersfield, their Lordships Prisoners, may be examined by a Committee of this House.

Leave of Absence.

Mr. Buller, Mr. Mannaton, Sir Ra. Sydenham, have Leave to go into the Country.

Conference, &c.

Mr. Goodwyn brings Answer, That the Lords will give a present Meeting at a Conference, as is desired; and they do likewise give Consent, that Colonel Butler and Mr. Newtersfield be examined.

Mr. Pym, Mr. Hollis, Sir Philip Stapilton, Mr. Glyn, are appointed Managers of this Conference.

Farmers of Customs.

Ordered, That the Monies raised by the several Compositions already made, or hereafter to be made, by the Committee for the Customers with the late Farmers of the Petty Farms, or their several Under-sharers, shall be paid by them unto the Hands of Sir Robert Pye Knight, and John Brooke Esquire, One of the Tellers of his Majesty's Exchequer, or One of them, for the Use of the Commonwealth; and that their or either of their Receipts shall be sufficient Discharges to any such Persons for the same.

Delves'Arms.

Ordered, That Sir Jo. Hotham shall give Directions, that so many of those Arms that were lately shipped from Newcastle, and were stayed at Hull by Order of this House, that do belong to Henry Delves of Cheshire Esquire; a Note whereof is as followeth, One hundred Eighty-two Heads, One hundred Eighty-five Breasts, and One hundred Ninety-three Backs; may be forthwith cleared at Hull, and delivered to Machabeus Hollis, Merchant of Hull, for the Use of the said Henry Delves aforesaid.

Opening Letters.

Mr. Prideaux informs the House, that these Irish commanders that were stayed by Mr. Fortescue, that came from France, and were going to the Rebels, are now upon their Way; and that, upon farther Search, they found about them Two Letters directed to the President of Munster; which might be but false Covers.

Sir Jo. Bampfield, Mr. Prideaux, and Mr. Crue, are appointed to open these Letters.

Speaking against Parliament.

The Letter directed to the Earl of Portland, from the Isle of Wight, and the Informations inclosed, concerning Words spoken against the Parliament, by Bisse and Simonds, were read; and because the Lords had sent for them, this House meddled no more with it.

Naval Commanders.

Sir Hen. Vaine the Younger presented to the House a List of the Names of the Commanders of the King's Ships, and of the Merchant Ships, to be set to Sea for this Summer's Fleet, from the Lord Admiral: Which being read;

It was Ordered, That Thanks should be returned to the Lord Admiral.

The Lord Admiral said, that these Commanders of the King's Ships are such as have been formerly employed, and against whom he knew no just Exceptions: For the Commanders of the Merchant Ships, he knew nothing, but that they were such as were recommended to his Lordship by the Committee of this House for the Navy.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House does give Allowance to this List, as to the Merchants Ships, and Mr. Martin's.

Ordered, That the List of the Names of the Commanders of the King's Ships shall be taken into Consideration on Thursday next, after Eleven of Clock.

Irish Affairs.

Ordered, That the Lords be moved to join with this House, that some Members of both Houses may be ap pointed to be Commissioners, to take the Names of such Members of either House as shall underwrite any Sums of Money, according to the Propositions made for the Succours of Ireland; and to receive their Money.

Ordered, That Mr. Pym, Sir Walth. Erle, and Mr. Reynolds, do withdraw, to prepare an Order according to the Heads propounded at the Bar, concerning the Propositions made for the Succours of Ireland.

Whereas many who are engaged in the Wars of Ireland, having an earnest Desire that those Wars may be soon determined, and that Kingdom reduced to a peaceable Condition; for the better Provision of those who serve in that War, being desirous to underwrite Sums of Money, but not having Money in Readiness for the Discharge of that Engagement, as is set down in the Propositions, do therefore desire, that it may be ordered, that whosoever of the Army, being an Officer, will undertake any certain Sum of Money, not less than Fifty Pounds, being Part or the Whole of his personal Entertainment, for Six Months; such Underwriting, or so much of it as shall grow due whilst the Underwriter continues in Entertainment, shall be accepted and received as good and current Payment; it being deducted from such of the Army, as abovesaid, out of their constant growing Entertainment: And such Underwriters shall have their proportionable Divisions, for their Entertainments, deducted, as any other Adventurer hath upon the Determination of the War, and Settlement of that Kingdom.

Resolved, upon the Question, That this House does give a Consent to this Proposition made by the Officers to be employed in Ireland.

Committee of both Houses.

A Message from the Lords, by Sir Edw. Leech and Doctor Bennett;

The Lords do concur with this House in all the Votes lately sent from this House; and, in pursuance thereof, they have nominated a select Committee of Fourteen, to meet with a proportionable Number of this House, presently, in the Painted Chamber; and that they have appointed Four to be of the Quorum to have Power to meet.

Mr. Pym, Mr. Hampden, Mr. Hollis, Sir H. Vane junior, Mr. Glyn, Sir Jo. Evelyn, Sir Wm. Lewis, Mr. Martin, Mr. Arth. Goodwyn, Sir Peter Wentworth, Mr. Crue, Sir Gilbert Gerard, Mr. Morley, Sir Ph. Stapilton, Sir Ro. Coke, Sir Sam. Rolle, Mr. Fienis, Sir Anth. Irby, Sir Tho. Barrington, Sir Ro. Crane, Sir Edm. Montfort, Mr. Strode, Sir Edw. Hungerford, Sir Christ. Yelverton, Mr. Solicitor, Serjeant Wilde, Mr. Pierrepoint, Sir Wm. Massam;

This Committee, or any Eight of them, are to meet with the Committee of the Lords, or any Four of that Committee, presently, in the Painted Chamber, concerning the Matter of the last Conference.

Answer returned by the same Messengers; That this House has considered of their Lordships Message; and has appointed a Committee of a proportionable Number; and has given Power to their Committee, or any Eight of them, to meet with the Committee of the Lords, or any Four of them, presently, in the Painted Chamber.

The Committee went forth to meet with the Lords accordingly.

Brewers.

2da vice lecta est Billa, An Act concerning Brewers, upon * * * *

Mr. Jennour, Mr. Cage, Sir Jo. Evelyn, Sir Tho. Dacres, Sir Ro. Pye, Ald. Pennington, Mr. Reynolds, Sir Arth. Hasilrig, Sir Edw. Hales, Mr. Rigby, Mr. Moore, Mr. Bence, Mr. Peard, Mr. Browne, Sir Rich. Onslow, Sir Mar. Lister, Mr. Petham, Mr. Prideaux, Sir Wm. Ogle, Sir F. Popham, Sir Ed. Varney, Sir Tho. Cheeke, Sir Jo. Dreyden, Mr. Hoyle, Sir Jo. Franklyn, Mr. Bodevile, Sir Jo. Harrison, Mr. Sandys, Mr. Bond, * Constantine: And are to meet on Saturday; at Eight of Clock.

Ld. Castleton's Estate.

That the Knights and Burgesses of Yorkshire, Dr. Eden, Mr. Fettyplace, Sir Guy Palmes, and Mr. Reynolds, and Sir Ro. Pye, be added to the Committee for the Lord Viscount Castleton.

Stepney Parish.

Ordered, That the Committee for Dividing the Parish of Stepney be revived; and do meet on Friday next, at Eight of Clock, in the Exchequer Chamber: And that Mr. Moore and Sir John Harrison be added to this Committee.

Information against Ligh.

Ordered, That Geo. Ligh, of the City of Gloucester, Gentleman, be summoned to attend this House forthwith, to give Answer to such Matters as shall be objected against him, concerning scandalous Words spoken by him against this House.

Ordered, That Tho. Tray shall have an Order for the Bringing up of such Witnesses as he shall nominate, to prove the Information given in against Mr. Geo. Ligh, of Glocester.

Privilege to Sir T. Dawes, &c.

Ordered, That Sir Tho. Dawes and Mr. John Dawes shall have the Privilege of Parliament, to come and go freely, without Arrest or Molestation, for a Month longer; to the end that they may, with Security, pursue and follow such Businesses as concern them and their Estate, and are now depending before a Committee of this House.

Payments to Town of Newcastle, &c.

It is this Day Ordered, by the Commons House of Parliament, that the Lord Mayor of the City of York, and the Commissioners for the Poll-money, do pay unto Sir Nicholas Cole, Knight and Baronet, Mayor of the Town of Newcastle, Sir Lyonell Maddison Knight, and Leonard Carre Aldermen, or to their Assigns, the Sum of One hundred Pounds, being Part of that Money which is now remaining at York upon the Poll bill; to be distributed by them to the several Inhabitants of the said Town of Newcastle, respectively interested in Discharge of so much of the Monies due to them by the Scotts Army, amounting to the Sum of Two thousand Pounds, and undertaken by this House: For which this shall be a sufficient Discharge to the said Lord Mayor, and the Commissioners.

It is this Day Ordered, by the House of Commons, now assembled in Parliament, That the Lord Mayor of the City of York, and Commissioners for the Poll money, do pay unto Sir John Fenwick Knight and Baronet, Sir Wm. Widrington, Sir Wm. Carnaby, Sir Tho. Widrington, Knights, John Fenwick Esquire, or to their Assigns, the Sum of Four hundred Pounds, being Part of that Money which is now remaining at York upon the Poll-bill; to be distributed by them to the several Inhabitants of the County of Northumberland, respectively interested, in discharge of so much Moneys due to them by the Scotts Army, amounting to the Sum of Ten thousand Six hundred and Fifteen Pounds Eleven Shillings and Ten-pence, and undertaken by this House; for which this shall be a sufficient Discharge to the said Lord Mayor, and the Commissioners.

Convent Garden Church.

Ordered, The Committee for Convent Garden Church be revived on Thursday, Eight . . . Clock.