House of Commons Journal Volume 1
12 December 1621

Sponsor

History of Parliament Trust

Publication

Year published

1802

Pages

Annotate

Comment on this article
Double click anywhere on the text to add an annotation in-line

Citation Show another format:

'House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 12 December 1621', Journal of the House of Commons: volume 1: 1547-1629 (1802), pp. 661-662. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=5206 Date accessed: 24 April 2014. Add to my bookshelf


Highlight

(Min 3 characters)

Mercurii, 12o Decembris

Message from the King to proceed with Bills.

THE House sitting long silent;

Mr. Secretary : - That he hath received a Commandment from the King, who hath taken Notice of the not proceeding in Bills here, to let the House know, his express Commandment is, we shall proceed on with Bills, and to prepare to make an End of a Session before Christmas. - Hopeth, by this not meddling in Business, we will not make a Recess in Substance, which we avoid in Shew.

Proceedings on King's Message.

Sir Wm. Fleetewood: - To send up the Bill against Imprisonment contrary to Magna Charta.

Sir Ro. Philippes moveth, a select Committee, to consider of a fitting Answer; because a great Dilemma.

Master of the Rolls . - Will speak, to draw us out of this Dilemma. - Propoundeth a middle Course. - To prepare for Reading of Bills. - A Committee, for Continuance of Statutes, presently. - Let us not hinder the Carrying down of Bills, which we have so desired.

Mr. Amnerst: - This Bill of great Weight. - To have a Committee, specially to consider of it.

Sir Francis Seymor secondeth Sir Ro. Phillippes, for a select Committee, to consider, whether the following this Commandment, presently, be not a special Infringing our Liberties.

Mr. Solicitor : - The King's Message is, not to direct up to this Business alone [which no Commandment, but an Admonition) but to proceed in a parliamentary Course about Parliament Business.

Mr. Crew: - Remembereth Sir Francis Goodwyn's Case, wherein they were put upon a Rock ; yet the King, upon true Information, gave the House Satisfaction. - That we have not been silent, nor omitted Doing of Business : - Have prepared, and sent, our Petition to his Majesty: Are now consulting about Lepton and Goldsmythe's Business, which much concerneth the whole House. - That many Bills already prepared. - Going now to prepare other Bills, will hinder, and not further, what we intend. - First to finish the Business of Goldsmyth, which One Hour will do, - That troubled Thoughts not fit for Judgment, requisite in passing of Bills. - When we upright

in the King's Judgment, may do more in an Hour, than can do in a Day. - A Committee, to consider of a fit Answer to this last Message; and then to survey the State of Bills in the House :

Mr. Glanvyle: - The House hath forborn to enter any Order for Forbearance of Business: This done in Duty to the King. - Have not been idle : Are now busy in a Matter, greatly considering the Liberties and Honour of the House; viz. Goldsmyth and Lepton. - This Message of a large Extent. - May, by Degrees, be drawn to enjoin what we shall do, and what we shall not do. - That some evil Spirits, by misinforming the King, put us upon these many Rocks. - To debate this by a Committee.

Mr. Secretary : - That this an express Commandment to the House, and not only an Advice. - Thinketh this without Prejudice to the Liberties of the House.

Sir D. Digges: - Messages, by Letters, may bring much Inconvenience. - Was ever of mind to go on with Bills, till this Commandment. - Doubteth this Commandment doth press upon our Liberties. - A Committee for this. - Have ever been upon Business, and now are: - And to go on with Goldsmythe's Business, and a Committee, to survey the State of the Business of this House.

Sir Geor. Moor : - To make a Committee; but yet first to debate it here. - Desired to proceed with this [a] Bills, before this Commandment. - No great Cause, by this Commandment, to alter this. - Our Bounds and Liberties, when a Parliament called, to chuse Members; when here, to propose the Grievances of our Countries, and to prepare Laws, or Petitions, for reforming them. If the King command us to make Choice of Members for this House, according to the Law, this Commandment no Cause to hinder us from making a Choice. The King informed, there is a Cessation : Wherein misinformed : For we have continually been in Business. - The Petition, and Goldsmythe's Business. - Not to leave off our Duties, in proceeding in Business, because the King commandeth it. - Had been a Breach of Privilege, if the King had commanded us not to proceed in Business. - To debate this well here; and after, a Committee.

Sir Tho. Hobby: - A Committee, for this, of the whole House. That the usual Course to satisfy his Majesty.

Sir Nath. Rich: - This the greatest Business, that ever here. - To take some Time to consider of it. To search for Precedents first, whereby Light and Direction for our Proceedings. - The rather, because Goldsmythe's Business now in Hand, which will take up all the usual Time of sitting, moveth, to proceed now in that Business; and To-morrow Morning to proceed in the Business now moved : And, that Mr. Secretary may set down this last Message in Writing, and present it To-morrow Morning; and then a Committee of the whole House to determine it. Sir Tho. Wentworth: - To meet here, about this, this Afternoon ; that so we may lose no Time.

Sir Edw. Coke agreeth to husband Time. - Est modus in rebus, sunt certi denique fines. - A Letter, that we should deal with no Matter of Government, or that hath Motion in Court of Justice : By this a Commandment, to proceed to prepare Bills against Christmas. - If a Patent upon a false Suggestion, void. A Parliament-man had need to have his Wits about him, not under a Cloud. - Not to deny his Majesty's Commandment. - To have the Commandment in Writing. To resolve nothing upon ore tenus. To have it set down in Writing, by Mr. Secretary, and to be then presented to the House.

Sir Edw. Gyles: - The honester Men, the worse Luck. Never so many honest Men thrust upon so many Rocks. This Proceeding from the Man of Sin. This the greatest Work, that ever came athwart us : Concerneth the State of the Kingdom, in our Privileges. - To begin with this To-morrow Morning.

Ordered, Mr. Secretary to set down the Message, now brought from his Majesty, in Writing, against To-morrow Morning, and to present it to the House; and then a Committee of the whole House, to take Consideration thereof; and Mr. Speaker to be present.