Spain
October 1545, 16-31

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Institute of Historical Research

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Martin A. S. Hume (editor)

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1904

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268-274

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'Spain: October 1545, 16-31', Calendar of State Papers, Spain, Volume 8: 1545-1546 (1904), pp. 268-274. URL: http://www.british-history.ac.uk/report.aspx?compid=88240 Date accessed: 02 September 2014.


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October 1545, 16–31

22 Oct. Vienna Imp. Arch.156. Van der Delft to the Emperor.
Since writing my letters of the 14th instant I have received those of M. de Granvelle, informing me that by your Majesty's commands he and M. D'Eick had dealt with the English ambassador at Brussels in the matter of the truce, and also that the French ambassadors there had asked him whether the King of England intended to include the Scots (in the truce). He (Granvelle) instructed me to use every possible effort to sound the people here on these points.
I have, Sire, been unable to ascertain anything, beyond the fact that the negotiations for the truce, so far as these people are concerned, are solely directed to the particular point which your Majesty knows of. (fn. 1) There is really no question of any truce with the French, much less with the Scots; though in my opinion if they (the English) were assured on the private points referred to they might be induced to agree to it, although affairs in Scotland are very favourable for them, as is confirmed by all the captains and soldiers who come from there.
I suppose that the bishop of Winchester will already have arrived there to negotiate with the French representative. The folks here are extremely curious to know about the arrival of the latter and they never fail to ask me for news on the subject. I am writing similarly to M. de Granvelle, but more in detail so it will not be necessary for me to weary your Majesty further.
London, 22 October, 1545.
23 Oct. Simancas. E. F. 501.157. Secretary Idiaquez to Francisco de los Cobos.
Dandino (fn. 2) and Marquina have arrived here with the Bull of the Pope concerning the half-first fruits and the sale of the monastic manors. One clause of the treaty, as it is now worded, is to the effect that if the war against the protestants does not take place, the half-first fruits shall be restored to the churches, and the manors revert to the monasteries. The Emperor objects to this clause. The Pope undertakes to pay to the Emperor a subvention of 200,000 ducats, and to provide a contingent of 12,000 foot and 500 horse to aid the enterprise against the protestants. The draft treaty now brought, however, makes no mention of the further 100,000 ducats, which the Pope was to pay. It is stipulated also that the papal contingent is only to remain with the Emperor for four months. The Emperor demands that they shall be at his disposal for the duration of the war. The reply of the Pope to these objections is daily expected. The negotiations between France and England remain without change since my last. The Emperor has taken up the matter in order that he may be able to mediate between them. The German troops engaged by the King of England have already entered French territory and are marching towards Calais. The French have not yet made any definite offers to the English. They evidently wish to conclude peace, but do not like to be the first to propose it. It is expected that the King of France will shortly send an important personage to the Emperor.
(Ghent) 23 October, 1545.
23 Oct. Smancas. E. F. 501.158. The Emperor to Prince Philip.
(The first two pages are occupied with the discussion of the details of the Papal concessions, recently made by the Pope for the purpose of raising funds from ecclesiastical sources in Spain. The Bulls, etc., had not been delivered, as the papal envoy Dandino (bishop of Caserta) insisted upon settling finally at the same time the details of the convention between the Emperor and the Pope, by which the latter was bound to aid the former in his already projected campaign for the suppression of the German protestants. These points after discussion with Dandino had been again referred to the Pope). (See previous letter, page 268.)
With regard to the opening of the Council (of Trent) we replied that his Holiness might pronounce it open whenever he pleased. Dandino represented that, owing to the smallness, dearness and unhealthiness of Trent, it would be advisable to transfer the Council elsewhere; and he pressed us to consider this.
The inconvenience of such a change was pointed out to him, and he was told that we were of opinion that it could not be entertained on any account. We have already informed you that one of the reasons for our return hither from Germany, was our desire to find some means of bringing about peace between France and England; in which were determined to do our best. With this end we wrote to our sister the Queen of Hungary, asking her to send envoys to both parties, to persuade them to concord by every possible means. This was done and the result was that both sides expressed their willingness to treat for peace on honourable conditions, although it was impossible to get them to agree about the restoration of Boulogne. The King of France has made up his mind to obtain the place, and the King of England is just as determined to retain it; though, as he says, out of consideration for us, he is willing to pay a money indemnity for it. In view of this, we have again instructed our resident ambassadors to persevere in their efforts, and bring about, at least, a suspension of hostilities for six weeks, pending which time both sides might send ambassadors hither with full instructions and powers; and we might consider by what means a peace might be effected. The King of France has informed our ambassador that he will accept the truce, and will send his plenipotentiaries as requested; and there are indications that one of the latter will be the Admiral. But the King of England has not replied, though his answer is expected every day. When it arrives we will consider the whole matter, and will let you know what is decided.
With regard to the restitution of the ships and merchandise taken from our subjects in France during this war, Carvajal came hither and gave us full details of all that had been done. He was sent back again without delay; and we wrote at the same time very urgently to our ambassador, telling him to spare no effort in the matter. The last advices we have received, is that the King of France is willing to restore everything that still remains in being, and it is said that part of the property has already been given up. This, however, is an insufficient redress, as most of the property is no doubt already dispersed amongst many different holders; and we have, therefore, again written to the ambassador, and have spoken to the French (ambassadors) expressing great annoyance at the ill-treatment suffered by our subjects. We shall continue to do so until our subjects obtain redress.
With regard to England also, efforts have been, and will still be made, to a similar end. The King's reply is expected, and the person we have sent thither is instructed to follow the matter up diligently. It may be hoped that when the envoys come to the conference some good result may be obtained. With regard to the ships which the French are said to be fitting out for the Indies, nothing has yet been heard here. On the contrary, when the King of France was recently spoken to about it, he was anxious to give us the most perfect assurance. If we learn anything further on the point we will let you know.
Ghent, 23 October, 1545.
26 Oct. Brussels. Neg. Ang.159. Instructions given to you Cornelius Scepperus and Francis Van der Delft, knights and councillors, for the representations to be made by you to the King of England, our good brother, cousin and perpetual ally, to whom you, Scepperus, are now returning.
After cordial greetings, you will tell the King that you Scepperus have fully reported to us the conversations you had had with him, both on the subject of the proposed interview with us, and as regards the truce or a peace between him and the King of France. We have also been informed of the despatch of powers to the English resident ambassadors here, of the need for clearing up and settling certain secret points in disputes contained in our treaty of alliance, before the proposed interview takes place, in accordance with the terms of the instructions given to you on the 20 September. We have deeply considered these matters; and, as the King has, both through his own ambassador and through you, Scepperus, expressed a desire to learn, as soon as possible, our decision with regard to the interview, and the place fixed upon for it, in order that he might make his preparations, we have thought well to send you back at once to convey the following message to him.
First, having heard from you, Scepperus, when you first returned from England, of the King's great wish to cross the sea, for the purpose of seeing us, if we would approach our Flanders—Artois frontier:—We, after weighing the present state of our affairs, are as anxious to see the King as he is to see us; and, with that end in view, we at once sent a special courier to our brother the King of the Romans, and to some of our confidential ministers, in order to learn from them whether our presence at the States of the Empire on the 6th January, could be deferred for a time, without too much injuring the interests of the Empire.
We have now received a reply, to the effect that, in order to keep our promise to the States, and to avoid giving an excuse for them to delay their attendance on the date fixed; to redress the disturbances that may arise there owing to the death of the Archbishop of Mayence, the first elector, and owing to the war raised by certain princes such as Duke Henry of Brunswick and his adversaries; and, above all, to enable us to make timely preparations to resist the Turk, the truce or peace with whom is very uncertain, no news of our ambassadors with him having been received; and for several other reasons, it is of the greatest importance that we should not fail to be present at the Imperial Diet on the day fixed; or earlier if possible. (fn. 3)
In view of this reply, which is weighty and reasonable, and of the fact that the King's voyage across could not be made so soon, or before the truce with the French was arranged, which truce has now been delayed by the difficulty raised by the English ambassador, who, in virtue of the powers sent to him, would not negotiate for a truce unless a peace was to be negotiated jointly with it; the interview, as the King very prudently points out, being impossible without a truce: having regard also to the weather, which henceforth will be unsettled as the winter is approaching, the days short, and the sea rough, and dangerous to the person of the King, which should not be put in peril: and also, as we are informed, the King is sending to us one of the most confidential of his Councillors, the bishop of Winchester, by which it may appear that he (the King) is not now so pressing for the interview, and the business that it was intended to transact in it may be done by the bishop, a person so competent and confidential: and finally that the matter may be kept secret until the proper time comes we are of opinion that only with the greatest difficulty could such an interview be arranged at the present time, desirous of it as we both may be.
In order to extinguish the flame of war raised amongst the princes of the Empire, which war, but for our presence, will spread and may cause the entire ruin of the German nation: and also in order to take our measures against the Turk, who will probably, as usual, not allow this opportunity to pass of making war on the side of Hungary, knowing of the troubles, dissensions and intestine war in Germany, we are more than ever urged to depart from these dominions; and, with the greatest speed we can command, we purpose travelling to Germany. We feel sure that when these considerations are laid before the King, he will, in his affection for us, approve of the course we have indicated. Otherwise it would have given us great pleasure to have awaited his coming; and to have seen him, even if the delay had been longer than that mentioned by him. You will, on our behalf, pray him to take this in good part; and avoid further troubling himself personally in the hope of bringing about the interview, which, however, may, with God's help, yet be effected on a better opportunity than the present.
With regard to the specification of the secret clauses in the Treaty of alliance, which, in any case, it will be well to elucidate: since the King has sent so competent a person as the bishop of Winchester, who informed you of these secret points to be discussed, it may be concluded that the bishop will be sufficiently authorised by the King to deal with them; in which case we will give him our final decision before we leave these dominions. In case the bishop of Winchester is not bringing such powers, you will request the King to send them to him, in order that these affairs may be well settled. He will find that in this, and other respects, we shall always be anxious to please him, as is demanded by our good friendship and alliance; and we hope that on his side a similar feeling exists.
Up to the present we have no reply to the communication made to the English ambassador in Brussels, which communication he undertook to convey to the King, touching the truce with France. As the bishop of Winchester will probably know the King's intentions in this respect, you will go to him (i.e. Gardiner) and speak to him on the matter. You will urge that the truce should be concluded as speedily as possible, for the reasons given to the (English) ambassador. You, Scepperus, have seen letters from our ambassador in France, saying that the King of France had already chosen the Admiral, and that the latter was deferring his departure until the time had been agreed to. You will therefore on this and other points, use such arguments as you will find effective to induce the bishop of Winchester to favour the conclusion of the truce, which is necessary for all reasons, as the King of England himself has acknowledged. If you find you cannot prevail with the bishop of Winchester, you will use your efforts with the King, to get the truce considered, as soon as possible.
When you have set forth the above matters to the King, and have done what else you can to the same effect, you, Scepperus, will return to our sister the Queen of Hungary, whilst you, Van der Delft, will remain at your post, reporting to us all events of importance, in accordance with your previous instructions.
Ghent, 26 October, 1845.
26 Oct. Vienna Hof. Cor.160. The Emperor to Henry VIII.
M. D'Eick duly delivered the King's letter, and he is now ordered to return to England and, jointly with the resident ambassador, to convey a verbal message from the Emperor to the King.
Ghent, 26 October, 1545.
26 Oct. Vienna Hof. Cor.161. The Emperor to the Bishop of Winchester.
Is glad to hear of the bishop's arrival in Flanders, and has instructed M. D'Eick, who is now returning to England, to call upon the bishop on his way and confer with him.
Ghent, 26 October, 1545.
26 Oct. Vienna Hof. Cor.162. The Emperor to Van der Delft.
I have seen your letter written in answer to that of de Granvelle from Brussels {i.e. of 15 October). Scepperus is again returning to England and carries with him our instructions for you both, with regard to the latest mission with which he was entrusted by the King of England.
Ghent, 26 October, 1545.
27 Oct. Vienna Imp. Arch.163. Scepperus to de Granvelle.
I expected to have found the bishop of Winchester at Bruges, but since Saturday and up to the present time he has remained in this town of Nieuport, not really on account of any bodily indisposition, but rather because of the delay that has taken place in the arrival of the Admiral of France by the side of the Emperor, although I have explained to him that the delay has arisen through the lack of a decision in the matter of the truce proposed in the interests of both parties. You will see the reply he gave me on the point, in my letter to the Emperor.
I also understand from him that his King will not retain in his service the Germans who are at Calais and elsewhere. He is dissatisfied with them, and is going to complain to the Emperor about those who were under the command of Frederick Von Reissenberg.
Nieuport, Tuesday, 27 October, 1545.
27 Oct. Vienna Imp. Arch.164. Scepperus to the Emperor.
In accordance with your Majesty's instructions I have simply pointed out to the bishop of Winchester, who is now here at Nieuport, how important it is in the interest of his master the King that the truce with the French should be concluded as speedily as possible. In support of this I adduced several reasons and arguments which he admitted were of great weight; but he nevertheless assured me distinctly that he had no authority from the King to discuss or negotiate any such truce, unless your Majesty will consent to the interview desired by the King here, and not otherwise. The sole object of his (i.e. Gardiner's) coming to your Majesty he says, is to negotiate peace. He expected to have found the Admiral of France here for a similar purpose, otherwise he would not have hurried as he has done.
I find also that he has no power to treat with your Majesty on the secret points, which I submitted to you. The only course, therefore, is to request the King of England to grant such powers; and this I will do as soon as I arrive there, sending your Majesty due report of this and the rest of my mission.
Nieuport, 27 October, 1545.
29 Oct. Simancas. E.R. 872.165. The Emperor to Juan de Vega (Ambassador in Rome).
(Highly approves of his discourse to the Pope and Cardinal Farnese, about the death of the Duke of Orleans and as to the Emperor's desire to continue at peace with the King of France. His thanks to the Pope and Cardinal for their expressions of adhesion to the Emperor's interests were discreet: but he is not to go beyond them, or to admit any suggestion of theirs to intervene in the discussion of affairs (with France) “for matters are not yet in a position to be carried so far.”) The Kings of France and England had agreed to treat for peace, and to send their envoys hither to us for this purpose; but the matter has been at a stand, as the King of France raises a difficulty about sending the Admiral, whom be needs for the war, and, moreover, the Admiral could not come, because of the German troops, which the King of England was bringing down, and which had already entered French territory. We learn now, however, that these troops have been dismissed and sent away; although they still keep with them the King of England's Commissioners, and their Colonel, until another month's pay has been given to them. We are in hopes, therefore, that the plenipotentiaries will soon be here, the bishop of Winchester, for England, being already near Bruges; and the Admiral of France may come in a few days. When they have arrived we shall see whether they are willing to come to terms. This being the condition of affairs, it does not seem advisable that the Pope should take any steps, or move in the matter at all. We have sent you this information confidentially, in order that you may arrange accordingly, and prevent the coming of the Cardinal (Farnese), or any other person they may want to send, to interfere, until affairs change, of which we will advise you. We have received no letter from the Cardinal. You may explain and apologise to him as you please.
It was well to send the Brief about the newly converted Moriscos of Granada, which was very necessary. Your care and .diligence in the matter are highly approved of. (The rest of the letter (1 1/2 pages) is occupied entirely with Spanish ecclesiastical matters.)
Ghent, 29 October, 1545.
30 Oct. (fn. 4) Vienna Imp. Arch.166. The Emperor to Scepperus and Van der Delft.
The French ambassador resident here has informed us to-day that, notwithstanding the answer the King gave to our ambassador, to the effect that the dispatch of the Admiral of France would be deferred until the truce with the King of England had been arranged; since he had now learnt of the dismissal of the Germans who were near Liege for the purpose of invading his dominions, he (the King of France) had decided to send hither his admiral and his chancellor to discuss his differences with the King of England. We think necessary to inform you of this, and have also declared it here to the English ambassador for the information of the bishop of Winchester. We are leaving here on Monday next for Bruges to exert our influence as we may see advisable.
Ghent, October, 1545.

Footnotes

1 That is to say the proposed interview between Henry and Charles for which the former was so anxious, and whioh could not take place unless a cessation of hostilities was arranged. This was the confidential mission with which Henry had sent Scepperus back to the Emperor.
2 Bishop of Caserta, the Pope's envoy.
3 The Emperor is careful not to mention his principal reason, namely the gathering of his army and the surprise of the German Protestant princes by an overwhelming force.
4 The letter bears no date, but as the Emperor did not arrive at Ghent until the 28th or 29th of October, it must have been written on one of the last three days of the month.