House of Commons Journal Volume 1: 02 June 1621

Sabbati, 2o Junii

Assises.

L. 1a. AN Act for the Keeping and Holding of the Assises, and Gaol-deliveries, in the chief and principal Towns of every County of England.

Bills, &c. to be delivered in.

All Bills, that are in Committees Hands, to be delivered in to the Clerk; and all Petitions, and other parliamentary Businesses, to be delivered in.

Patent to be returned.

The Patent of the Cinque Ports to be re-delivered back to Sir P. Haman, the same having been only brought hither for Evidence, and not as any Grievance.

Prisoners in the Fleete.

Sir Tho. Low remembereth the Business of the Prisoners of the Fleete; who, if we leave them thus, will be in worse Case than before. - To call for the Warden of the Fleete, and to enjoin him, during this Recess, [to] use his Prisoners well.

Mr. Alford: - Never so many Complaints in any Parliament, * * Redress. Many, that have complained here, have, after [their] Attendance here, gone to the Lords, and gotten Relief. - To [consider,] what Course to take herein. Either to relate, to the Lords, [the] miserable Estate of the Prisoners, or else to take some Order here, for the well Usage of the Prisoners, during this Recess.

Sir Geor. Moore: - If Time, would advise to prefer it to the Lords, [whose] Prison it is; and who use to take Security, where we do not, howsoever we may. - To send for the Warden of the Fleete, and give him an Admonition here.

A Petition, from the Prisoners of the Fleete, read.

Mr. Shervyle: - To set down an Order, in Writing, to tye him to what the House shall think fitting. To call him, and give him a Charge accordingly. -

* the Prisoners shall be secure in their Chambers, Goods, and Persons: - And shall exact or take no other Fees, than allowed 3 Eliz.

Mr. Hackwill: - Not to make this an Order, but a Declaration of the Opinion of the House. - That some Alterations, 40o Eliz. of the former Fees ; and enrolled in Chancery.

Mr. Brooke: - Both an Admonition and an Order. - Is ready to forget Admonition: Will better remember Orders. - To restrain him, for Fees, to no certain Time, but to such Fees as he may lawfully take. To call him, and admonish him.

Mr. Glanvyle: - To send for him, and admonish him. - Is against any Order, which, if it be contemned, we cannot make good. - To make only a Declaration, which will be as useful and effectual.

Mr. Glanvyle and Mr. Hackwill to go presently up into the Committee Chamber, and draw this Declaration.

Misunderstanding a Member's Speeches.

Sir Wm. Earle: - That the King hath given us Liberty of Speech. - Because some Tax hath been made upon Sir Ed. Sands his Speeches, to have him cleared, or condemned, by Question in this House.

Sir Edw. Sands: - Heareth, some Words of his have been misconstrued, and that out of the House, 1. That he wished, the Evening after the Conference with the Lords. - That he cried, " Rise, rise;" which he did, desiring, Passion might be avoided, and not speak till next Morning, that Passion were over. That, speaking suddenly, and passionately, out of Sorrow, he said, Monopolies had eat up Trade; and Monopolies maintained by Corruption. - Hath heard of divers Corruptions in Matter of Monopoly, which will manifest at our next Meeting: This hath heard, partly in this House, and partly from the Lords House. -

That the second Speech, against which Exception, that he should slander his Majesty's Government, by saying, the whole Government of the Commonwealth was out of Frame. - That he spake this, only for Matter of Trade, and Money, as might appear [by the] particular Application of Want of Money. * * - That he heretofore observed, that no Complaint had [been] made againt the Judges of the Common Law: So [that] the

Government of the Courts of Justice by him commended.

[By] the Word " palliating," he intended -

* falsis bonis nascuntur vera mala.

Upon Question, Sir Edw. Sands free from any just Cause of Offence, to his Majesty, or any other, by the particular Words now related by him, or by any other Words he hath spoken in this House; without One Negative.

Privilege during Adjournment.

Sir Sam. Sands remembereth the Difference, made Yesterday, between our Privileges after a Prorogation, and an Adjournment: And, for the Order for a Committee after this Adjournment, wisheth a Consideration of the Date of the Commission, and of the Committee, appointed 27o Eliz. to sit after the Adjournment then.

Clearing Members.

Mr. Solicitor: - To clear also the Master of the Wards, being now absent.

Sir Geor. Moore: - Usual, to clear all the Members of this House, at such a Time of Recess, except any can be justly excepted against. - To have now a general Clearing.

Sir D. Digges, accordant.

Sir Ro. Phillippes: - Desireth no Clearing, but by his Majesty, if he shall ever be questioned by him. - To debate and determine now the Point of Adjournment; viz. how to be made; whether by Commission.

Trade and Customs.

Sir D. Digges: - No Kingdom so happy as ours, by Situation, by Seas, Rivers, Staple Commodities: - Spend more Wines, and other Superfluities, than all other Nations. This sheweth the Wealth of this Kingdom. -

Fishing: Manufactures. - 1. - To advance the King's Customs: 2ly, Benefit to Merchants and Shipping: 3ly, No Prejudice to any.

1. That the several Port Towns may have their own Customs. Mentioneth Winchelsey. - To take the King's Customs at a Medium, for Seven Years past. - That none will take the Customs generally, but will gain by it. 20,000l. per Annum, at least, may be saved to the Port Towns, by saving Deputies Fees, Exactions, &c. and 20,000l. per Annum more to the King, for Addition to his Customs.

Mr. Alford concurreth. - Remembereth a particular for Currants; for which we pay a third Part more than we might buy them for. - To desire some Signification of his Majesty's Pleasure herein; that so, out of all Parts, at our next Access, every Port Town may be ready to make an Offer to his Majesty.

Sir Tho. Row concordat: - And that the King may have a Benefit, and the Port Towns too.

Sir Edw. Coke concordat: - Freedom of Trade, the Life of Trade; and Trade, of England. The Merchant will never trade without Gain. - Zacheus, a Customer, converted, - Do et reddo: - Four-fold, like a Thief. - Marvelleth, Tully should say, Ordo publicanorum flos, &c. - Now altered; - Publicans and Sinners. - That the great Customs come out at Christmas next. - To take Time now. - The King will be sure to have Farmers.

Will be able to give Satisfaction in all the Patents condemned here, that they were against Law. -

Patents.

That it may be resolved, by the Question, that the House of Opinion, that none of the Patents, condemned here in the House, shall be proceeded in [this] Vacation.

Mr. Solicitor moveth for the Light-houses. - That these Patents * not to be put down, till some Course taken in it.

Mr. Secretary: - To consider, whether the King having given us Direction, to present our Grievances To-morrow, -

Upon Question, the Opinion of the House, that they hold it not fit, that any of those Things, condemned in this House for Grievances, shall be put in Execution, until our next Access.

Conference concerning Adjournment.

Mr. Serjeant Crew and Mr. Attorney bring a Message from the Lords; desiring a present and free Conference between both whole Houses, in the Painted Chamber, for Matters of great and present Importance.

Sir D. Digges: - To leave the Word " free."

Sir Ro. Phillippes: - Not so; but to hear, and confer, and conclude nothing.

Sir Ed. Mountague, as Sir D. Digges.

Sir Ed. Cecill: - To have our Serjeant there at the Door, that none may come in, but of the Houses.

Sir Edw. Coke -

Answer, that the House will attend the Service presently : And desired, the Lords will clear the House of all, and take Care none may be there but those of the Houses.

Sir Edw. Coke, Sir Edw. Sands, Sir Sam. Sands, Sir D. Digges, Sir Ro. Phillippes, Mr. Noy, Mr. Crew, Mr. Hackwill, Mr. Recorder, to be the Speakers.

Sir Edw. Coke reporteth from the Conference, that the Lord Treasurer began, and divided his Speech into Three Parts: Publication of his Majesty's Pleasure-: Election: And Royal Wish. 1. His Majesty declared, he had taken a Royal Course in this Case; had caused all the Judges to be advised with; and that they all unanimously resolved, the former Course of Adjournment, propounded by his Majesty, was no Discontinuance of any thing done in this Parliament. That the - yet his Majesty, out of his Princely Bounty, propounded to the Lords, that if they would, he would continue this Parliament Ten Days, or a Fortnight, longer. That, the King desiring an Answer, they said, they and we a Body; and therefore would confer and consult with us. That the Lords, upon Consultation, resolved, this Day Fortnight to be the Time, if we should concur. That the King then advised, to deal only with publick Businesses ; and then an End of a Session. That the King's Royal Wish was, according to the People's Expectation, that there might be a happy Conclusion of this Parliament.

The Consultation now to be only about the Time. -

That the Lord Treasurer moved for Thanks to his Majesty, for his gracious Favour in this Offer, from both Houses.

Sir Tho. Wentworth: - This Business weighty : - To consider of it [in] the Afternoon, and then to resolve.

Sabbati, 2o Junii. Post meridiem.

Proceedings concerning Adjournment.

Mr. Delbridge: - Much comforted by Sir D. Digges Motion, and by the [King's] Message, for Continuance longer, or a present Adjournment. - For the present, to adjourn. - Thinketh, this will be more acceptable to the Country, than to sit 12 Days longer, and then make an End of a Session.

Sir Jerome Horsey, accordant: - And, to the Question.

Sir T. Bowes: - To deliberate longer, in a Matter of this Weight, e'er the Question.

Mr. Neale: - Desireth, we might go down with some Bills, and an Adjournment then; else wisheth a present Adjournment.

Sir Tho. Jermyn: - Doubteth, if we should continue 14 Days, and not answer the Expectation of the Country (as doubteth we cannot) -

Sir Wm. Strowde, contra: - Because this Respite from his Majesty's Favour. - To submit it to the King's Pleasure, and the Lords.

Sir Edw. Mountague: - He that speaketh honestly, speaketh eloquently. - Is against that of Sir Wm. Strowde.

To accept the Election now from the King. - We are all in Hopes; all which will be wiped off, both Bills publick and private. - To go, with all Humbleness, Thankfulness, and Chearfulness, to his Majesty, to give him Thanks for this gracious Favour; and to meddle with no Business, after the Adjournment, till our next Access.

Sir Geor. Chaworth: - No Question, but an Adjournment now, rather than a Session 14 Days hence: - But.

hopeth, we, requesting it, might have 14 Days longer and then an Adjournment,

Sir Rich. Gravenor, - for an Adjournment.

Sir Ro. Crane as Sir Geor. Chaworth. - To have Bills and an Adjournment.

Mr. Treasurer : - To present Thanks to his Majesty; and an Adjournment.

Mr. Solicitor: With Thankfulness to accept of an Adjournment; for this best for the King's Honour, being the King's own Choice, out of Reasons known to the King himself. - We cannot possibly be ready against the Time appointed. - Continuance of Statutes: - Divers Conferences with the Lords about the Lords.

Upon the Question, rather to have Adjournment upon Monday next, than to have a Continuance 14 Days longer, and then an End of a Session.

Copies of Records.

Mr. Noye moveth, for Payment for Copies in the Tower amounting (with 7 l. the last Convention, for the same Use) to 29 l. 16 s.

Proceedings concerning Adjournment.

Sir Ro. Phillippes: - To return our Answer presently to the Lords, for this Resolution for an Adjournment.

2ly, To present our Thanks to the King, for his gracious Favour. To desire of the Lords a Conference about the Adjournment by Commission, whether that determine not this Session.

Sir Edw. Sands: - 1. To begin with Thanks to his Majesty, ut supra. 2ly, To acquaint the Lords with our Election of an Adjournment, and the Reason ; because a Prorogation accompanieth 14 Days longer Continuance, which would exceedingly cross great Things we have in hand for the publick Good. 3ly, Because this like to be our last Message to the Lords at this Time, to congratulate the great Correspondency hitherto holden between the Lords and us, and to promise the like in all future Times. - That the Commission can be no Prejudice, it being but declaratory; and then the Lords to adjourn their House, and we ours.

Sir D. Digges, accordant: - And to take special Care, to [give] Satisfaction of our Contentment, for avoiding all Misconstruction of ill-affected Persons.

Mr. Alford: - To be very wary, the Judges encroach not upon [the] Liberties of Parliament.

Mr. Noy: - Prorogavit, et adjournavit, promiscuously used. - [To] propound to the Lords the Manner of the Adjournment,

Sir D. Digges hath Power in this Conference, to [propound] to the Lords the Consideration of the Transportation of Ordnance, Exportation of Money, and Decay of Trade.

Sir Edw. Coke reporteth from the Conference with the Lords, that he acquainted their Lordships with the Resolution of the House for the Adjournment, that he desired the Lords, the Adjournment might be in a parliamentary Manner, without any Danger in a Matter of that Consequence: That he delivered the Lords the Reasons of our Choice of the Adjournment.

Sir D. Digges reporteth the Delivery of his Message concerning Trade, Money, and Ordnance.

Mr. Treasurer : - Approveth that which is past: Wisheth, we should also present our Thanks to the King, as the Lords intend to do for themselves.

Answered, that the Lords will do it for both Houses.

Money for the Palatyne.

Sir Tho. Row desireth he may recant: - Which was upon a Motion made by Sir J. Perrott, for this House to order that the Money given for the Palatyne, may be paid over out of the Hands of those where it remaineth. - Moveth now, this may be done; that That, which remaineth in private Hands, may be converted to the true Use.

Sir J. Perrott, accordant.

Sir Ro. Phillippes, contra: - Yet acknowlegeth it to be a great ignominious Fault in him that shall purposely conceal and detain any.

Petition against Ld. Scrope, &c.

Elwicke, that petitioned against my Lord Scrope, &c. called to the Bar; and demanded, whether he drew and delivered the Petition, confesseth it; and justifyeth it to be true, and that he will prove it so ; and that he will give such Sureties, - Great Debate, whether he shall find Sureties, or not. -

Thanks and Petitions to the King.

Mr. Attorney-general and Sir Wm. Byrd bring from the Lords a Message; That, in Observance of the good Correspondency between both Houses, have resolved, that Twelve of their Lordships, with such a Number as this House shall appoint, shall attend the King, at Two of the Clock To-morrow, at Greenewich, to acquaint his Majesty with what was last propounded at the Conference, if his Majesty shall so please; and hope, these good Affections, testified all this Parliament between both Houses, shall be carried down into the Country, and be brought back again at our next Access, and continue all this Parliament.

* and so Answer returned by the same Messengers. That 24 of this House will, with their Lordships, attend his Majesty, as is propounded ; with Signification of the [Desire] of this House, that their Lordships will appoint One to speak [for] both Houses to his Majesty: With a Compliment of Thanks to the Lords, for their Desire of the good Correspondency, [ut] supra.

Mr. Treasurer, Sir Geor. Moore, Lord Clifford, Lord Cavendish, Sir D. Digges, Sir Francis Seymor, Mr. Fetherston, Sir A. Ingram, Sir Tho. Cheeke, Sir H. Withrington, Sir Francis Fane, Mr. Alford, Mr. Solicitor, Sir Tho. Wentworth, Sir Tho. Row, Sir Francis Barrington, Sir Tho. Hinton, Sir Jerome Horsey, Sir Lewys Watson, Sir Edw. Peyton, Sir Rich. Tichborne, Mr. Mallory, Sir Geor. Manners, named to be the 24.

Mr. Attorney-general and Sir Wm. Byrd bring word from the Lords, that the Prince is pleased to deliver the Thanks of both Houses; and the Lord Archbishop of Canterbury is appointed to deliver the Petitions of both Houses.

King's Answer.

Mr. Solicitor appointed to report to the House, upon Monday Morning, the King's Answer.

Person to attend.

Elwicke charged, by Mr. Speaker, to appear here, to justify his Petition, within a Fortnight after next Access; and particularly that against Mr. Wetherhedd.

Warden of the Fleete.

Warden of the Fleete, at the Bar (not kneeling) charged, by Mr. Speaker, with many Complaints by the Prisoners ; with great Exactions, and Cruelties ; and is admonished to use his Prisoners according to a Note drawn by Mr. Glanvyle, and Mr. Hackwill, and is required to attend at the next Re-access.

Merchants of the Staple.

Sir Tho. Wentworth reneweth his Motion for the Staplers: That all Payments, Suits, and Proceedings, upon any Contracts, or Bonds, shall be suspended till the next Access, which are mentioned in a former Order 14o Maii last.

Sir Lewys Watson moveth, One .... Name may be added to Sir Rich. Lyddall's Name, and Mowle's Name.

Opinion of the House, all these Suits, Payments, and Proceedings, to stay till the next Access; and Day given to Sir Rich. Lydall, Mowle, and . . . till the 2d Friday of the next Access.

Damport.

Damport - on Monday Morning.