Spain: January 1532, 16-31

Pages 363-379

Calendar of State Papers, Spain, Volume 4 Part 2, 1531-1533. Originally published by Her Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1882.

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January 1532, 16-31

16 Jan. 885. Dr. Ortiz's allegation in favour of the marriage.
S. E. L. 858,
f. 170.
B.M. Add. 28,584,
f. 163.
Bey. Excusator seu defensor suo propio, necnon excusatorie nomine Serenissimi domini Henrici Angliæ &c, regis.
Latin, Contemporary copy. pp. 12.
21 Jan. 886. Francisco de los Covos to the Empress.
S. E. L. 796,
f. 160
B. M. Add. 28,584
f. 169.
The Emperor is so much engaged at present that he cannot write a private letter to her. He is well and in good spirits, and is in fancy already on his way to Spain.
Rumours are afloat of a new invasion of Christendom by the Turk, but she (the Empress) need not have any fears; nothing serious is to be apprehended.—Curinghen, (fn. n1) 21st January [1532].
Spanish. Holograph, pp. 1½.
22 Jan. 887. Doctor Ortiz to secretary Covos.
S. E. L. 858,
f. 146.
B.M.Add. 28,584
f. 174.
Yesterday, the 21st, His Holiness told me that he had received letters from his Nuncio in England, informing him that he had, according to orders, remonstrated with the King on his separation from the Queen, and that the King had answered resolutely: "Since they insist upon her being my wife it follows that I am her husband, and the head of the family; she must therefore obey me. I have accordingly sent her word not to strive so diligently as she has done and is still doing, that the case be tried at Rome when I myself demand that it should be tried here. For this reason I have given her the choice of one of four places to retire to." The Nuncio, it appears, answered that the sentence had been delayed for three whole years merely for the sake of the peace and welfare of the Christian community at large, but that His Holiness could not possibly grant any more delays; as judge he was obliged to let the trial take its course, and then pronounce sentence. He, therefore, recommended the King to send his mandate and powers [to Rome] in full assurance that ample justice would be done. The King then interrupted the Nuncio by saying that the Pope was nowise the judge of kings; neither was he a doctor at law, and therefore had no business whatever with the trial and sentence of the divorce case. He (the King) had applied for three judges to be appointed: one on his (the Pope's) side, another on his own, and a third on the side of the Queen, and he could not but wonder that, having so many doctors, so many universities, and withal reason in his favour, His Holiness should refuse to comply with his just demand. (fn. n2) "The Pope (replied the Nuncio) is Christ's vicar on earth; to him belongs' the judgment of such cases. Though he may be no doctorat law himself, he is surrounded by most learned men, with whose advice and counsel he proceeds in all matters as his predecessors have done. I, therefore, again recommend Your Highness to send your powers to Rome, so as not to have to complain hereafter that you have not been heard in the cause." To which the King answered: "that the auditors of the Rota were all venal and corrupt men, and that they could nowise be his judges; as to powers to be represented at Rome, he (the King) would send none." "If that be the case," retorted the Nuncio, "His Holiness will be obliged to give sentence against Your Highness for not appearing at the trial, or alleging anything in your defence." I care not for such a sentence said the King. "Well then,' continued the Nuncio, "His Holiness will proceed at once to excommunication, and other judicial remedies, invoking, if necessary, the assistance of the secular arm;" but far from the King paying attention to these remonstrances and threats he said nothing more, and suddenly left the room. (fn. n3)
All this was related to me by the Pope, who added that the King had requested him to write to Scotland to contradict the rumour very prevalent in that country, that a separation from the Holy Apostolic See was contemplated in England. The Pope, however, had refused to write that letter because, though the measure had not actually taken effect, it was quite evident that it had been attempted. His Holiness further said to me that having sent to request the King to allow certain Scotch gentlemen in England to return to their country, he had flatly refused, saying many disparaging things of the Scotch king, pretending that he knew not how to govern, and had intrusted the administration of affairs to persons of low birth and origin.
There was at this time in England an auditor of the Rota whom His Holiness had sent to Scotland with a mission. It appears that happening one day to speak about the matrimonial cause the King said distinctly to him; "I am now sending certain articles to Rome by my ambassador, Doctor Benito (Benet). Should they be rejected, the Pope is not to wonder at any measures being taken in this country against him."
This Benet, seeing that the majority of the auditors of the Rota had decided that the cause ought to be tried here, and that the King's excuses were nowise to be taken into account (unless he sent a new mandate and full powers), left post haste, promising that he would soon return with everything that was wanted. It is generally believed that if there has been since any delay it was principally from having to wait for the arrival of this ambassador, who from Lyons wrote a letter to His Holiness to say that he was coming shortly with certain proposals which, if accepted, would put an end to all disagreements on this matter; what they were he would not say. The Papal Nuncio in France also wrote to His Holiness that an English bishop of the name of Stephano (Stephen), who had gone from England to France on an embassy, had remarked to him how very fortunate it was that this last delay in the proceedings had been granted, since most likely some good expedient might be found in the meantime to put an end to the trial. Aware of all these facts, I failed not to represent to His Holiness, as I have done on other occasions, that no expedient could be devised for putting an end to the trial save for the King to confess his error at once and return to the true path. Upon which His Holiness said that he perfectly agreed with me, and was determined without further prorogation or delay to issue sentence, even should the kings of England and France separate from the Apostolic See on that account, though, if the Nuncio's statement is to be relied upon, many of the higher nobility in England are already forsaking the King's cause on this ground.
In am very sorry to say that after cardinal Ancona, and even his Holiness, had perused and approved of the minute of this brief about to be dispatched to England, and when the draft was already in the hands of Blosio to have it copied, the latter shewed it to the Imperial ambassador (Mai), who kept it four days to deliberate on its contents, and see whether it would do or not. When he returned it His Holiness heard that the English ambassador was already at Piacenza; he therefore ordered the whole thing to be suspended until it be known what the Englishman's errand is. —Rome, 25th January 1532.
P.S.—May God be praised. I have this moment persuaded His Holiness to send on the brief; it shall be forwarded to the ambassador (Miçer Mai) for him to address it [to Chapuys]. Should it not produce an effect on the King, as I am very much afraid it will not, steps should be taken to obtain at once letters of excommunication. (fn. n4)
Juan Ortiz, his brother, Don Martin de Mendoza, &c. The enclosed paper in Latin is intended for Mr. de Granville's inspection.
Signed: "El Dr. Ortiz."
Addressed: "To the most illustrious the High Commander of Leon, secretary to His Imperial Majesty."
Spanish. Holograph, pp. 3½.
22 Jan. 888. Eustace Chapuys to the Emperor.
K. u. K. Haus-
Wien. Rep.P.Fasc.
c. 227, No. 3.
On the 13th inst. the session of Parliament began. It has been principally convoked, as many presume, to discuss the divorce question, and likewise to ask its members for some pecuniary aid from the laity, inasmuch as it was the ecclesiastics who contributed last year. Until now no motion has been made either on that or other topics, and it would appear that they intend temporizing until the arrival of news from France and Rome. The assembly is numerous, being attended by almost all the lords, temporal as well as spiritual. Only the bishop of Durem (Durham), (fn. n5) one of the Queen's good champions has not been called in, nor more has Rochester (Fisher), as I have been informed, though this last has not failed to come, and is actually in town (cipher:) intending to tell the King the plain truth about this divorce, and speak without disguise (rudemant). No sooner did the King hear of this bishop's arrival than he sent him word that he was very glad at his coming, and had many important things to say to him. The Bishop fearing lest the communication which the King said he had to make should be for the purpose of begging him not to speak on the subject, seized the moment when the King was going to mass (attended by the gentlemen of his Household) to make his reverence and present his respects, thus avoiding, if possible, the said communication. The King received him more graciously, and put on a better mien than ever he had done before, deferring the conversation till after the mass, but the good Bishop, owing to the above fears, prudently retired before mass was over.
(Cipher;) I have faithfully transmitted to the said Bishop [of Bochester] Your Majesty's last message; he has begged me not only to thank you most sincerely, but to offer his unconditional services in this affair of the Queen, requesting me at the same time not to write about him, or mention him in my despatches unless it be in cipher. The son (fn. n6) of the Princess governess, who not choosing to follow the King's opinion on the divorce question, refused some time ago the archbishopric of York, has only just obtained permission to go across the sea to complete his studies. He told the King that if he remained in England he should have to attend Parliament, and that should the divorce question be brought forward and discussed he could not do less than speak and vote according to his conscience. (Common writing:) The King then gave him the permission he asked for, and promised him the same annual pension of 400 ducats, which he formerly enjoyed, besides the rents of his ecclesiastical benefices, notwithstanding all ordinances are against non-residents receiving the same. This will easily convince Your Majesty of the great desire this king has of removing one way or other all the obstacles he finds in his path.
In consequence of the recent capture of an English ship laden with merchandise by some vessels of the "bande," as they call it, of the king of Danemark (Christian II.), this king last week dispatched in chase of them three large ships well furnished with artillery, and carrying on board about 150 armed men each.
The ambassador appointed to replace the one now residing at Your Majesty's Court, and with whose doings people are here dissatisfied, is about to start in a very few days, I cannot learn what he goes about; but he is one of the doctors who went to Bologna in company with the earl of Wiltshire, on whom and on his daughter he entirely depends. (Cipher:) He has written in favour of the divorce, and is one of those who have translated the King's book into English. I apprehend that, if he has the opportunity, he will try at the German universities, through which he may happen to pass, to gain over to his opinion the doctors, Lutherans, as well as Catholics; but if he has no better chance than the King himself had with the Austin friar of the Lutheran sect, who came here at his invitation, and with a safe-conduct from him, as I have informed Your Majesty, he will not be able to do much, for the said friar went back as he came, except that he carried away, as I have been told, the dislike and displeasure of these people.
(Common writing:) According to the earl of Wiltshire's own words these people imagine that unless Your Majesty leaves for Germany before the purification of our Lady, you will have to embark at some port of this sea in order to return to Spain, and it would seem as if they did not dislike the idea, and already counted upon such an event.
I hear also from a credible source that the King has decided to create the earl of Wiltshire duke, the better to enrich the family he himself intends marrying into. (fn. n7)
As I had the honour to inform Your Majesty some time ago, this king had requested Jean Jocquin not to return to France until the bishop of Winchester (Stephen Gardyner) should come back from that country. And yet whether it be that Jocquin has received orders from the King, his master, to return immediately, or that these people consider he may give powerful help to the Bishop's negotiation, the fact is that he has now obtained his congé, and went away yesterday. "When he came to take leave I interrogated him as to the nature of his mission. His answer was vague and confused. He protested that he knew nothing more about the bishop of Winchester's charge than what De La Pommeraye had told me, as I informed Your Majesty at the time. The latter, who was present at the conference (as he had come in Jockin's company), failed not to confirm the assertions of his colleague, and taking part in the conversation began, among other things that he said, to extol and praise the advantages of a lasting peace and union among Christians, which he confessed Your Majesty had done everything in your power to bring about and preserve. "Nothing would have been so easy (remarked La Pommeraye) as to bring all Christian princes to agree on this point, had not that devil of a Pope (such were his words) been an obstacle, by trying to embroil and sow dissension throughout Christendom." And this was said by the ambassador so markedly, and with such assurance, that it is to be conjectured that both kings are now about framing some new intrigue to Your Majesty's detriment, the secret object and aim of which I am at present unable to discover.—London, 22nd January, in the year [15]32.
Signed: "Eustace Chapuys.''
Addressed: "To the Emperor.'
French. Holograph mostly in cipher, pp. 5.
24 Jan. 889. J. Ant. Muxetula to the Same.
S. E. L. 859, f. 54.
B. M. Add. 28,584,
f. 170.
All these days we have been working that the matrimonial cause of England should come on, but His Holiness and the Consistory have granted a delay till the end of this month for the advocates of the opposite party to dispute and plead whatever they have to say; after that time, on the 1st of February next, sentence will be pronounced without hearing them again. Many protests have been entered on our part respecting this new delay, but after all the term is about to expire, and His Holiness has expressly promised us not to grant a fresh one.
I hear that Doctor Benet, the ambassador who went once to England, and who the Pope thought might soon return with some fruit of his journey (all these delays having been granted merely on that consideration), is already on his road, and is expected here before the end of this month, for he has written from Lyons saying that he is coming. Whether he brings or not a commission from his master for the principal cause is more than he (Muxetula) can say; but His Holiness thinks that he brings anything but a good resolution. (fn. n8) He adds that whatever proposals that ambassador may bring will be rejected. The delays which he (the Pope) has hitherto granted have been given for a good purpose, not to afford the King a pretext for insisting upon the cause being revoked from Rome and sent somewhere else. But as in all these delays granted with a view to bring the King to reason, greater injury has been done to the Queen than might have been anticipated, His Holiness protests that he is determined, unless Dr. Benet brings full powers, to shut his eyes, and think no more about dealing with the King by fair means, since those hitherto employed have been unavailing. He has also fully promised to issue the brief commanding the King to separate immediately from that diabolical woman, and to lead a matrimonial life with his legitimate wife, the Queen. (fn. n9) I will never cease importuning him on this score until he has actually fulfilled his promise.—Rome, 24th January 1532.
Signed: "Jo. Anto Muscetula."
Spanish. Holograph, pp. 2.
24 Jan. 890. Giovan Antonio Muxetula to the Empress.
S. E. L. 859, f. 54,
B.M. Add. 28,584,
f. 170.
All these last days we have been hard at work. At last His Holiness and the Consistory of Cardinals have granted what remains of this month for the lawyers of the opposite party to dispute and make such allegations as they please, on the 1st of February they will be sent away, and no more heard. The English have of course protested, saying that the term is too short, and that they cannot possibly prepare their allegations, but their protest has been disregarded, and in a very few days we shall be at the end of the month. Dr Benet is coming and writes from Lyons, &c.—Rome, 24th January 1532.
Signed: "Jo. Ant. Muscetula."
25 Jan. 891. The Emperor to Dr. Ortiz.
B.M. Add. 28,584,
f. 190.
Thanks him for his letter of the 30th of December last. Is much satisfied with his valuable services in the Queen's matrimonial cause. As, however, the ambassador (Mai) is the person who has to decide how and by what means the interests of the Queen can best be safeguarded, he (Ortiz) must not act in the matter without consulting first the said ambassador, otherwise he might commit great error.—Cologne, 25th January 1532.
Indorsed: "Minute of letter from the Emperor to Dr. Ortiz."
Spanish. Original draft in the hand of secretary ldiaquez.
25 Jan. 892. Miçee Mai to the Emperor.
S. E. L. 857, f. 58.
B.M. Add. 28,584,
f. 1846.
After my despatch of the 15th inst. I called one day on His Holiness quite determined to tell him my mind and also what I thought of this last delay granted to the English. Had the night before sent him a message through Sanga, the secretary, to that effect, but notwithstanding that I called on the Pope myself, and repeated the same and perhaps stronger arguments than I had used the other day. He in; terrupted me, owned that I was perfectly right, and that the delay had been granted for the greater confusion of the English. Everyone at Rome, he said, was persuaded that the King would be condemned, and by the 1st of February the report (relacion) would be ready. My answer was that he had made me many a time the very same promise; I had written home accordingly, and yet the promise had not been fulfilled Nobody not in Rome could possibly believe that it was the fault of His Holiness or of his cardinals, and therefore all thought that it was mine. Upon which His Holiness most deliberately said: "I have never promised that to you, however, I do promise now most solemnly, and upon my faith that after this delay I myself will be your advocate and proctor (advogado y procurador)."Hearing this I threw myself at His Holiness' feet, and the more to bind him closely said I would report his words to Your Majesty.
Dr. Benet has dispatched a courier from Paris, he himself being unable to ride so fast, to say that he is coming and brings a resolution on the whole divorce case. I do not believe it, because these Englishmen here have been complaining of the delay being so short, and of the injury done to them and to their king in not granting them sufficient time for their lawyers to come. Now they insist again on the same point, and I fancy that they will ultimately send for some of them, not, indeed, because of their considering them necessary to establish their right, but that they may allege, when condemned, that they had in their favour a great many lawyers. Meanwhile, I myself am informing the cardinals; Your Majesty's and the Queen's lawyers are doing the same.
As I informed Your Majesty in one of my last despatches these people have refused to give me the brief with censures which I applied for, but have promised that the Papal Nuncio will present this one, such as it is, to the King, and if it produce no effect then they will give me another one with censures. Should they grant it I will forward it to Your Majesty to be remitted to the Papal Nuncio in England, who, being a vassal of Your Imperial Majesty, cannot fail to do his duty in this respect.
It appears that the auditor of the Rota, who is going as Papal Nuncio to Scotland, passing through England the other day met with a very bad reception from the King, who told him that he could not think how he and his colleagues of the Rota dared mix themselves up with the affairs of kings; and upon the Auditor, who is a good scholar and lawyer, and a wise man besides, answering that this was no new thing, that the pre-eminence of the Apostolic See and of the Vicar of God on earth was indisputable, and that he for his part was surprised that His Majesty (sic) could maintain such doctrines, king Henry replied that nothing would ever induce him to submit to be judged by the Pope.
As Ortiz was speaking the other day to the Pope about this brief he told him: "The kings of France and England are so closely united that I can see very well that if I lose one both of them will be lost to me; that, however, will be no reason for my failing to do justice."
The auditor of the Apostolic Chamber (Ghinucci) does not choose to leave his post at Malta, and as the Consistory never makes an appointment without the office being actually vacated we are at a standstill. The Pope has spoken to him twice, but he refuses no doubt in order to sell this further favour to his friends, the English.—Rome, 25th January 1532.
Signed: "Mai.''
Spanish. Original, pp. 5.
25 Jan. 893. Dr. Ortiz to the Same.
S. E. L. 858,
f. 144.
B. M. Add. 28,584,
f. 177.
My last despatch must have informed Your Majesty how according to authentic reports the queen of England had been by the King's command sent 20 miles away from Court, which proceeding is a manifest commencement of disobedience to the Apostolic See, and demands prompt and radical remedy for fear it should lead to a schism. This remedy in my opinion can be no other than for the Pope to issue a brief commanding the king of England under pain of excommunication to separate from his mistress, and live with his Queen. I entreated His Holiness to have such a brief made out, and he said that he approved of the proposal. I also consulted Ancona, who has more authority and learning than any other cardinal in Consistory, and not only was he of my opinion, but promised to speak to the Pope about it, though he very much feared, as he told me afterwards, that the measure would provoke disobedience and heresy in England, and if so that it might be necessary to appeal to arms, which in the present state of Christendom, threatened as it is by the Turk, ought to be avoided.
I called a second time upon His Holiness and reminded him of his promise made during the vacations, that should the king of England persevere in his ill-treatment of the Queen he would not hesitate to issue the brief. I had (I said) written to Your Majesty in this strain, and therefore asked whether he was ready to fulfil his promise. His answer was that he would with great pleasure. He then asked me whether I had brought the minute of the brief with me. I said that I had not, but would bring it next day. I called upon Miçer Mai and related my conversation with His Holiness. Miçer Mai was surprised but said that he would see His Holiness about it; he had not yet had an opportunity of speaking to him on the subject, but if I would do him the pleasure of accompanying him he would certainly remind him of his promise. After all Miçer Mai went to the Pope without me. He told me that the Pope had certainly held a similar language to him, but he himself was by no means satisfied, and believed nothing would come of it. Though he (Mai) was almost sure that the brief would not be sent, yet he engaged me to write a minute; it would at any rate be, as he said, a meritorious work in the eyes of God. His Holiness having recommended to me the greatest secrecy, I proceeded at once, though uninitiated in such matters, to draw up the enclosed minute, and on the day of the Epiphany called on cardinal Ancona and shewed it him that he might correct any errors of style, &c. I fancy that the Cardinal, out of politeness, praised my composition, for he said that he found the writing excellent and grave as befitted a document proceeding from His Holiness. The only fault he found was that the part relating to the excommunication was not couched in proper Roman style, but the Pope's secretary (Sanga) would see to that, &c., promising that should he be entrusted with it he would take care that the brief was signed and sent.
On the same day I called on His Holiness and shewed him the minute. After reading it attentively he said to me: "I approve of it, but there are certain harsh words in it that ought to be softened." As since the death of Sancti Quatuor the office of auditor of the Apostolic Chamber is held by the bitterest enemy we have in this cause; as His Holiness, moreover, had from the beginning recommended the greatest secrecy, I said to him that the minute had already been in the hands of cardinal Ancona, and therefore that the charge of looking over and correcting it should be entirely entrusted to him. He promised to do so, and that no one but the said cardinal, and his own secretary should see it. I then again begged His Holiness to tell me whether I could announce to Your Majesty that the brief would be issued. He answered that I might. Two days after I returned to him to inquire what more had been done; he answered that the minute was still in the hands of the ecclesiastic to whom the task of correcting it and putting it in order had been entrusted. Went thence to the ambassador; related to him what had happened; he still thinks that the brief will not be issued. My duty, however, is to believe the contrary since the Prince of the Church and Vicar of Christ on Earth has given me his word that it will, and told me what I have above related.
The circumstance of this present courier not having left on the usual day of the month is the cause of my being able to relate what happened. The Pope's secretary reformed the minute in this manner. The King was to incur pain of ex communication if 15 days after the briefs being affixed at the usual places, in Bruges and Hutreque (Utrecht), he does not separate from his mistress,. Anne, and again lead a conjugal life with his Queen. This I shewed to two of the Queen's advocates, Juan Luis and Dr. Anguiano, Your Majesty's proctor. Once seen and approved by them, I myself took it to cardinal Ancona's, who being previously instructed by me, approved its context, adding only a few words he considered necessary. Then the Secretary (Sanga) went to His Holiness, who, without my being able to assign a reason for it, began to say, "I am very much surprised that cardinal Ancona could give his approbation to such a minute as this. Here is a brief actually declaring the king of England to be excommunicated if within the term of 15 days he does not do this and do that, and yet no previous notice of such excommunication has been given him. Let a brief be made out admonishing him in the most earnest terms to do as he is enjoined, and threatening him, if he does not obey, with ecclesiastic censures, &c." The brief has actually been made out, and is to be forwarded to the Papal Nuncio in England, that he himself may present it to the King, and talk to him on the subject. Should he not obey the Papal injunctions, as it is his duty to do, then in that case a second brief excommunicating him shall be prepared.
Since then I have spoken twice to His Holiness on this subject, and represented that he is in duty bound to fulfil his promises. His answer has been that he intends writing soon to Your Majesty, and giving complete assurance of his determination on that point, and, moreover, he has now sent by way of his Legate at Your Majesty's court a transcript of the admonitory brief now sent to the king of England.
Should not the King after the receipt of this first brief alter his course, as I am very much afraid he will not, then Your Majesty must let me know that I may inform the Pope thereof, and apply for the letters of excommunication. And though His Holiness is actually obliged to punish with ecclesiastical censures and other judicial penalties the enormous crime the King has committed by thus separating himself from his own legitimate wife, so enormous is the sin and so manifest the injustice, that it is doubtful whether Your Majesty also, invested as you are with full Imperial authority, and being God's minister on Earth, is not bound to punish such iniquity.
With regard to the proceedings of the matrimonial cause now earned on in Consistory, I have to say that Monday after the Epiphany being the day fixed for arguing the point whether the trial ought to remain here or be transferred to some other place, the ambassador (Mai) attended the Consistory and announced that the advocates were outside prepared for the debate, and that he begged it might begin at once; other wise he asked for a decree forbidding the English ambassadors to be heard unless they brought a fresh mandate from their king, and that the suit should be resumed at once. After this the English ambassadors entered the Consistory, and said that they had sent for certain lawyers to attend the debate and that one of them had answered that he could not possibly come owing to Your Majesty having written him a letter begging him not to attend. Another one had excused himself saying that he held ecclesiastical benefices in Your Majesty's dominions, and did not choose to lose them. A third had said that the Imperial ambassador (Miçer Mai) had written to him not to come. In this manner, alleging that their lawyers had been prevented by fear from coming to Rome, the English applied for a new delay which was granted to them in that Consistory, but only till the last day of this present month of January. I have visited all the cardinals one by one, and although I find them very well inclined as far as the principal cause is concerned, yet they say that since a sentence must necessarily be pronounced against the king of England, it is wise to satisfy him on all points for fear he should afterwards complain that such and such legal formalities have been disregarded. And I very much wonder that there are people here bold enough to maintain that Your Majesty has written to a lawyer not to mix himself up with this affair, for what Your Majesty has always asked is that it be legally tried and sentenced, not that lawyers be prevented from looking into it. Would to God the cause were to be pleaded in public, and the proceedings so far advanced that I could take part in the defence, and confound my adversaries; but I daresay they will never run the risk of being defeated.
Two days after this the Pope related to me what had passed between the king of England and his Nuncio, and how His Holiness had said to him that he was at last determined to act briskly in the affair and pronounce sentence, as it is his duty to do, even should the kings of England and France, who seem to make common cause in this affair, refuse obedience to the Apostolic See.
After this came Dr. Benet's letter advising his arrival at Piacenza, and saying that he would shortly be at Rome, upon which the Pope declared that he would delay the expedition of the brief until it was known what proposals the ambassador brought with him. I represented to him that of whatever message Dr. Benet was bearer, yet that the Kings continuance in so enormous a sin as practically to divorce his Queen and take another one, ought to be met first with immediate admonition, and then with excommunication. The Pope answered that he was afraid the brief, instead of improving the Queen's case, would be injurious to her. I replied that if the brief were sent straight to Your Majesty you would see when and how it was to be executed. His Holiness approved of this plan, and the brief has accordingly been drawn out, and forwarded to Your Majesty's ambassador in England.—Rome, 25th January 1532.
Signed: "El Doctor Ortiz."
Addressed: "To the Sacred, Imperial, and Catholic Majesty of the Emperor and King, our Lord."
Indorsed: "Rome, 1532. To His Majesty from Dr. Ortiz. 25th January 1532."
Spanish. Holograph, pp. 6.
26 Jan. 894. Muxetula to the Same.
S.E.L. No. 1,309,
ff. 184-6.
B. M. Add. 28,584,
f. 187.
(Cipher :) Though I wrote at length by yesterday's post I have since heard from His Holiness news of some importance, as for instance that the French have already declared that the marquisate of Saluzzo should be given to the Dauphin, and that the Marquis, who is under arrest owing to some crime or another, is suffering from ill-treatment. To the other Marquis, who has been all his life a partizan of France, they give hopes of restoring him to his estate, but still it is generally believed that the Marquisate will be given, as I say, to the Dauphin. However it may be, this is equivalent to the French placing their foot in Italy.
The letters received by His Holiness further state that the King has had an estimate made of all the money he would have to spend next year, and that he has already remitted to Switzerland 300,000 frs. on account of his old debt, and is besides issuing two months' pay to the men-at-arms, which, they say, is not without a special reason.
The English ambassadors were pressing the King to declare war against Your Majesty, and offered in case of his taking up arms to amend in favour of France certain articles of the treaty of defensive and offensive alliance existing between them. (fn. n10)
The same letters state that the Papal Legate (Salviati ?) having told the King in His Holiness' name the news of the Turk, and with what force he was likely soon to invade Germany, the King answered: "For less cause than that the Emperor will be obliged to spend all the money I have paid him for the ransom of my sons,"and that he (the King) seemed as if he would take no part whatever in the defence [of Christendom].
It is also stated that Your Majesty has left Brussels to go to the Diet in Germany. When the French ambassador was interrogated by the Pope about this he could not deny the fact, but said that Your Majesty had much troublesome business in hand, and among the rest that of attending a diet which the princes of Germany were about to celebrate without your knowledge. But we are so accustomed to hear this and other bravadoes of the French that no one believes what they say.
A friar, who calls himself the confessor of king Sepuse, the vayvod [of Transylvania] Johan, has arrived here and had an audience from His Holiness. Having, as I am told, offered to place in his hands the whole of the negotiation now pending for him to decide, the Pope answered that since the affair was now being discussed in Germany there was no necessity to enter into further negotiations at Rome. The Pope now writes to his Nuncio at Your Majesty's court that he may inform you and your brother, the long of the Romans, of these particulars.—Rome, 26th January 1532.
Signed "Jo. Ant. Musectula."
Addressed: "Sacre Ces. et Cathce mti."
Spanish. Original entirely in cipher. Contemporary deciphering, pp. 3.
28 Jan. 895. The Emperor to the cardinal of Ravenna.
S. E. L. l,559,f. 9.
B. M. Add. 28,584,
f. 189.
Has received his letter of the 20th of last month. Thanks him for his good services, and promises to shew him favour when an opportunity presents itself.
With regard to the Scottish business there is nothing to be said at present. Must wait until an answer from Scotland arrives. Begs him, however, to do all he can to give a favourable turn to the said negotiation.—Cologne, 28th January 1532.
Addressed: "To the cardinal of Ravenna."
Indorsed: "Minute of letter from the Emperor to the cardinal of Ravenna."
Spanish. Original draft in the hand of secretary Idiaquez.
28 Jan. 896. The Emperor to Dr. Ortiz.
S. E. L. 859, f. 9.
B. M. Add. 28,584
f. 190.
Thanks him for his despatch of the 30th of December last, Is much satisfied with his valuable services in the cause of the queen of England. As, however, the ambassador (Mai) is the person who has to decide in what manner and by what means the Queen's interests are to be safeguarded, he (Ortiz) must not do anything without consulting first with the ambassador.—Cologne, 28th January 1532.
Addressed: "To Doctor Ortiz."
Spanish. Original draft in the handwriting of secretary Idiaquez. p. 1.
30 Jan. 897. Eustace Chapuys to the Emperor.
K. u. K. Haus-
Hof-u.-Steals Arch,
Wien.Rep. P.Fasc.
c. 227, No. 4.
(Cipher:) Since my last of the 11th this king has sent to Italy a doctor called Bonart (Edmund Boner), who at the beginning of this difference was one of the Queen's Councillors, but has since been gained over to the other party, and is now going to the [Italian] universities to have the opinion of the canonists at Paris respecting the revocation of the cause to this country confirmed. To avoid the abuses of the first consultation it would be advisable that Your Majesty should inform the Pope of what is coming that he may be duly prepared. I have caused his Nuncio to write, but Your Majesty's warning will be far more efficacious. I suspect that the Doctor, who is first going to Your Majesty as ambassador, will also try to feel the pulse of the universities through which he will have to pass; Your Majesty will be pleased to have him closely watched.
There has been no question yet of bringing the affair of the Queen before Parliament, and yet these people do not lose time, for they are trying to gain in advance as many of the members' votes as they can. I hear from an authentic source that a debate is now going on in Parliament on a Bill for the King to seize all the property of deceased noblemen though they may leave behind sons already of age. I cannot say what the object of such a measure may be, and whether the Bill will pass or not in Parliament; all I can say is that the motion comes from the King himself and from his Government, which seems to be a strange proceeding if they want, as the report goes, to get assistance in money from the people. The better to obtain this grant the King has publicly announced that the Scotch are thinking of declaring war against England, and has accordingly had the fortresses and castles on that frontier carefully inspected. I fancy that this Parliament, which has been elected at the King's bidding, will be ready to vote the said subsidy, and yet the common opinion is that when the Bill comes into execution there will be plenty of quarrelling among the members.
(Common writing:) About five days ago I laid a complaint [before the Privy Council] against those masters of the armed vessels, which, as I informed Your Majesty, this king had dispatched in chase of the pirates [in the Channel]; for it appears that instead of chasing the latter they have seized and plundered two Flemish craft. The duke of Norfolk had given me to understand at the outset that the King would have the affair closely looked into, the Flemish property restored, and the aggressors punished for the offence. The Duke, according to promise, explained the case to the King, and when I called for the answer, assured me that justice should be done in that, as well as in other claims of Your Majesty's subjects. He then went on to say that the Turk was making great preparations to invade Naples, Sicily, and Marte (Malta), and that he feared lest the bad understanding between the Christian princes should encourage and help the Infidel in the conquest of those countries. "Had the Emperor chosen (said the Duke), the union and defensive alliance of the princes might already have been accomplished." My answer was that Your Majesty had faithfully done your duty towards God and man by strenuously endea vouring to cement that peace and union between the Christian princes of which he (the Duke) spoke. For the sake of that peace (I added) you had relinquished some of your rights, and forgiven all the injuries received. This answer of mine brought no reply from the Duke, who began to sigh in a most piteous manner, saying: "Things look very bad indeed!" After which, the King having sent for him, he suddenly left the room, and the conference was at an end.
Next day the Duke sent me word by one of the gentlemen of his chamber that news had just come of the descent of the Turk, more horrible by far than those he had communicated to me the day before. Not satisfied with having announced to me what he considered to be a great calamity for Christendom, the Duke repeated the intelligence to two of my people, and leaving the company of the duke of Suffolk and of the French ambassador, who were with him at the time, went straight to my men and shewed them the Papal brief addressed to the King on the subject. (Cipher:) I cannot guess what the Duke's motives may have been in so doing, except it be for the sake of annoying me, or because he takes a real pleasure in the said news, perceiving that the burden will fall principally on Your Majesty, whom he would like to see in such straits as to be obliged to put up with the King's folly (fantaisies).
I must remark that not until four days ago was the Nuncio here able to present to the King the said Papal brief, and that after an ill-fated audience, for which he was made to wait in his ante-room from 9 to 12 o'clock, the King told him in very bad humour, even before the said Nuncio had had time to explain his business: "I know perfectly well what you come about. I have already sent an answer, and have no more to say on the subject. I much doubt whether the descent of the Turk is as imminent and formidable as the Pope and the Emperor represent, since they whom the affair principally concerns are making no preparations at all." Thus the King spoke, but though the Nuncio earnestly begged him 10 or 12 times over to read the Papal brief, he could scarcely persuade him to do so. (fn. n11) At last the King promised that he would, and that if an answer was required it should be sent direct by the duke of Norfolk. Upon which he began to make his usual complaints of the Pope's behaviour towards him, though they did not last long, for dinner was soon announced (car la viande estoit desja surla table). The Nuncio was left by himself in the room, whilst the French ambassador went in to dine with the King, as he does very often.
Yesterday the Nuncio went to the Duke's for the answer to the Papal brief, but was put off till four or five days after this date, the object being, as far as I can guess, to know what answer the king of France has made to a similar application from the Pope.
I must not forget to mention that on this and other like occasions, whenever this subject of assistance against the Turk has been discussed, the duke of Norfolk has never failed to beg the Nuncio to write and persuade His Holiness to revoke the matrimonial cause to England, promising that in that case the King and his allies would perform wonders [against the Turk].
As I had been unable to obtain authentic information respecting the German agents about whom I wrote to Your Majesty, I begged the said Nuncio to throw out a hint, whenever he should happen to speak to the Duke, so as to make the conversation turn upon them and upon their business in England. He did so, but the Duke said nothing except that both were here for business of very little importance. Those from Cleves (he said), before coming to England, had applied for a safe-conduct to buy and take away from this country 20 horses, had come quite openly (descelez) and without mystery, but had made no use whatever of their safeconduct. He from the landgrave of Hesse had already left the country and gone over to France. Such was the Duke's answer to the Nuncio's question. I shall, however, do my best to ascertain what the mission of these Germans was, and whether the Duke has told us the whole truth.
(Common writing:) For the last two days a Florentine has been here, who is, as I am informed, in the service of the vayvod of Transylvania. He comes straight from France, and has, it appears, met on the road Jean Jocquin, who has recommended him to a friend of his here. I will try to learn who he is, and what he comes for, that I may inform Your Majesty's ministers.
Jocquin received on parting a present of 3,000 ducats from this king, and yet I hear was not satisfied with that, as he wanted the value of certain butts of wine he had once presented to the Cardinal (Wolsey) to be made over to him. —London, 30th January 1532.
Signed: "Eustace Chapuys.
"Addressed: "To the Emperor."
French. Holograph. pp. 4.


  • n1. The copy has Curanges, which Bergenroth suggests may be Tournay or Tongres, but there can be no doubt that Corange is the place meant. The Emperor left Brussels on the 17th, and arrived at Corange on the 19th, passing by Louvain and Diest. See Gachard, p. 101.
  • n2. " El le respondió que al Papa no le competie ser juez de los reyes, y quc pues no era doctor como avia de juzgar esta causa? Que él havia demandado que pe pusiese un juez de parte del Papa, y otro de su parte, y otro de parte de la Serenisima Reyna, y que él se espantaba, pues por su parte tenia tantos doctores y universidades, y tantas razones, como en esta causa se hazia dificultad"
  • n3. " Y dixome S. St que [el Rey] le avia embiado á rogar que escriviesse al rei de Escocia sobre lo que se havia dicho que en su reyno se avia atentado separacion de la Sede Apostolica, y que no quiso escrivir diziendo que aunque sc havia atentado no avie (sic) venido en efecto. Y dixome S. Sd que tambien le avia embiado a rogar que ciertos cavalleros de Escocia, que estavan en Inglaterra, que los embiasse á Escocia, y que el [Rey] avia respondido que no quirie, hablando muy contentiblemente (sic) del rei de Escocia, y diziendo que regia ju reino por personas baxas y plebeyas y que no lo sabia regir, y que lo governaba mal."
  • n4. "Gloria sea á Nuestro Señor que como escrivo á Su Magd, oy convenci á Su St para que este breve se embie á Su Magt [el Emperador] y ya le enbia cl señor embaxador. V. Sn mande[me] bazer saber sino haze fructo, como yo temo que no hará, para que si la causa no se concluye tan presto se enbie el breve de la descomunion."
  • n5. Cuthbert Tunstall, formerly bishop of London.
  • n6. Reginald Pole.
  • n7. J'entends de bon lieu que le Roy a deslibere de faire duc le dit comte de Vulchier pour enrichir l'alliance."
  • n8. "Pero Su Sd. tiene suspecho que no trah[er] a dilation mas que cosa buena, y con esto dize que tanto mas piensa no admecterlas (admitirla) mas, pues las que n dado lo a echo a buen fin," &c.
  • n9. "Hame tambyen prometido despachar el breve sobre le separation de la platica tan publica de aquella diabolica muger, y continuation del estado matrimonial 'pendente lite' con la serenissima señora Reyna, su legitima muger."
  • n10. "Y que offrescian en caso que se rompiesse la guerra adovar ciertos capitulos de la guerra (de la aliança?) ques entrellos, y que heran en favor del rey de francia."
  • n11. "Le dit Nonce apres avoer prie 10 ou 12 foys le dit Roy vouleoir veoir le dit bref a peyne obtint yl quil voulsist le fere."