Journal, February 1714: Journal Book Q

Journal, February 1714

February 2. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Sharp, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Barbadoes.

Hearing about an Act relating to the Three Houses Spring.

Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor General attending in behalf of Mr. Sandford, against an Act pass'd in Barbadoes the 9th June, 1713, entituled, An Act relating to the spring or rivulet call'd the Three Houses Spring [fo. 105, 127], in the parish of St. Philip's; and Mr. Lutwyche and Sir Peter King attending in behalf of the parishoners of the said parish for the said Act, a memorial from Mr. Heysham, agent for that island, praying a confirmation of that Act, as also the Act itself, were read.

Then Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor General said, that the Act was very arbitrary, and what wou'd not be allow'd of in this kingdom, it taking away the property of Mr. Braithwayt to the said spring or rivulet, which arises in his grounds, of which he or those who enjoy'd the estate before him, were always in possession, without allowing him any tolerable reparation. In proof of which they produced two affidavits sworn in Barbadoes the 11th of July last, before Mr. Skene, secretary and notary publick of that island, which were read; that when the Act pass'd in Barbadoes, Mr. Sandford (as guardian to the said Braithwayt) and others did petition the Assembly to be heard by council against the said Act, which was rejected.

Mr. Lutwytch and Sir Peter King insisted that there was nothing arbitrary in the said Act; that it contain'd no other powers but such as the Commissioners of the Sewers have in this kingdom; that it does not take away any person's property, and particularly none of the said Braithwayt's, for that the spring does not rise in his grounds as alledg'd, in proof of which they produced two affidavits sworn here before a Master in Chancery the 1st instant; that those who oppos'd the Bill in Barbadoes were heard before the Governor and Council, to prove which they produced the minutes of that Board of the 14th May last, which were read.

At last the council on both sides agreed that the spring or rivulet shou'd be so order'd as to take its ancient course, and that the inhabitants of the said parish should be allow'd the fetching and taking water there, as usual, and not otherwise.

New England.

Mr. Heysham and Dummer. Trade with Surinam.

Mr. William Heysham and Mr. Dummer attending [fo. 110, 117], as they had been ordered at the last meeting in relation to the trade carryd on between the northern continent and Surinam, and being asked what they had further to offer upon that matter, Mr. Dummer desired that, as he was not instructed in this matter, their lordships wou'd not propose the passing of any Act here till the matter may have been referr'd to Colonel Nicholson, and he returnd a report thereupon; to which Mr. Heysham said that the consequence of that trade might prove very detrimental to the sugar plantations; that having laid the matter before their lordships, he had nothing more to add thereupon.

February 3. Present:—Lord Guilford, Mr. Monckton, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts.

Virginia.

Letter to Lord High Treasurer. Mr. Byrd's leave to come to England.

A letter to the Lord High Treasurer upon a memorial from William Byrd, esquire [fo. 111], Receiver General of her Majesty's revenues in Virginia, desiring leave to return to England, referr'd to the Board by Mr. Lowndes’ letter, mention'd in the minutes of the 29th of the last month, was sign'd.

Jamaica.

Letter to Lord High Treasurer.

Swymmer's petition.

Kupius's escheat.

The draught of a letter to the Lord High Treasurer upon the petition of Mr. Swymmer, relating to the escheated estate of Mrs. Kupius in Jamaica [fo. 108, 116], referr'd to the Board by Mr. Lowndes’ letter of the 12th of February, 1712/13, and mention'd in the minutes of the 17th July last, was agreed and ordered to be transcribed.

February 4. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Jamaica.

Letter to Lord High Treasurer. Swymmer.

Kupius's escheat.

Letter to Mr. Whitlock.

Value of the estate.

The draught of a letter to the Lord High Treasurer upon the petition of Mr. Swymmer, relating to the escheated estate of Mrs. Kupius in Jamaica [fo. 115], ordered yesterday to be transcribed, being laid before the Board, and their lordships being desirous to know as near as may be the real value of the said estate before they make their report to her Majesty upon that affair; ordered that Mr. Whitlock (who appears in behalf of Johanna Kupius) and others [fo. 124], be acquainted that their lordships will be glad of his bringing any persons with him to the Board on Thursday morning next, who can give information relating to it.

Plantations General.

Letter from Mr. Harley.

Charge of the respective governments.

Letter to Mr. Lowndes.

Account of annual expence.

A letter from Mr. Harley, of the 23rd of May [P. fo. 359; fo. 185], mention'd in the minutes of the first of June, 1713, relating to her Majesty's several plantations bearing the whole charge of their respective governments, was again read; and a letter to Mr. Lowndes, desiring accounts of the annual expence of the said plantations, was agreed, and order'd to be sent.

New England.

Barbadoes.

Trade with Surinam.

The draught of a representation relating to the trade complain'd of between New England and Surinam, mention'd in the minutes of the 2nd instant [fo. 114, 121], being laid before the Board, the same was agreed and ordered to be transcrib'd.

February 9. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts.

Trade.

Captain Taverner. Fishery.

Captain Taverner attending [fo. 99, 127], and being ask'd several questions in relation to the fishery of this kingdom, he said that it might undoubtedly be improved to very great advantage, both in relation to the codd and herring fishery, particularly in North Britain, where the herrings come into the Firths in the month of March; that they are as good or rather better than any other taken elsewhere; that he himself has cured several thousand lasts in two or three years’ time that he was in Scotland; that if we apply'd ourselves in the right method to that fishery, there is no doubt but we might outdo the Dutch, and be two months at market sooner than they; that the Dutch are obliged to cure all at sea, whereas we might do the same and have our Firths wherein to retire and cure in case of storms and bad weather; that the only mistery in curing of herrings, which we are ignorant of, and the Dutch practice, is, that they make use of salt upon salt, that is, they have their salt from St. Ubes, and refine it again, so that one bushel of that refined salt will go very near as far as two of unrefin'd, and weighs almost double. It penetrates and hardens the fish much sooner, and gives it a greater brightness; that our English salt is as good as any whatever for curing of codd and herring, especially if it were made salt upon salt, in which case it would be necessary for the incouragement of the fishery that there should be magazines establish'd at all the fishing ports, where such refined salt might be deliver'd to the fishermen duty free, and an Act of Parliament pass'd prohibiting the fishermen under a penalty from using any other, and proper officers appointed to have the inspection thereof. Then being desired to draw up his thoughts more fully in writing, he promised to do the same accordingly.

Newfoundland.

State of Placentia.

Designs of the French &c.

Memorial. Southack. Fishery of Newfoundland &c.

A written paper, dated at Boston in New England, the 4th December, 1713, entituled, News from Placentia, relating to the state of the last mention'd place, and the designs of the French to settle Cape Britton and Isle of Sables, being some time since communicated to the Board from Mr. Moore, together with a memorial from Captain Southack, relating to the coast and fishery of Newfoundland and parts adjacent, dated also at Boston, the 9th of December, 1713, the same were read.

Nova Scotia.

Letter from General Nicholson.

A letter from General Nicholson to the Board, dated at Boston the 14th of December, 1713, acknowledging the receipt of the Board's letters of the 8th and 15[th] of July last, and transmitting copies of several letters relating to his administration there, was read, and the foresaid copies of letters &c., laid before the Board, the list whereof follows, vizt.:
Papers therein referr'd to.
Extracts of letters between General Nicholson and LieutenantGovernor Caulfield, of Annapolis Royal.
Extracts of letters between General Nicholson and Brigadier Hunter, Governor of New York.
Copy of a letter from General Nicholson to the Lords Commissioners of the Admiralty, dated at Boston, December 11th, 1713.
Extract of a letter from General Nicholson to Mr. Craven, Governor of South Carolina, dated November 3rd, 1713.
Copy of a letter from General Nicholson to the Board of Ordnance, dated at Boston, the 11th of December, 1713.
Copy of a letter from General Nicholson to the Commissioners of the Customs, dated at Boston the 11th December, 1713.

Trade.

Letter from Mr. Drumond.

Dutch placaerts. Fishery. Answer.

A letter from Mr. Drumond, dated the 14th of February, 1714, new style, relating to the Dutch placaerts and ordinances concerning their fishery &c., was read, and an answer thereto being immediately drawn up, the same was agreed and ordered to be sent.

New England.

Barbadoes.

Representation about trade with Surinam.

A representation, as agreed the 4th instant, relating to the trade complained of between New England and Surinam [fo. 117; R. fo. 196], was signed.

February 11. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Leeward Islands.

Mr. Duport. Debenture.

Mr. Duport attending, he produced to their lordships a letter of attorney from Robert McClear, one of the sufferers of St. Christopher's, which being examined, the debenture number'd 387, in the name of the said McClear, was delivered to the said Duport.

Trade.

France. Letter from the Earl of Mar. An address and memorial from royal borows of Scotland.

Memorial to be abstracted with another from North Britain.

A letter from the Earl of Mar, dated the 4th of February, 1713/14, referring to the Board an address and memorial from the royal burroughs of Scotland, relating to the commerce between Great Britain and France, were read. Whereupon ordered that the said memorial be abstracted as likewise the memorial from Sir William Johnston, Sir Patrick Johnston and Mr. Smith [P. fo. 144], in behalf of North Britain, which was read the 9th April, 1712.

Letters from mayors of towns about fishery, to be abstracted.

Letters from the Mayors of Yarmouth, Dartmouth and Barnstaple [fo. 99], and from the collector of the Customs at Bideford, in answer to what was writ them the 21st of the last month, relating to the fishery of this kingdom, were severally read, and abstracts order'd to be made thereof.

Newfoundland.

Mr. Hern.

Representation from Dartmouth.

Mr. Frederick Hern attending, presented to their lordships a representation from the Mayor, magistrates, merchants &c. of Dartmouth, relating to the preservation and security of the fishery at Newfoundland [fo. 128, 163], which was read; and a letter order'd to be drawn, wherein to transmit a copy thereof to the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, and signify to his lordship the opinion of this Board, that nothing will tend more to the publick service than that a survey be made of Newfoundland, and its several harbours and fishing places, as proposed by the said representation.

Massachusets.

Sir Hovenden Walker about petition of Captain Southack, comander of the Province galley.

Canada expedition.

Mr. Dummer summon'd.

Sir Hovenden Walker attending, the petition of Captain Southack, comander of the Province gallery of the Massachusets Bay, employ'd in the expedition against Canada, referr'd to this Board by an Order of Council of 8th August, 1713, was read; whereupon Sir Hovenden said that the Queen had order'd Captain Southack to command the said gallery in the Canada expedition; that thereupon he had given him a commission and had order'd him to fit and equip the said gallery, which Captain Southack did accordingly; that in regard the said galley belongs to the Government of the Massachusets, and that she was not hir'd or taken up in her Majesty's service in the regular way, he was of opinion that the Government of the Massachusets Bay ought to be at the expence of equipping and victualling the said galley. After Sir Hovendon was withdrawn, ordered that Mr. Dummer, agent for the Massachusets Bay, have notice to attend their lordships to-morrow morning.

Jamaica.

Mr. Whitlock. Kupius.

Value of the escheated estate.

Mr. Whitlock [fo. 116, v. infra], solicitor for Johanna Kupius and others, relations of Williamina Kupius, late of Jamaica, deceased, attending, and being asked if he knew what was the real value of the escheated estate of the said Williamina, he said that when they were heard before this Board by council in December last, Mr. Hodges who then attended, said that the estate was worth 5,000l. sterling, and being asked what he thought Johanna Kupius and the others wou'd be willing to give for the said estate, he said he beleiv'd they wou'd give about 800l. or 1,000l. sterling for it.

February 12. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts.

Jamaica.

Letter to Lord High Treasurer. Swymmer.

Kupius's escheated estate.

A letter to the Lord High Treasurer [v. supra, R. fo. 7], upon the petition of Mr. Swymmer, relating to the escheated estate of Williamina Kupius, in Jamaica, mention'd in yesterday's minutes, was sign'd.

(Folios 125, 126 are missing, but there is no gap in the minutes.)

Trade.

Fishery. Captain Taverner's memorial.

Captain Taverner attending [fo. 117, 233], presented to their lordships a memorial relating to the fishery of Great Britain, which was read, and an abstract order'd to be made thereof.

Barbadoes.

Colonel Cleland, Mr. Chester, &c. Act about Three Houses Spring.

Mr. Heysham and Mr. Royle summon'd.

Colonel Cleland, Mr. Chester and others attending about the Act lately pass'd in Barbadoes, relating to a rivulet call'd the Three Houses Spring, mention'd in the minutes of the 2nd instant [fo. 112, 132], their lordships agreed to reconsider the said Act on Thursday morning next, and ordered that Mr. Heysham and Mr. Royle, who appear for the said Act, be desired to attend the Board at the same time.

February 16. Present:—Lord Guilford, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Massachusets.

Mr. Dummer about petition of Captain Southack.

Mr. Dummer, agent for the province of the Massachusets Bay, attending, pursuant to the order of the 11th instant, and being asked whether he had anything to offer in relation to the petition of Captain Southack, commander of the Province galley of the Massachusets Bay (read the 26th of November last), and now before their lordships, he promised to consider thereof, and in a few days to lay his thoughts upon it before the Board in writing.

Newfoundland.

Letter from Captain Taverner.

Survey, &c. Letter to Lord Viscount Bolingbroke.

A letter from Captain Taverner, dated this day, relating to his being dispatch'd pursuant to her Majesty's commission for taking a survey &c. of Newfoundland [fo. 163], was read; whereupon ordered that a copy of the same be sent to the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, and a letter to his lordship being prepared accordingly for inclosing the said copy, as also the copy of a representation from the town of Dartmouth [fo. 122], mention'd in the minutes of the 11th instant, was agreed and ordered to be transcribed.

February 17. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pitts.

Trade.

France. Letter from Lord Bolingbroke.

Instructions to commissaries for commerce.

A letter from the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke [fo. 131], dated yesterday, together with a copy of her Majesty's instructions to the commissaries for commerce she has been pleased to appoint to treat with those daily expected from France, were read, and their lordships resolved to take the same into further consideration to-morrow morning.

Newfoundland.

Letter to Lord Bolingbroke.

Memorials about survey.

A letter to the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, ordered yesterday to be transcribed, for inclosing to his lordship the copies of a representation from the town of Dartmouth [fo. 128], and of a letter from Captain Taverner [fo. 128], relating to the taking a survey &c. of Newfoundland, was sign'd.

Jamaica.

Letter from Lord Viscount Bolingbroke.

Complaint of the Assembly. Regiment.

Newfoundland.

Letter from Colonel Moody. Instructions.

Jamaica.

Letter to Mr. Thurston.

Notice to merchants about the regiment.

Letter to Colonel Laws.

A letter from the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, dated yesterday, relating to a complaint of the Assembly of Jamaica, about the maintaining Major-General Handasyd's regiment in that island [fo. 138], during time of peace, and inclosing the copy of a letter from Colonel Moody [fo. 130, 136, 140], relating to several instructions necessary for his conduct at Newfoundland, was read, together with the copy of Mr. Moody's letter. Whereupon ordered that a letter be writ to Mr. Thurston, agent for Jamaica, to acquaint him with the said complaint, that he may give notice thereof to such merchants and planters as are in town, with the Board's desire of speaking with them thereupon on Tuesday next at eleven of the clock in the morning; and that another letter be writ to Colonel Laws, desiring likewise to speak with him and any others he shall think fit on that subject at the same time.

Newfoundland.

Moody's Letter.

Captain Taverner summon'd.

Further ordered, in relation to the foremention'd copy of Colonel Moody's letter [fo. 129], that Captain Taverner be desired to attend the Board on Fryday morning next.

Trade.

Letter from Royal African Company.

Prussian settlements.

Letter to Monsieur Bonet.

A letter from Royal African Company, dated the 15th instant, in answer to the secretary's letter to them of the 12th of the last month, upon a memorial from Monsieur Bonnet [fo. 86], Resident of Prussia, relating to his Prussian Majesty's settlements on the coast of Africa, was read. Whereupon ordered that a letter be writ to Monsieur Bonet [fo. 133], acquainting him with the receipt of the foresaid letter from the Royal African Company, and that their lordships should be glad if his affairs would permit him to come to the Board on Fryday next at eleven of the clock.

February 18. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows,
Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Trade.

France.

Letter from Lord Bolingbroke.

Instructions to comissaries.

Letter to Mr. Martin.

The letter from the Lord Bolingbroke, of 16th instant [fo. 128], inclosing a copy of her Majesty's instructions to her commissaries appointed to treat with those of France, was again read; and ordered that a letter be writ to Mr. Martin, secretary to the said comissaries [fo. 133], to acquaint him that the Board desire to speak with them at 11 of the clock in the morning.

Jamaica.

Mr. Compere.

Act about Finch.

Hearing appointed. Notice to Mr. Cobb.

Mr. Compere [fo. 104, 140] desiring to be heard again by council upon an Act for vesting the estate of Thomas Finch in trustees for the payment of 3,800l. due from him as commissioner to the public of Jamaica, past the 8th of June, 1711; their lordships appointed Thursday next at ten of the clock in the morning to hear that matter, and ordered that Mr. Cobb, who appears on the other side, have notice thereof.

Barbadoes.

Mr. Royle, Mr. Chester &c. Act about Three Houses Spring.

Mr. Royle attending [fo. 127], as he had been desired the 12th instant, as also Mr. Chester and Colonel Woodbridge, upon an Act pass'd in Barbadoes, relating to a spring or rivulet called the Three Houses Spring, Mr. Royle said that Mr. Heysham, who is agent for that island, being ill of the gout, and not able to wait on their lordships, he was not willing to take upon himself the making of any agreement in relation to the said Act, and therefore desir'd a further day. Mr. Chester and Mr. Woodbridge said that the allegations in the Act that the course of the rivulet had been changed was not true, and that they wou'd, in case their lordships shou'd think fit to represent the Act to be repealed, write to Mr. Sandford that the course of the rivulet shou'd not be alter'd, and that it continue for the future as it has hitherto done; whereupon their lordships agreed to consider the same at a convenient opportunity.

February 19. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows,
Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts,
Mr. Vernon.

1713–14.

Trade.

Monsieur Bonet.

Letter from Royal African Company.

Prussian settlements.

Monsieur Bonet attending [fo. 130], as he had been desired the 17th instant, their lordships comunicated to him an extract of a letter from the Royal African Company, of the 15th, upon a memorial from the said Monsieur Bonet, relating to the King of Prussia's settlements in Africa, and acquainted him that, in ten days’ or three weeks’ time, their lordships would send for the said Company, when Monsieur Bonet should be present also, that they may explain themselves more particularly upon the said memorial.

Commissariesfor treating with the French.

Mr. Whitworth, Mr. Murray, Sir Joseph Martin and Mr. Frederick Herne [fo. 131, 136], her Majesty's comissaries for treating with those of France, attending as they had been desired yesterday, their lordships acquainted them with their opinion,—

That they ought in the first place to insist with the French commissaries that all the articles in the Treaty of Commerce except the 8th and 9th, are positive.

Next, that the extent of the words, goods and merchandizes of Great Britain, mention'd in the 9th article, be explaind as in the Bill before the House of Comons the last year.

Thirdly, that it be agreed that any exemptions of duties or priviledges in commerce that shall be granted in France, to, or enjoy'd by, any other nation, in respect of the four excepted species, shall be likewise enjoy'd by the subjects of Great Britain.

Letter to Lord Viscount Bolingbroke.

Objections of the French on account of the 8th and 9th articles of the treaty.

Then these gentlemen desiring to know what steps had been taken in France in relation to the first of the aforemention'd heads, for their better guidance, their lordships immediately writ a letter to my Lord Viscount Bolingbroke [fo. 135], desiring that they may have such extracts of letters and other papers, that will shew that the French have objected, that the 9th article, not being made effectual by a law here, all the rest of the treaty is void, and that his lordship would please to transmit the same to this Board, in order to their delivering it to the comissaries aforesaid.

February 22. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts.

Trade.

Letter from Lord Viscount Bolingbroke.

Extracts of letters to and from Mr. Prior.

French interpretation of the Treaty of Commerce sent to commissaries.

A letter from the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, of the 19th instant [fo. 134], with extracts of letters between his lordship and Mr. Prior, relating to some difficulties started about the interpretation of the Treaty of Commerce with France, in answer to the letter writ to his lordship the same day, was read; and ordered that copies of the said letter and extracts be sent to her Majesty's commissary's for treating with those of France.

Copies of minutes given them.

The secretary acquainted their lordships that Mr. Martin, secretary to her Majesty's commissaries, had been here this morning, to desire from them a copy of that part of their lordships’ minutes which relates to what pass'd when they were at the Board on Fryday last [fo. 133]; ordered that the same be sent to them accordingly.

Trade.

Letter from Mr. Martin about commissaries attending the Board.

A letter from Mr. Joseph Martin, secretary to her Majesty's commissaries, acquainting their lordships that the said comissaries desired to attend them to-morrow morning [fo. 139], was read, and ordered that the secretary acquaint Mr. Martin that their lordships will be ready to-morrow at eleven of the clock.

Newfoundland.

Captain Taverner.

Letter from Colonel Moody.

Instructions.

Captain Taverner attending [fo. 129], the copy of Colonel Moody's letter to my Lord Bolingbroke, dated at Lisbon the 25th of January last, mention'd in the minutes of the 17th instant, was read to him; whereupon he said that he was of opinion that the first and second of the instructions desired by Colonel Moody were reasonable and necessary.

As to the third, relating to his holding a court marshal, he said he coud give no opinion upon it; but he thought it was proper that Colonel Moody should be impower'd to command the inhabitants to join with the soldiers in case of an invasion either by pirates or others; and he was of opinion that the inhabitants would not be very easy, if Colonel Moody had a power to command them to cut wood (though it were after the fishing season) for building of a fortification.

February 23. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Bermuda.

Letter from Mr. Pulleyne, Lieutenant Governor, about British ships seized by the Spaniards.

Affidavits thereupon.

Letter to Lord Viscount Bolingbroke.

A letter from Mr. Pulleine, Lieutenant Governor of Bermuda, dated the 9th January last, giving an account that Spanish privateers, commission'd by their several governors in America, have taken several ships belonging to her Majesty's subjects in those parts, for having silver, salt, cacoa, hides or brazelletto wood on board, and inclosing two affidavits confirming the same, were read; and a letter imediately drawn up and sign'd for inclosing copies thereof to my Lord Bolingbroke [fo. 146].

Jamaica.

Merchants and others about recalling the regiment.

To put their thoughts in writing.

Colonel Laws, Mr. Kent, Mr. Thompson, Mr. Aylmer, Mr. Beckford and several other Jamaica merchants and planters attending, and being ask'd their opinion in relation to the recalling the regiment that is at Jamaica [fo. 129, 152], or to the keeping it there still, they said that the keeping the regiment there wou'd undoubtedly be of great security to the island, either in case of a new war, or in case of any attempts from their negroes; but they were satisfy'd the Assembly would subsist them no longer, and had lately pass'd an Act for subsisting them till May next and no longer; that the regiment consists of 300 men, and have been subsisted at the rate of 13l. a year for the private centinels and 52l. a year for the officers; that, if the regiment was recalled, it wou'd certainly be a great disadvantage to the island; and therefore they proposed that the corps of the regiment might be recall'd, and the private centinels left at liberty to stay there or return. In that case they did not doubt but the greatest part of them would stay there, and by consequence would be inlisted in the militia, and by that means be a strengthning to the island. Then these gentlemen being desired to put their thoughts on this matter in writing, they promised to do it accordingly.

Trade.

France.

Comissaries at the Board.

Her Majesty's comissaries attending [fo. 136, v. infra], they acquainted their lordships that they perceived the French commissaries expected that we should make all our explanatory demands at once, and therefore they desired the directions of the Board what they shou'd do in case the French should insist thereon. Whereupon they were acquainted with their lordships’ opinion that they ought to proceed article by article, as proposed by their lordships in what they laid before the Lords of the Cabinet Council the 18th December last, and as they are directed in her Majesty's instructions to them.

February 25. Present:—Lord Guilford, Sir Philip Meadows, Mr. Monckton, Mr. Moore, Sir John Hynde Cotton, Mr. Pytts, Mr. Vernon.

Trade.

Commissaries at the Board.

Full powers, credentials &c.

Her Majesty's commissaries attending [v. supra, 149], acquainted their lordships that they had been this morning to visit the French commissaries, and that Monsieur D'Iberville had inform'd them that he had no full powers, but yet expected to assist in the conferences with the other two commissaries, by virtue of his credentials and instructions from the King; and therefore her Majesty's commissaries desired to have the directions of the Board in this particular. Whereupon they were acquainted that so soon as they exchanged their full powers on both sides, and copies thereof laid before the Board, their lordships wou'd be better able to give them their opinion in that matter.

Newfoundland.

Letter to Lord Bolingbroke.

Instructions to Colonel Moody.

A letter to the Lord Viscount Bolingbroke, in answer to that part of his lordship's of 16th February, upon a letter from Colonel Moody [fo. 129], desiring some instructions touching the soldiers and inhabitants at Newfoundland, was signd.

Jamaica.

Hearing about Finch, Simpson and Gandy.

Order of Council.

Representation.

Attorny and Solicitor General's.

Mr. Serjeant Webb, with Mr. Compere attending [fo. 131], in behalf of the heir and creditors of Thomas Finch, late of Jamaica, deceased, and Sir Peter King attending, in behalf of the executors of Thomas Simpson and Charles Gandy, late of the said island, also deceased; her Majesty's Order in Council of the 8th March, 1711/12, referring back to the Board their lordships’ representation of 21 February foregoing, upon the petition of Thomas Simpson and Mrs. Gandy (widow of the said Charles Gandy), and directing their lordships to consult her Majesty's Attorney and Solicitor General thereupon, was read, as was also the said representation, together with Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor General's report thereupon.

Mr. Serjeant Webb then acquainted their lordships that he wou'd not enter upon the state of the case in relation to the passing of the Act for vesting the estate real and personal of the said Thomas Finch in trustees, the better to inable his sureties to pay the summe of 3,800l. due from the said Thomas Finch as Commissioner to the publick of this island, that having already been fully laid before their lordships at the last hearing in February, 1711/12, and before her Majesty by their lordships’ foresaid representation.

The main objection that he had heard made to the said representation was, that it is therein asserted that by the laws of that island, real estates are not subject to pay debts; in answer whereunto he said, that at the first hearing that was not controverted by the other side, neither is it taken notice of in Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor's foresaid report; that indeed there was no written law for it, but it was the common law of that island, and he could prove (were it question'd) by the testimony of the most considerable persons of that island here in England, that real estates are not liable to pay debts there (even in the case of the Crown) longer than for the life of the party.

He then made several objections to Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor General's report; that by an Act pass'd the 5th April, 1710, for appropriating the sum of 5,000l. for fitting two sloops &c., Finch, Gandy and Simpson became bound in a bond to her Majesty for the sume of 5,000l., to be accountable to the Assembly there, which he observ'd was unprecedented, for that they ought to have been accountable to her Majesty.

Whereas in the report the Attorney and Solicitor say that Finch by his receipts acknowledged to have received of Charles Chaplin 1,500l. and 2,300l., making together 3,800l., but whereas in reality he received but 1,500l., they do not take notice it was insisted on by Finch in the Assembly at Jamaica, and by those who appeared for him at the hearing before Mr. Attorney and Solicitor General that the receipt for the 2,300l. was exacted from Finch by Chaplain and another person, by locking of him up in a room and threatning him in case of refusal, which while Finch was alive might have been proved, but that now it cou'd not be done, unless time were given to send over to Jamaica for it; that the said Finch never did receive that money, for Chaplin, pretending Finch ow'd him so much, discounted that sum with him, which was not justifiable in Chaplin; besides, that by the Act for appropriating the 5,000l. Chaplin is directed to pay the money as collected to the commissioners, and not to any one or more of them, so that Chaplin ought in reality to be accountable for the money paid to Finch or Simpson, he not having done it as directed by the Act. He further took notice that the receipt for the 2,300l. was not exacted till after the Assembly had call'd for an account of the 5,000l.

Whereas Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor say that Chaplin, having given a note to Finch, declaring that, as there was an account depending, if it should appear, on the settling that account, that there was not so much due to him as Finch had given receipts for, Chaplain wou'd refund the overplus, and as it did not appear to them that Finch had ever accounted with Chaplin, they concluded that he was debtor to him in the sums mention'd in Finch's receipts. In answer to which, Mr. Serjeant said that the reason why Finch did not account, was that he was clapt up in prison, and his estate books and papers seized, so that he was incapacitated from doing it.

As to the letter writ by Finch to Mr. Howard, a member of the Assembly, mention'd by Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor General, they (sic) could never be interpreted as a consent of Finch's to the passing of the Act, for that letter only set forth his readiness to sell his estate for the repayment of such monies as he had receiv'd from Chaplin, and willingness to put it into the hands of such trustees as the Assembly shou'd appoint, and not that they shou'd take it from him, and sell it at an under value, as has actually been done; besides, that Finch did desire to be heard in the Assembly against the passing to (sic) the said Act, but it was refused him.

Mr. Serjeant took notice that there is no provision in the Act, what shall become of the overplus of Finch's estate after the publick debts are discharg'd, which he thought a very great hardship to the creditors and children of the said Finch.

As to Mr. Attorney and Mr. Solicitor's reason for confirming the Act, that part of Finch's estate being already sold, the purchasers, if the Act be repealed, will loose the money paid by them for the same, he said that was no consideration, for the Act is not a law till confirm'd by her Majesty, and therefore, if they have purchased under a wrong title, it was their own faults.

Sir Peter King then said that there was no law in that island that made real estates liable to debts, and he own'd that the custom there had made it otherways, though in the case of the Crown that custom ought not to take place.

He said that there was no force or threats used to obtain the above-mention'd receipts from Finch, but offer'd no proof thereof.

That he thought the payment of the money to any one of the commissioners was a good payment, they having given separate bonds to her Majesty to be answerable for such money as they should receive.

After Sir Peter had been further heard upon this matter, and the counsel withdrawn, their lordships agreed to reconsider the whole matter at the first opportunity, in order to their making a report thereon to her Majesty.