House of Lords Journal Volume 5: 3 April 1643

Page 687

Journal of the House of Lords: Volume 5, 1642-1643. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1767-1830.

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Page 687

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DIE Lunæ, videlicet, 3 die Aprilis.


Earl of Manchester, Speaker this Day.

Mr. Fane, a Pass to France.

Ordered, That Mr. Rob't Fane shall have a Pass, to go into France, with himself and Two Servants.

Report of the Conference about the Capuchins.

The Speaker made Report of the Conference some Days since with the House of Commons, concerning the Capuchins:

1. An Order of the House of Commons was read concerning the same, to let their Lordships see, that what they had now done was upon an Order formerly made. (Here enter it.)

2. The House of Commons desired their Lordships Concurrence, for the removing and sending the Capuchins out of the Kingdom, for the Reasons following:

"1. The State shall draw upon themselves the Guilt of Idolatry, by unnecessary permitting, and voluntary conniving at, the Exercise of the Mass within this Realm.

"2. It is against the Laws of the Land, and a great Scandal, to suffer these, especially so near the Parliament.

"3. The frequent and notorious Resort of great Multitudes of People to the Masses of these Capuchins, much complained of by the Petition of the neighbouring Inhabitants.

"4. They are the more dangerous in respect of the Papists rising at this Time in Arms against the Parliament; and there is a Letter lately intercepted, which signifies that the Capuchins will hide themselves, and run away.

"5. The House of Commons, about a Year since, upon some of these and the like Considerations, voted the sending of them away; whereupon the French Ambassador desired Respite for Six Weeks, promising to take a Course to have them removed without Offence. The Scandal increasing, and the People much unsatisfied, the House of Commons hath entered into a serious Resolution to execute their former Order.

"As to the Objection of the French Agent, touching the Treaty of Marriage, the Answer is, That the House of Commons know not of that Treaty; but that, if it were so as he alledgeth, it is without Consent of Parliament and the Laws of this Land."

And this House taking this Business into Consideration, (fn. 1) it was Resolved, To have a Conference with the House of Commons; and these Lords were appointed to draw up Heads for the same, and to vindicate their Lordships Honour, and satisfy the Kingdom:

Committee to prepare Heads for a further Conference about them.

E. Holland.
E. (fn. 2) Bedford.
E. Pembrooke.
E. Sarum.
E. Holland.
L. Viscount Say.
L. Howard.

Any Three.

Message from the H. C. with some Votes concerning the Treaty with the King.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Sir John Evelyn Knight; which was,

1. To desire their Lordships Concurrence in some Votes following: videlicet,

"Resolved, &c.

"That further Time shall be given to the Committee at Oxford, to treat upon the Two First Propositions, videlicet, the First Proposition of His Majesty's, and the First Proposition of both Houses."

Agreed to.

"Resolved, &c.

"That the Time prescribed for the Treaty upon the Two First Propositions shall be until Friday next."

Agreed to.

"Resolved, &c.

"That Friday, in this last Question, shall be taken inclusive."

Agreed to.

Ordered, That these Votes shall be speedily sent to the Committees at Oxford, in a Letter from the Speaker of this House, by Sir Peter Killegree.

The Answer returned was:


That this House agrees with the House of Commons in these Votes now brought up; and that their Lordships have Ordered them to be sent speedily to the Committee at Oxford.


House adjourned till 9a cras.


  • 1. Origin. and it.
  • 2. Origin. Bedfor.