House of Lords Journal Volume 64: 16 February 1832

Die Jovis, 16° Februarii 1832.

DOMINI tam Spirituales quam Temporales præsentes fuerunt:

PRAYERS.

The Earl of Shaftesbury sat Speaker by virtue of a former Commission.

Birmingham, &c. Roads Bill.

Hodie 2^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act for more effectually maintaining and improving the Roads from Birmingham to Wednesbury and to Great Bridge, and from thence to the Portway adjoining the Bilston and Wednesbury Turnpike Road, and to Nether Trindle near Dudley, and from Trouse Lane, in the Parish of Wednesbury, to Darlaston, in the Counties of Warwick, Stafford and Worcester; and for making new Branches of Road communicating therewith."

Ordered, That the said Bill be committed to the Consideration of the Lords present this Day:

Their Lordships, or any Five of them, to meet Tomorrow, at Ten o'Clock in the Forenoon, in the Prince's Lodgings, near the House of Peers; and to adjourn as they please.

Manerowen Inclosure Bill:

Hodie 3^a vice lecta est Billa, intituled, "An Act for inclosing Lands in the Parish of Manerowen, in the County of Pembroke."

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill shall pass?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Message to H.C. that the Lords have agreed to it.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by Sir Giffin Wilson and Mr. Martin;

To acquaint them, That the Lords have agreed to the said Bill, without any Amendment.

Hardingston Road Bill.

The Earl of Shaftesbury reported from the Lords Committees, to whom the Bill, intituled, "An Act for more effectually repairing and improving the Road from Hardingston to Old Stratford, in the County of Northampton," was committed; "That they had considered the said Bill, and examined the Allegations thereof, which were found to be true; and that the Committee had gone through the Bill, and directed him to report the same to the House, without any Amendment."

Ipswich Road Bill.

The Earl of Shaftesbury made the like Report from the Lords Committees, to whom the Bill, intituled, "An Act for more effectually repairing and otherwise improving the Road from Ipswich to Stratford Saint Mary, in the County of Suffolk," was committed.

Burford Road Bill.

The Earl of Shaftesbury also made the like Report from the Lords Committees, to whom the Bill, intituled, "An Act for more effectually improving the Road from Burford to Banbury, in the County of Oxford, and from Burford to the Road leading to Stow, in the County of Gloucester, and from Swerford Gate, in the County of Oxford, to the Road in Aynho, in the County of Northampton; and for making a new Branch of Road to communicate with the same," was committed.

The House was adjourned during Pleasure.

The House was resumed by The Lord Chancellor.

Education, (Ireland,) Petition from Moate against proposed Plan of.

Upon reading the Petition of the Protestant Clergy and Protestant Inhabitants of various Denominations, Parish of Moate, County Westmeath, whose Names are thereunto subscribed; praying their Lordships, "That no Legislative Measures may be enacted, and no Parliamentary Aid afforded to any System of Education of the Poor of Ireland inconsistent with the great and distinguishing Principles of the Christian Faith; namely, that the whole Word of God shall be the only acknowledged Standard of National Education:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Contagious Diseases (Ireland) Bill:

The Order of the Day being read for the Third Reading of the Bill, intituled, "An Act to amend Two Acts passed in the Fifty-eighth and Fifty-ninth Years of the Reign of His Majesty King George the Third, for establishing Fever Hospitals and for preventing contagious Diseases in Ireland;"

The said Bill was accordingly read the Third Time.

The Question was put, "Whether this Bill shall pass?"

It was resolved in the Affirmative.

Message to H.C. that the Lords have agreed to it.

A Message was sent to the House of Commons, by the former Messengers;

To acquaint them, That the Lords have agreed to the said Bill, without any Amendment.

Slavery, Petition of F. Shekleton for Abolition of.

Upon reading the Petition of Francis Shekleton of Walterstown, near the Post Town of Laurgangreen, in the County of Louth, Ireland, Gentleman; praying, "That their Lordships will shortly put an End to the Miseries of the Slaves in the British Colonies, by having them emancipated:"

It is Ordered, That the said Petition do lie on the Table.

Gaols, Reports, &c. respecting, delivered.

The Lord Melbourne laid before the House, pursuant to the Directions of several Acts of Parliament,

"Copies of all Reports and of Schedules (B.) transmitted to the Secretary of State pursuant to the 24th Section of the 4th Geo. 4th, Cap. 64, and 14th Section of the 5th Geo. 4th, Cap. 12;" together with a List thereof.

Which List was read by the Clerk as follows; (vizt.)

Ordered, That the said Papers do lie on the Table.

Cholera Prevention Bill, brought from H.C. and read 1 a:

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act for the Prevention, as far as may be possible, of the Disease called the Cholera, or Spasmodic or Indian Cholera, in England;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Ordered, That the said Bill be printed.

Standing Orders 26 & 155 to be considered on it.

Ordered, That the Standing Orders, No. 26 and No. 155, relative to Bills not being read or proceeded in Twice the same Day, be taken into Consideration To-morrow, in order to their being dispensed with upon the lastmentioned Bill; and that the Lords be summoned.

Exchequer Bills Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act for raising the Sum of Twelve Millions by Exchequer Bills, for the Service of the Year One thousand eight hundred and thirtytwo;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

Transfer of Aids Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act to apply certain Sums to the Service of the Year One thousand eight hundred and thirty-two;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

Pensions, &c. Duties Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act for continuing to His Majesty for One Year certain Duties on Personal Estates, Offices and Pensions in England, for the Service of the Year One thousand eight hundred and thirty-two;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Three Bills were, severally, read the First Time.

Pasteur's Naturalization Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

To return the Bill, intituled, "An Act for naturalizing Pierre Jaques Adolphe Pasteur;" and to acquaint this House, That they have agreed to the same, without any Amendment.

Aston Rowant Inclosure Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Mr. Bernal and others;

To return the Bill, intituled, "An Act for inclosing Lands in the Parish of Aston Rowant, in the County of Oxford;" and to acquaint this House, That they have agreed to their Lordships Amendment made thereto.

Brough Ferry Roads Bill.

A Message was brought from the House of Commons, by Viscount Morpeth and others;

With a Bill, intituled, "An Act for repairing and otherwise improving the Road from Brough Ferry to South Newbald Holmes, and from Brough to Welton, in the East Riding of the County of York;" to which they desire the Concurrence of this House.

The said Bill was read the First Time.

Com ee on Tithes, (Ireland,) 1st Report from:

The Lord President reported from the Lords Committees appointed a Select Committee to inquire into the Collection and Payment of Tithes in Ireland, and the State of the Laws relating thereto; and to report their Observations thereon to the House; and to whom were referred certain Petitions and Papers and Accounts upon the Subject Matter referred to the Committee; "That the Committee had proceeded to examine into the Subject which had been referred to them; and although they had not yet been able to bring their Inquiries to a Close, they think it their Duty not to defer laying before the House their Opinion on Parts of the Evidence which had been brought before them, and on Circumstances which call for the immediate Attention of the Legislature: A Resistance, more or less decided, to the Payment of Tithe, appears to have been made in several Parts of Ireland, but more particularly in the Counties of Kilkenny, Carlow and Tipperary, and a Portion of the Queen's County, and supported by means of organized, illegal, and in some Instances armed Combinations; the Danger of which is increased by the peculiar Circumstances of Ireland; but which, from whatever Cause they may arise, if allowed to continue, and to extend themselves successfully to other Districts, cannot fail to be applied to other Objects, and ultimately to subvert the Dominion of the Law, and endanger the Peace and Security of Society:

"It appears that the Consequence of these Proceedings has been, that in the Districts where Resistance has been made to the Payment of Tithes the Clergy have in many Instances been reduced to the greatest Distress:

"The estimated Amounts, in the Districts where this Resistance has chiefly prevailed, according to Information laid before the Committee, of Sums due for the Tithe, are, in the Dioceses of

"It appears to the Committee that, in order to afford immediate Relief to the distressed Clergy, it is expedient that His Majesty should be empowered to advance to the Incumbent, where Tithes or Compositions in lieu of Tithes have been illegally withheld, or to his Representatives, upon a Petition verified by Affidavit, Sums not exceeding the Amount of the Arrears due for the Tithes of the Year 1831, proportioned to the Incomes of each, according to a Scale diminishing as their Incomes increase:

"That, as a Security for the Repayment of the Sums so to be advanced, His Majesty should be empowered to issue Orders to levy, under the Authority of a Law to be passed for this Purpose, the Amount of Arrears due for the Tithes of the Year 1831, without Prejudice to the Claims of the Clergy for any Arrear that may be due for a longer Period, reserving, in the first Instance, the Amount of the Advances so made, and paying over the remaining Balance to the legal Claimant:

"That where the Tithes claimed by the Party petitioning shall be under the Operation of the Composition Acts, the Amount to be advanced shall be regulated by such Composition; where the Amount of the Tithe shall have been regulated by any Agreement independently of the Composition Acts, the Amount shall be regulated by such Agreement; and in all other Cases by the average Amount of the Tithes which have been really and bonâ fide paid or secured to the Incumbent of such Parish for the Years 1827, 1828 and 1829:

"That in order to the more effectually levying the Amount of the Sums so to be advanced, it shall be lawful for The Attorney General to proceed, either by Petition to the Court of Chancery or of Exchequer, or by Civil Bill at the Quarter Sessions of the County in which the Parish or Part of the Parish of such Incumbent is situated, against all or any of the Parties from whom such Arrear shall be claimed as due by such Incumbent; and that the said Courts respectively may issue Process for the Recovery of the Sums to be by them awarded, conformably to the Provisions to be inserted in such Act of Parliament, and similar to those contained in several Acts of the Parliament of Ireland in the Years 1787, 1788, 1799 and 1800, with such Additions or Alterations as may be thought fit to be introduced into such Act, as adapted to the Circumstances now existing in Ireland:

"But strongly as the Committee are impressed with the Necessity of maintaining the Authority of the Law, and relieving the pressing Wants the Clergy have suffered from a Breach of it, they have anxiously turned their Attention to the Practicability of effecting an useful Alteration in the present System; and although the Inquiry in which they are engaged is not sufficiently advanced to enable them to pronounce a distinct Opinion as to the best Means of removing the Evils connected with the Collection of Tithes in Ireland, enough has appeared to satisfy them, that, with a view to secure both the Interests of the Church and the lasting Welfare of that Country, a permanent Change of System will be required: That such a Change, to be satisfactory and safe, must involve a complete Extinction of Tithes, including those belonging to Lay Impropriators, by commuting them for a Charge upon Land, or an Exchange for or Investment in Land, so as effectually to secure the Revenues of the Church, (as far as relates to Tithes,) and at the same Time to remove all pecuniary Collision between the Parochial Clergy and the Occupiers of Land."

Which Report being read by the Clerk;

Ordered, That the said Report do lie on the Table.

Ordered, That the said Report be printed.

Evidence in Part reported, & to be delivered out to all the Lords.

Then The Lord President reported the Minutes of Evidence taken before the last-mentioned Committee, up to the 9th Instant, inclusive.

The said Evidence was read by the Clerk. (fn. 1)

Ordered, That the Prints of the Evidence be delivered out to all the Members of the House.

Ecclesiastical Courts, Address for Report respecting.

Ordered, That an humble Address be presented to His Majesty, to request that His Majesty will be graciously pleased to order that there be laid before this House, "The Report of the Commissioners appointed to inquire into the Practice, &c. of the Ecclesiastical Courts in England and Wales."

Ordered, That the said Address be presented to His Majesty by the Lords with White Staves.

Report from Central Board of Health delivered.

The Lord President laid before the House, pursuant to an Address to His Majesty of Monday last,

"Report from the Central Board of Health to the Privy Council."

And the Title thereof being read by the Clerk;

Ordered, That the said Report do lie on the Table.

Ordered, That the said Report be printed.

Adjourn.

Dominus Cancellarius declaravit præsens Parliamentum continuandum esse usque ad et in diem Veneris, decimum septimum diem instantis Februarii, horâ decimâ Auroræ, Dominis sic decernentibus.