Proceedings in Parliament 1624: The House of Commons. Originally published by British History Online, 2015-18.
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MONDAY, 15 MARCH 1624
I. JOURNAL OF THE HOUSE OF COMMONS, PA, HC/CL/JO/1/12
[CJ 686; f. 43v]
Lunae, 150 Martii, 210 Jacobi
L. 2a. An act for the securing of the lordship or manor of Goteland, alias Goathland, and the tenants of the same under the most excellent Prince Charles his Highness from the encumbrances of Sir Richard Etherington, kt.
|Sir John Savile||Knights and burgesses of Yorkshire|
|Sir Thomas Hoby||Sir Thomas Estcourt|
|Mr. Wandesford||Sir George Dalston|
|Sir Thomas Savile||Sir H[enry] Poole|
|Sir John Walter||Sir Thomas Trevor|
|Mr. Secretary Cottington||Sir G[ervase] Clifton|
Mr. [Henry] Sherfield
Thursday, 2 [o']clock, Court of Wards.
SIR GEORGE MORE moves for the bill of arms to [be] brought in, or a new bill to be made and brought in.
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD, accordant.
Resolved, a copy to be brought of the old bill.
[f. 44] L. 1a. An act for free trade and traffic of Welsh cloths, cottons, friezes, lining[s] and plains in and through [the] kingdom of England and dominion of Wales.
L. 1a. [Blank]
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD. To look out the bills concerning the Chancery.
Resolved, to have them brought in.
SIR H[ENRY] SPILLER moves for the bill of elections.
to take the 2 bills for elections and to draw them into one bill.
L. 1a. An act against scandalous and unworthy ministers.
The question now debated in the House, who shall amend the return made of Charles Maynard.
Resolved, the bailiff of the town is to amend it, and not the Clerk of the Crown. The return to be sent down, to that purpose, to the bailiff in the country, and to return [Mr.] John Maynard for 1 of the burgesses for that borough.
For Sir Francis Popham's election, that the committee, by plurality of voices, thought others besides the bailiff and 12 burgesses should elect.
MR. [ROBERT] BERKELEY. That an ancient incorporation before 10 Mariae, when a new charter obtained. That [blank] Ed. 6, the return made by the bailiff and burgesses, pro se et aliis. That "Ballivus et Burgenses" et "Ballivus et duodecim Burgenses" all one. Altering of elections long continued dangerous.
[f. 44v] Mr. Justice [Humphrey] Winch and Serjeant [Sir John] Davies bring a message from the Lords: that their Lordships desire a conference with the committees who attended the King yesterday about making the report of his Majesty's answer yesterday to both Houses, the rather because some mistakings have been spread abroad of it, and the Prince has since attended his Majesty, who has given his Highness authority to explain the same.
The messengers called in and answer[ed]: the committees will presently give a meeting as desired.
The committee went up. Mr. Solicitor to report back.
MR. [RALPH] WHITFIELD reports the bill of inferior courts with some few amendments, which twice read.
Recommitted to the same committees. Mr. [Thomas] Wentworth, Mr. [John] Whistler, Mr. [John] Saunders, Mr. [James] Clarke, Sir Thomas Belasyse, Sir John Walter, Mr. Attorney Wards, Sir P[eter] Riddell to be added.
A petition from the under-sheriff of Cambridge read.
Resolved, this to stay until the House be full tomorrow morning, 8 of the clock, and then to be heard.
And then next engrossed bills to be put to passage.
L. 1a. An act to make ministers and other spiritual persons capable of leases of lands for the benefit of their wives and children.
L. 2a. An act for the freer liberty of fishing and fishing voyages to be made and performed in the seacoasts and places of Newfoundland, Virginia, New England and other the seacoasts and parts of America.
Wednesday, 2 [o']clock, Court of Wards.
[f. 45] L. 2a. An act for abbreviation of Michaelmas term.
MR. [THOMAS] FANSHAWE. That the prothonotaries and other experienced officers may, by authority of the committees, be sent for and conferred with.
SIR EDWARD COKE. Midsummer term the longest term in the year, having 7 returns until amended 37 H. 8.
Sir Edward Coke
All the lawyers of the House
Mr. [William] Cholmley
Mr. [William] Cage
Mr. Thomas Fanshawe
Sir Edward Giles
Sir George [sic] Stradling
Thursday, Inner Temple Hall, 2 [o']clock.
L. 1a. An act for relief of creditors against such persons as die in execution.
L. 1a. An act for preservation of salmon and trout and peals of the sea.
L. 3a. An act for confirmation of Wadham College in Oxford and the possessions thereof.
Upon question, passed.
II. JOURNAL OF THE HOUSE OF COMMONS, PA, HC/CL/JO/1/13
[CJ 736; f. 56]
Lunae, 15 Martii
L. 2. An act for securing of the manor of Goathland.
|Sir John Savile||Sir Thomas Estcourt|
|Sir Thomas Hoby||Sir George Dalston|
|Mr. Wandesford||Sir John Walter|
|Knights, burgesses Yorkshire||Sir Henry Poole|
|Sir Thomas Savile||Secretary Cottington|
|Sir Thomas Trevor||Sir Gervase Clifton|
|Mr. [Henry] Sherfield|
Thursday, 2 [o']clock, Court of Wards.
[CJ 737] SIR GEORGE MORE. To have a bill for arms prepared.
L. 1. An act for free trade and traffic of Welsh cloths, cottons, friezes, linings and plains in and through the kingdom of England and dominion of Wales.
L. 1. An act for the reversing, altering or correcting of erroneous judgements, decrees or orders in courts of equity and for better preventing of the like in time to come.
Bill concerning the Chancery to be looked up.
These are to take the 2 bills of elections and to draw them into one bill.
[f. 56v] L. 1. An act against scandalous and unworthy ministers.
Resolved, that the return of Charles Maynard, instead of [Mr.] John Maynard, shall be sent down to the bailiff of the town to be mended and not to be amended by the Clerk of the Crown.
A message from the Lords by Justice [Humphrey] Winch and Serjeant [Sir John] Davies: the Lords desire a conference of a committee of our House with their Lordships presently in the Painted Chamber, to agree upon a report to be made to both Houses; and the rather because some things in the King's speech are mistaken, the King has given power to the Prince his Highness to explain.
Answer: this House will presently give a meeting as is desired.
The names of our committee of 48 read and sent up to the Lords. Mr. Solicitor to make the report.
MR. [RALPH] WHITFIELD reports the bill of removing suits out of inferior courts. The amendments twice read.
The bill recommitted to the former committees:
|Mr. [James] Clarke||Sir Thomas Belasyse||Sir Peter Riddell|
|Mr. [William] Lenthall||Mr. [Thomas] Wentworth|
|Mr. [John] Wlyde||Mr. [John] Saunders|
|Mr. [John] Whistler||Sir John Walter|
5 [o']clock, Temple Hall.
[f. 57] A petition from Edward Ingrey, under-sheriff of Cambridgeshire, read.
This business to be heard tomorrow at 8 o'clock and then the engrossed bills to be put to the question of passage.
L. 1. An act to make ministers and other spiritual persons capable of leases of land for the benefit of their wives and children.
L. 2. An act for the freer liberty of fishing and fishing voyages.
Sir Baptist Hicks
Wednesday, Court of Wards, 2 o'clock.
L. 2. An act for the abbreviation of Michaelmas term.
|Sir Edward Coke||All the lawyers of the House|
|Mr. [Thomas] Fanshawe|
|Mr. [William] Cage|
|Mr. [William] Cholmley|
Thursday, Temple Hall, 2 [o']clock.
[f. 57v] L. 1. An act for relief of creditors against such persons as die in execution.
L. 1. An act for preservation of salmon, trout and peals in all the rivers of this realm.
L. 3. An act for the confirmation of Wadham College in Oxford and the possessions thereof.
Upon question, passed for a law.
III. DIARY OF JOHN HAWARDE, WILTSHIRE AND SWINDON ARCHIVES, 9/34/2
Lune, 15 Martii 1623
1. L. Bill pur inable ministers de purchase terres et preser leasses pur beneifte dal our issue.
2. L. Bill pur frank piscant sur coastes de America.
Sur question, comitte, Mercurii, [court de] gards.
2. L. Bill pur abbreviation de Michaelmas terme de 2x retornes.
Sur question, committe, Jovis in le Temple.
1. L. Bill pur relleiffe de creditors versus persons morte in execucion.
1. L. Bill pur increase del breede de fishe in le mere, salmon and trout.
3. L. Bill pur Wadham College.
Sur question, passe pur leye.
Conference ove les seignours.
Post meridiem, [committee for grievances]
Sir Edward Coke in le chaire.
Sir John Townshend's and Mr. [William] Tipper's commission.
Sur question, condemne pur greevance in le grante ou creation et execuion.
Sir Ferdinando Gorges's pattent.
Sur question, order deste amende; sur 2nd question, resolve que tout subjectes averont free fishinge in novell Angliterre et parts de Americae et touts incidents al cest, et timber auxy pur lour shippes come autre nations ont use d'avoir, car altus mare est free pur touts de fisher.
IV. DIARY OF JOHN HOLLES, BL, HARL. MS 6,383
Monday, the 15th of March
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD. There was [sic] already 7 bills in the House against the Chancery.
An act for reforming the ministry and depriving drunkards, etc.
[Mr.] John Maynard's return being misnamed, the writ was ordered to be sent to the bailiff of the town to amend, and not to the Clerk of the Crown. The question about his election was whether the bailiff and the twelve burgesses of Chippenham should only elect, or they with the rest of the freemen. The House left the power of election indefinite and ordered his election to be good, being by the bailiff and the 12.
There was a bill in the House that 60 years' possession should take away the king's right.
Judge [Sir Humphrey] Winch and Sir John Davies came of a message from the Lords to desire a conference to agree about the report of the King's speech, that there was a report, it was mistaken and the Prince should explain it.
[Conference with the Lords]
Sir John Davies read the report of the King's speech at the conference. The mistakings were two: the first, a report was spread that the King had disavowed the Prince's relation, and the Duke's, of the Spanish [f. 101v] business; the 2nd, that the King was not satisfied in conscience to break the treaties and make a war.
To this the Prince said he had since asked the King about it and the King answered he was, but he must have the advice of the House for the manner of publishing it.
V. DIARY OF SIR THOMAS JERVOISE, HAMPSHIRE RECORD OFFICE, 44M69/F4/20/1
At the conference [with the Lords], the 15th March
The Lord Duke is to explain some part of the King's speech and the Prince other parts.
To have 5 subsidies and two fifteens for the provision for the wars and but 1 subsidy and two fifteens for the payment of his debts yearly; but the Duke explained that if he may have 6 subsidies and 12 fifteens for the effecting of the great business, he will be contented therewith.
The Prince. Whereas the King spoke of his honour and conscience, he exp[lained] that the King say[s] he would take our advice, but because he had spoken of it before, if now he left it out, it might be thought the money made [p. 58] him do so, but he had thought of it and would desire our advice for his declaration.
[p. 59] His Majesty's speech in the Banquet[ing] House the 14th March.
[p. 60] [Afternoon,] at the committee of grievances the 15th March, being Monday
Mr. [William] Tipper questioned for his patent of defected [sic] titles.
Mr. [John] Wylde. The patent of Tipper defective in law and was so concluded at the last convention of Parliament, but yet notwithstanding that he has executed the purport of that patent by sending divers tickets to private men to their great vexation. The granting of such patents be contrary to the King's declaration in print.
Sir Edward Coke. The question is now not for the patent but for the tickets, which was the great vexation of the subjects.
Tipper appointed to appear every day until the House has resolved upon the business.
[p. 61] Doctor [Robert] Chambers's patent questioned and brought in and appointed to attend the House this day sevennight.
Sir Richard Lydall and Mr. More [sic] are to attend this House on Friday next to bring all bills and bands that are in their hands concerning the freeing of a new company of staples, their patent being damned the last Parliament.
Sir Ferdinando Gorges's patent of fishing.
Mr. [John] Finch, his counsel. Some things there may be that he will not justify, but if they be any grievance to the commonwealth, Sir F[erdinando] G[orges] will be a suitor to his Majesty to amend them. For prohibiting other[s] to fish they do not desire, so as they will be at part of the charge for the plantation, he being at a very great charge for effecting what has been done.
[p. 62] Sir E[dward] Coke. Opinion that the sea is free to all men for fishing by the authority of many ancient writers of the law, and where they do fish the[y] may come upon the land with their nets or gins.
Sir F[erdinando] Go[rges], by his is [sic] patent, is to hold the land called New England of his Majesty's house of Greenwich, so then the law thereof must be the law of old England, for of what place soever a thing is held, it is subject to the same customs as the place of whom it be held. If an offender commit an offence here, he may be sent into New England there to be punished.
Mr. [John] Glanville. The King cannot pass his sword of justices [sic] or his prerogative power to any person by any grant, for it is only incident to himself and it cannot be [p. 63] separated from his person.
Sir F[erdinando] Go[rges] denied that he had received any money off fisherman for their fishing in New England, but it was proved contrary by a letter from a town in the west country where they have in that one harbour received 230 and odd pounds as was averred by both the burgesses there.
Sir Edwin Sandys said that when he was with the lords of the Council about the fishing upon the coast of New England for the company of Virginia, Sir F[erdinando] Go[rges] did seem willing that they should fish, but then they should not have the wood for the[ir] use, by which restraint the fishermen having no means to repair their boats and make drying places on the shore, they are not able to fish, whereby denying the means, the[y] deny the thing and to make a monopoly of the fishing.
[p. 64] Sir Francis [sic] Popham one of the first that found out this New England, long before Sir F[erdinando] Go[rges] knew it, but since Sir F[erdinando] G[orges] has found out a profitab[l]e fishing and so have sought to gain it to himself.
No ship shall visit that coast of New England but she shall be, with her goods, confiscated.
VI. DIARY OF EDWARD NICHOLAS, TNA, SP 14/166
Monday, 150 Martii 1623
An act for free trade and traffic of Welsh cloths, cottons, friezes, bays, mynns [sic] and plains, in and through the kingdom of England and the principality of Wales. 1. L. r. p.
[f. 80v] An act for the reversing, ordering or correcting of erroneous judgements, decrees or orders in courts of equity and for better preventing of like in time to come. 1. L.
By this, a writ of errors (to be made and framed by the justices of the King's Bench or Common Pleas) shall issue out of one of those to examine such erroneous judgements, orders or decrees; and there are to be 6 of those justices at least to hear such erroneous judgements, and there is a fee for the judges in such cases and for the writ of error.
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD says there are 7 other bills for the rectifying of the Court of Chancery and other courts of equity. He desires they may be all looked for and have their reading with as much expedition as may be.
This was well liked of but not ordered.
A committee is appointed and ordered to look for 2 bills which are in this House concerning elections of knights and burgesses and to draw them both into one good bill.
An act against scandalous and unworthy ministers. 1. L.
It is ordered that the return of the town of Chippenham shall be sent down to that town to amend the same for that they have by mistake returned Charles Maynard for John Maynard.
Message from the Lords signifying that the Lords desire presently a [f. 81] conference between their committee and ours that yesterday attended the King [that] they may agree on a report to be made to this House, and the rather for that there go reports abroad that some mistaking[s] have been of the King's speech and therefore his Majesty has given the Prince command and power to expound and explain his Majesty's meaning therein.
Our answer is that we will give a meeting presently, as is desired, in the Painted Chamber.
The bill for removing of actions out of inferior courts is recommitted to the same committee and all that have spoken to it shall be added to that committee, to meet this day, 5 [o']clock in the afternoon, at the Temple.
An act to make ministers and other spiritual persons capable of leases of lands for the benefit of their wives and children. 1. L.
An act for the freer liberty of fishing and fishing voyages to be made and performed in [blank] America, Virginia, New England, Newfoundland and other places beyond seas or on the coast of America. 2. L. Committed, Wednesday in Court of Wards. Dormit Lords.
An act for the abbreviation of Michaelmas term. 2. L. Dormit Lords.
SIR EDWARD COKE says that in 32 H. 8, Trinity term having 7 returns in it, was made short. He says that he would have that precedent looked on and power given to the committee to send for all prothonotaries to attend it.
This committed, all the lawyers to have voice.
[f. 81v] An act for relief of creditors [blank] such persons as die in execution. 1. L. r. p.
By this, the creditors shall have writ of scire facias or elegit against the lands and tenements, goods and chattels of the said party that dies in execution. This bill to be in force from the end of this sessions [sic].
An act for the preservation and increase of salmon and trout and peals that come out of the sea. 1. L.
By this, no peal or salmon to be killed from Michaelmas until Our Lady Day on the penalty of [blank] and all weirs to be pulled up and lie open from Michaelmas until Our Lady Day. [Blank] and that all weirs for trout and peal shall be open from the first of June until the last of July.
[Afternoon,] committee, Monday, 150 Martii 1623, for grievances
Sir Edward Coke in the chair.
Petition of the Gold Wyre Drawers complaining that Matthias Fowle has, upon the cancelling of his patent of wiredrawers, procured from his Majesty a patent for corporation of that Company of Gold Wyre Drawers, and gotten himself to be master and warden of the said corporation, and has committed as great exaction by virtue thereof as he did before.
It is adjudged that the patent of concealments granted to Sir John Townshend is a grievance in creation and execution, and that Sir John Townshend has contemned the judgement of this House in putting the same patent in execution, being here condemned the last Parliament.
[f. 82] Concerning Sir Ferdinando Gorges's patent of fishing at New England and the plantation there.
Sir Edwin Sandys. That Sir Ferdinando Gorges's patent is a monopoly of fishing as well as a patent of plantation. That Sir F[erdinando] Gorges has taken above £200 for licences to fish off one town, and yet, for all the restraints, that town has brought in the worth of £25,000 in fish and would bring in much more but for this patent of monopolies. No countrymen are restrained from fishing at New England but the Englishmen. And albeit Sir F[erdinando] Gorge[s] says that the patentees do give liberty to all fisherman to fish there, yet do the colonies there by virtue of this patent deny to all fisherman the necessaries and conveniences of fishing, as timber for masts or mending of their ships and for making of their stages, without which they cannot fish. He wishes the patent may stand for so much as concerns the plantation, but not to restrain the fisherman from fishing.
Sir George Chudleigh said that the fisherman in New England do destroy the timber there under pretence of furnishing and fitting themselves and do furnish the savages there with guns and powder and shot and arms.
Mr. [Thomas] Sherwill. That it is not likely that the fishermen should furnish the savages with such weapons as might annoy themselves, but there were some Frenchmen that did furnish the savages with weapons in another part of New England.
Sir Thomas Jermyn. That it is an unreasonable [f. 82v] clause in the patent that no ship shall visit the coast of New England but such as are of that company but it shall be sunk by the ordnance of the forts there, so as if a ship be by weather driven there, she shall be sunk.
Mr. [John] Glanville showed a libel depending in the Admiralty Court against Simon Ley, wherein it is charged that he, without licence and contrary to Sir Ferdinando Gorges's patent, did traffic, trade and fish at New England. And Mr Glanville produced a book, written by the president and Company of New England, which does charge the last Parliament with faction in questioning those patentees for their abuses in the execution of that patent, and this book is dedicated to the Prince.
It is here resolved, by question, that all fishermen visiting this coast of New England may there take necessary timber for the maintenance of their fishing and ships, and that the clause in that patent of Sir F[erdinando] Gorges whereby all men are prohibited, on pain of confiscation of ship and goods, to take timber there is a grievance and fit to be altered or left out.
This resolution of the committee was after confirmed and ordered by the House.
VII. DIARY OF SIR WILLIAM SPRING, HOUGHTON LIBRARY, HARVARD UNIVERSITY, MS ENG. 980
Monday, the 15th of March
An act for the settling of the manor of Goathland on the Prince. It is committed.
SIR GEORGE MORE moves for a bill for the good provision of good arms.
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD seconds it, shows the statute now in force is defective, being the care is imposed and depends only on one man and of the deputies.
It is ordered, for remedy, that the old bill passed and engrossed last shall be new drawn and presented again.
An act for Welsh cottons.
An act for reversing erroneous judgements in courts of equity.
An act against scandalous ministers for alehouses, quarrelling, etc. Imprisonment and the second offence loss of benefice.
Whereas in the return of the name of Charles Maynard instead of [Mr.] John [Maynard], question did arise whether the Clerk of the Crown might alter it or the sheriff, it was resolved that the Clerk of the Crown might not, nor the sheriff because he was but the means of conveyance, but the bailiff by whom the return was made from Chippenham.
MR. [ROBERT] BERKELEY, a lawyer, moves the question for Chippenham whether the House would determine that the election were in the 12 [burgesses] or in the general commons. Desires that the words of the charter (burgensibus) may be so interpreted as that the charter may stand good, for that in obscure sentences it is ever held that the best way of construction is ut res magis valeat potiusguam pereat. He moves it may so be resolved that though the question has, as is usual, begot a resolution, yet the resolution may beget no question, which were preposterous.
A message is sent by Justice [Sir Humphrey] Winch and Serjeant [Sir John] Davies for a meeting with the Lords.
It is granted.
[p. 117] An act against removing causes out of inferior courts. Committed.
An act for abbreviating Michaelmas term. Committed.
An act to relieve creditors with the goods of parties executed.
An act for increase of salmon.
An act for Wadham College. Engrossed.
An act enabling ministers to buy [sic] land.
An act for fishing voyages. Committed.
VIII. DIARY OF SIR THOMAS HOLLAND, BODL., TANNER MS 932
Monday, 15 Martii
Second read. Committed, Thursday, Court [of] Wards. An act for the securing of the tenants of the manor of Goteland, alias Goathland, the Prince's/
[SIR GEORGE] MORE moved that there may be a bill drawn for arms that may be certain, for now there is nothing but the charge certain.
Second [sic] read. An act for the free trading of Welsh cloths, cottons in Wales.
First read. An act for reordering, reversing and correcting erroneous judgements, decrees and orders in courts of equity for the time to come.
First read. An act against scandalous and unworthy ministers.
If any be a common alehouser, a barrater or maintainer of quarrels, shall be imprisoned a month and pay 40s.
Message from the Lords, [Sir John] Davies, [Sir Humphrey] Winch. The Lords desire a meeting of the committee yesterday for a conference because his Majesty understand[s] that there is a mistake dispersed in the town and therefore he has given power to the Prince to explain in the Painted Chamber presently.
Engrossed. The bill for Wadham College.
First read. An act to make spiritual person[s] capable to purchase [sic] lands.
Second read. Committed. An act for freer fishing in America.
Second read. Committed. An act for abbreviation of Michaelmas term.
First reading. An act for relief of creditors where debt[ors] die in execution.
[f. 53v] First read. An act for increase of salmon.
15 March, at the conference
Buckingham. The Prince having heard of some reports in the town of the King's speech, the Prince went to the King to explain it, which the King/
For where he said that I sh[owed] [blank]. My Lords and gentlemen all/
The King's speech. I have nothing to say to the preamble of my Lord of Canterbury but that he intimated something in it that I cannot allow of, for where he said I showed myself sensible and of the indignity offered to my children, or insensible thereof; it was only Buckingham's relation that touched upon it. Yet by that you must not bar me, you must not make Jup[iter] speak that which Jup[iter] speaks not, and when I shall speak any such thing, I will speak with that reason and back it with that power that becomes a king.
Now for the matter of the declaration, it is without example I [blank] that ever any king had so large an offer [f. 54] and with God's favour I need not fear nothin[g] in this war, having so large offer. I hold it to be more than millions of subsidies but, my Lords and gentlemen, you give me leave of the one side to consider of the possibility of the action. For my Lords, in this case I must do as a man that makes a fortification; he must have outworks and inworks, so I must not only deal with my own people but with my allies in so great business as the recovery of the Palatinate, and in this case it is not sufficient for me to have [blank] it [blank]. General words will not carry it; therefore, I must resort to particulars [sic] means and follow the counsel of our saviour in the gospel. Before I begin a war, to see how I can maintain it; it is a longsome work and I desire with Moses, as I said before, to see the land of promise.
[f. 54v] The Duke affirmed that if we would add one subsidy/
I will deal freely with you and tell you in particular what I think will do, but whether it be by subsid[y] [blank] require that you would be pleased to give me five subsidies and 2 fifteens [blank] for the wars; and for my own aid [blank]. My crying debts are so heavy that for my own that no man can bear them with a greater grief and sting of conscience than I do. I am resolved to follow your advice if this may be done and I see a fair way for it. I will follow your advice for I would not ask your advice unless I had meant to follow.
The Duke had asked the King about it, that if we did not/
For the levying of the 5 subsidies and fifteens, these 2 things I would have you to consider: how to clear these 2 difficulties that in a short time it may be raised [blank]. But seeing that I leave it to yourselves to receive in and to expend it again, you may be [blank]. [f. 55] On the other side, I would not have too long lingering about it. I told you before in this great business to look to my conscience and honour. For my means, I must have it from you. I have thought upon it and daily do think upon it what to resolve. I would never have craved it if I had never had intended to follow it.
But for the manner of publishing, he would take our advice. The King did/
I told you before that this is the way to be m[aking] me in love with Parliaments. To have a new session at Michaelmas next or within a few days after, and another at the spring of the year. That in the meantime, you may go down into the country and acquaint yourselves with the grievances of the subject, [f. 55v] and then see my care in making good laws and reforming abuses that so they may see the good fruits of Parliament and rejoice in them. And I protest as I have asked your advice herein, which I might have done without, so I will never enter into any treaty or composition for peace or war without your advice [blank] the end [blank]. So I will not enter into a composition or agreement [blank] otherwise it were unjust and unlawful.
Duke of Buckingham said because so great a trust was committed to him, he entreats that Sir George Goring/
The Prince said that if the House would undertake to take into consideration his Majesty's demands, he would undertake that his Majesty should presently declare himself.
IX. DIARY OF RICHARD DYOTT, STAFFORDSHIRE RECORD OFFICE, MS D661/11/1/2
A message from [the] Lords by [Sir Humphrey] Winch, [Sir John] Davies. The Lords desire a conference [?with the] committees of both Houses who attended it yesterday, to agree upon a relation of the King's speech and the rather for that there was a mistaking went abroad [illegible] the Prince had power to expound the King's meaning.
Answer: the House shall be [?2 words illegible] give a present meeting.
Bill to make ministers and other spiritual persons capable of leases of lands for the benefit of their wives and children, etc.
Bill for the abbreviation of Michaelmas term. Committed.
[?2 words illegible] prothonotaries to be sent for, the returns [?no] [?6 words illegible] confounding [?3 words illegible] of [?3 words illegible] precedent.
Bill for relief of creditors against such persons as die in execution.
[f. 51] Bill for preservation of salmon and trout.
Bill for confirmation of Wadham College and the possessions thereof.
X. DIARY OF JOHN PYM, NORTHAMPTONSHIRE RECORD OFFICE, FH/N/C/0050
15 Martii 1623
An act concerning the manor of Goathland in Yorkshire.
An act for free buying and selling of Welsh cottons.
An act for correcting and amending erroneous judgements in courts of equity.
Committees were appointed for preparing the bill concerning election of knights and burgesses, in which this was observed, that no time nor place was appointed to the committees because it was not of a bill depending.
An act against scandalous ministers.
It was ordered that the writ for Chippenham should be carried down and the return for Mr. [Charles] Maynard amended.
The other part of that case concerning Sir Francis Popham was begun to be argued, but interrupted by a message from the Lords for a present conference, which was granted.
MR. [RALPH] WHITFIELD reported the bill concerning the delay of suitors by removing actions out of inferior courts.
An act to make ministers capable of leases for the benefit of their wife and children.
An act for free liberty of fishing upon the coast of America.
An act for abbreviating Michaelmas term.
Hilary [sic] term was abbreviated 32 H. 8.
An act for release of creditors against persons dying in execution.
An act for the preservation of the spawn of salmon.
[Conference with the Lords]
[f. 29v] The committees of both Houses met and adjourned until tomorrow.
XI. DIARY OF SIR WALTER EARLE, BL, ADD. MS 18,597
Monday, the 15th of March
SIR GEORGE MORE'S motion concerning the rating and proportioning of arms and to have some law to be made for it.
[f. 86v] Bill for free trade of Welsh cottons. First read.
Bill for regulating courts of equity and of erroneous judgements in the same and preventing the like for the future. First read.
MR. [EDWARD] ALFORD. 7 bills last Parliament concerning the Chancery: judges in Chancery, erecting new offices, moderating fees, to prevent bribery.
Bill against scandalous and unworthy ministers. First read.
In the case of Chippenham, ordered that the town should amend the return and put in [Mr.] John [Maynard] instead of Charles Maynard.
A message from the Lords: they desire a meeting of the committees touching the making of the report of the King's speech. The time forthwith, the rather because of reports gone abroad of some mistake concerning which the King has given authority to the Prince to explain his meaning.
The House resolved to meet accordingly.
Monday afternoon, the committee of grievances
The New England patent. Counsel heard to justify it. They alleged that the patentees did not deny any to fish, but only to enter upon their freehold and to take their timber. They offered that if any clauses [f. 87] were inconvenient to the commonwealth, they would be content to have it left out. They alleged that this was a conquest and that the King might establish what laws he pleased.
The answers to the exceptions:
- 1. Foynes, Sherwell, etc., had never any grant of, etc.
- 2. If any other Christian prince had possession, that is no grievance to this commonwealth but Sir F. Gidenies, etc.
- 3. The depopulation in a great part is true.
- 4. The bounds and the largeness thereof is no grievance. If there were no grant, other princes might come and plant.
- 5. The name, it is no dishonour; they may be partners if they will.
- 6. For punishing criminally, etc., such as, etc. Confesses not so justifiable. Were to be wished it were according to the laws of England. They are willing it should be amended if it be thought fit.
- 7. For the power of expelling by force of arms such as shall disturb etc., and forbidding to visit the coast on pain of confiscation. This they also submit to amendment.
- 8. Restraint of traffic dishonourable to the King.
- 9. Examining upon oath to discover their [f. 87v] own offences. This confessed to be not so justifiable.
- 10. Power to bring one thence here to be judged.
- 11. All justices and officers to assist. Justifiable if according to law.
- 12. [Blank]. If the plantation be cherished, they which were wont to fish at Newfoundland will continue their trade there.
Objection. Scandalous aspersions on the last Parliament in a printed book. Answer. No such thing in that book.
Sir Edward Coke. If right to the trees, it may be tried here at common law.
XII. JOURNAL OF SIR SIMONDS D'EWES, BL, HARL. MS 159
[15 March 1624]
The Duke of Buckingham, at the same time, March the 15th, after his Highness had ended, did likewise add further satisfaction from his Majesty in the Prince's his Highness' and committees of 2 Houses' presence.
Here the Duke was pleased to add something of his own, and first he made an apology for himself in adventuring his discretion, now to let us know that out of his desire to take an opportunity to do good offices between the King and the Parliament he had spoken to his Majesty, though he had no, and therefore if it pleased their Lordships he would acquaint them with what had passed.
First, the King asked me why the Parliament was so forward to engage him by his declaration.
The Duke answered him that he would deliver his opinion of the causes. The first was their apprehension had of the growing ambition of the great monarch of Spain. Secondly, they conceived this to be a fit time, for that the present pope stood well-affected to France, and France ill-affected to Spain by reason of the Valtelline, and in Germany they were jealous of the King of Spain's greatness, and Bavaria in particular disliked the great footing he had in the Palatinate. Thirdly, that the conditions of the match were prejudicial to the present government here, and that they pressed to the abrogation of many good laws, and were contrary to the consciences and vote of the people.
Then the King objected that if he should have treaty upon the like occasion with any other prince of the popish religion, he would think himself scorned if he had not the same conditions which were yielded to Spain.
To which the Duke delivered his opinion that he thought this might be well answered by considering, first, the conditions which were agreed upon between the two kingdoms; secondly, the additions when the Prince was in Spain. And for these it was especially to be considered that the Prince being there in person, he was upon the stage engaged in his honour and desirous to express his affection in bringing the lady away, and not having had such help of his Majesty's ministers there as he should have had, and that withal some of those very things his Majesty yielded to here was to fetch home the Prince. And I hope never any other prince we treat with shall have that advantage to stand upon as Spain now had by having the Prince in their possession. And for the conditions between the two kingdoms, the motive was the promise of £600,000 and the restoring of the Palatinate, which no other prince which no other prince [sic] can promise or perform, and this the King liked well enough.
Then the Duke propounded further to the King that his Majesty might stop the mouth of France or any other if he would but give way to his people to petition to his Majesty that, out of the experience of the inconveniency arising by this treaty, his Majesty would be pleased not to yield to any such conditions with any other popish princes, and for France, if they should urge such conditions, his Majesty might do the like for their subjects the Protestants, commonly called the Huguenots there, and this the King liked very well.
The Prince then added that he had taken notice of a report, which he was informed did arise from order lately given by the King for moneys to be sent into Spain, that the treaty there should be continued, whereunto his Majesty further adding that if that would not bring him home, he would lay an 100 to one that it should never beget a new treaty.
[f. 31v] After, on Thursday, the 25th [sic] of March, the Prince's Highness being with some Lords, being in the Committee Chamber, they were telling him that they feared if once his Majesty should begin a war, the King of Spain would soon end it by offering some new and better conditions of peace or using some other means to content and satisfy the King of England. "No", quoted his Highness, "fear it not, for, by the grace of God, as my father is long here he draw his sword, so if he have out drawn it, he shall be long in putting it up again".
[f. 79v] March 150, Monday
An act for securing the lordship of Goathland to the Prince from the encumbrance [of] Sir Richard Etherington.
A motion to have a bill drawn about fitting arms for men (martial, not herald's arms).
An act for the free trading of Welsh cloths, cottons, friezes, etc.
An act for redressing and reforming erroneous judgements and decrees and orders in courts of equity since Jacobi 70 and preventing of the like hereafter.
A motion for 7 other bills that lie in court for the rectifying of the Chancery.
An act against scandalous and unworthy ministers.
In the returning of a burgess from the [borough of] Chippenham, Charles Maynard was put for [Mr.] John [Maynard]; and coming in dispute, the Clerk of the Crown was not suffered to amend it but order was given to send the writ back to the town.
A message from the Lords for a conference with intimation that the Prince would be there to explain and expound something the King had said the day before, which by reason it had [f. 80] been mistaken had caused a great many sad rumours abroad.
[Edward] Ingrey, under-sheriff of Cambridge, petitions to be called to his answer because the county day draws on for a new election.
An act to make ministers capable of taking leases in their own name for the benefit of their wives and children, which the statute anno 21 Henrici 8vi allowed not.
An act for free fishing and fishing voyages upon the coasts of Newfoundland, etc.
An act for the abbreviation of Michaelmas term, vide March 30.
We find that anno 320 Henrici 8vi that Trinity term was abridged because it ran too far into harvest and had seven returns.
An act for relief of creditors against such persons as die in execution.
An act for the preservation and increase of salmon, trout and peals of the sea.
An act for the confirmation of Wadham College in Oxford.