House of Commons Journal Volume 3: 15 October 1644

Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 3, 1643-1644. Originally published by His Majesty's Stationery Office, London, 1802.

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'House of Commons Journal Volume 3: 15 October 1644', in Journal of the House of Commons: Volume 3, 1643-1644, (London, 1802) pp. 664-665. British History Online [accessed 12 April 2024]


In this section

Die Martis, Octobris 15, 1644.


Warrant for bringing in Witnesses.

ORDERED, That Mr. Speaker do grant his Warrant for bringing in of Witnesses to speak their Knowledge of the Matters concerning Warwickshire, Staffordshire, Shropshire, &c. referred to the Committee of Lords and Commons for the Earl of Denbighe's Association.

Siege of Basinghouse.

A Letter from the Committee at Basingstoke, of Octobris 14, 1634, desiring some Supply to be sent to the Forces before Basinghouse, was this Day read.

Ordered, That it be recommended to the Consideration of the Committee of both Kingdoms, to send some of the Lord General's or Earl of Manchester's Forces, or such other Forces as they shall think fit, to the Siege at Basinghouse, for the better reducing of that Garison.


Ordered, That the Commissioners of the Customs do forthwith make due Payment of all such Monies as they have received for Customs from the One-and-twentieth Day of September last, unto Sir Henry Vane junior, Treasurer of the Navy: And that they do likewise continue the Payment of all such Sums of Money as they shall hereafter receive for Customs, according as they shall be thereunto directed by the Committee of the Navy, until they shall make up a perfect Account of their Receipts, according to former Order.

Propositions to the King.

Mr. Reynolds reports from the Committee, a Proposition concerning the taking away the Court of Wards, to be inserted in the Blank of the Eleventh Proposition; viz. "And to an Act or Acts of Parliament for taking away the Court of Wards and Liveries; and all Wardships, Liveries, Primer Seisins, or Ouster Lemaines; and all other Charges incident or arising for or by reason of Wardships, Liveries, Primer Seisin, or Ouster Lemaine; and for the taking away of all Tenures by Homage and all Fines, Licences, Seizures, and Pardons, for Alienation, and all other Charges incident thereunto; and for turning of all Tenures by Knights Service, either of his Majesty or others, or by Knights Service, or Socage in Capite of his Majesty, into free and common Socage; and that his Majesty will please to accept in Recompence hereof, One hundred thousand Pounds per Annum:" The which was read; and upon the Question, assented unto.

Mr. Maynard likewise reported, a Proposition concerning the Great Seal; viz. That all Acts and Things done by the Commissioners of the Great Seal, appointed by Ordinance of Parliament, according to the Purport of that Ordinance, or by any Person or Persons, by any Commission, or other Authority, granted or awarded by the said Commissioners, or under the said Seal respectively, shall be held as valid and effectual in Law, to all Intents, as if such Acts or Things had been done by the Lord Chancellor, or Lord Keeper, for the Time being, or by the like Authority or Commission granted or awarded by the Lord Chancellor, or Lord Keeper, for the Time being, or under the Great Seal of England, in the Time of full Peace; and an Act of Parliament to be passed accordingly:" The which was read; and, upon the Question, assented unto.

Resolved, upon the Question, That the Time, in the First Blank of the Nineteenth Proposition, shall be, from the Day that Edward Lord Littleton, then Lord Keeper of the Great Seal, deserted the Parliament; and that the said Great Seal was surreptitiously conveyed away from the Parliament; being the One-and-twentieth Day of May, 1642.

Resolved, &c. That the Time, in the Second Blank of the Nineteenth Proposition, shall be, from the Twentieth Day of May, 1642, being the Day that both Houses declared, That the King, seduced by evil Counsel, intended to raise War against the Parliament.

Ordered, That it be referred to Mr. Maynard, Mr. Predeaux, and Mr. Reynolds, to prepare a Proposition for making void all Acts and Things issuing from the Great Seal at Oxon, since the said Seal was conveyed from the Parliament; and for confirming and making good all Things issuing from the Great Seal here, done by virtue of any Order of one or both Houses of Parliament.

Resolved, &c. That the Fourth Qualification of the Fourteenth Proposition shall be totally omitted: And that the Eighth Qualification, concerning the Estates of those Persons excepted in the first Four preceding Qualifications, shall be made in the Three first preceding Qualifications.

The Propositions desired by the City of London, to be granted and confirmed by Act of Parliament, were read; and referred unto Mr. Reynolds, Mr. Maynard, Sir Thomas Widdrington, Mr. Recorder, Mr. Selden, Mr. Niclas, Mr. Solicitor, Mr. Vassall, Mr. Lisle, Mr. Blackeston, Mr. Bell, Sir Phillip Stapleton, Mr. Longe, Mr. Ellis, Mr. Predeaux, Sir Robert Pye, Sir John Francklyn, Sir Gilbert Gerard, Sir Richard Onslowe, Sir John Trevor, Mr. Ashe, Mr. Hollis, Mr. Bond, and to the Knights and Burgesses for London, Surry, Middlesex, Kent, Essex, and all the Ports; to consider of the said Propositions; and to present such of them as they shall think most necessary for the present; and such other Matters as they shall think fitting, for the Good of the City: And have Power to confer and to consult with such of the City, as they shall think fit: And have Power to send for Parties, Witnesses, Papers, Records, &c.: And are to meet this Afternoon in the Exchequer Chamber: And are to report on Thursday Morning next: And the Care of this Business is especially recommended unto Mr. Long.

Lords desire a Conference.

A Message from the Lords, by Sir Robert Rich and Mr. Page;

The Lords desire a Conference, by a Committee of both Houses, presently, in the Painted Chamber, if it may stand with the Conveniency of this House, concerning the King's Plate; and concerning the Earl of Thanett.

Propositions for Peace.

Ordered, That the Propositions for a safe and wellgrounded Peace be taken into Consideration To-morrow Morning, the first Business.

Conference agreed to.

Resolved, &c. That the Answer to the Message shall be; That the House will give a present Meeting, as is desired.

Answer returned by the same Messengers; That this House has considered their Lordships Message; and will give a present Meeting, as is desired.-

Assembly of Divines.

Ordered, That the Name of Mr. Dellmay, proposed to be added to the Assembly of Divines, be referred to the Consideration of the Committee appointed to meet with the Commissioners of the Church of Scotland: Who are to inform this House of their Opinions touching the said Mr. Dellmay.

Publick Stores.

Ordered, That Colonel Thorneton, who hath raised a Troop of Horse at his own Charge, under the Command of my Lord Fairefax, shall have Fifty Backs, Breasts, and Pots, and Fifty Pair of Pistols, out of the publick Stores, for the Arming of the said Troop.-


Sir Gilbert Gerard, Mr. Reynolds, are appointed Reporters of this Conference.

Propositions for Peace.

The Preamble and Conclusion to the Propositions for a safe and well-grounded Peace were read; and re-committed to the Consideration of the Committee of both Kingdoms.

Disposing of King's Plate.

Mr. Reynolds reports the Conference desired by the Lords: That the Lord North acquainted them, That the Lords had taken into serious Consideration; and could not consent to the Passing the Ordinance for disposing of the King's Plate: For, That Plate is ancient Plate; the Fashion of it, and the Badges upon it, more Worth than the Plate itself: And the particular Affection set upon That Plate, will make it of ill Consequence, if it be disposed of; though Necessity be a Motive thereunto: Besides, it doth too much look like the Queen's Pawning and Selling of the Jewels of the Crown. Also the Parliament hath expressed Affection to the King; and to take care of his Children: And that this Act would be somewhat incongruous, now to sell his Plate, which that Ordinance requires.

Earl of Thanett's Fine.

Then he presented the Petition of the Earl of Thanett: Which was read: And also the Petition of the Countess of Pembroke, on the Behalf of her Son-in-Law the Lord Thanett: The which was likewise read.

The Lord North further said, That the Lord Thanett's Error was but of few Hours: That he was first sessed at Four thousand Pounds: He is willing to pay Five thousand Pounds presently: And desire the Residue of his Fine, being Fifteen thousand Pounds, may be taken off; and that this Five thousand Pounds may be employed for the Service mentioned in that Ordinance concerning the Plate.

Disposing of King's Plate.

Resolved, &c. That this House doth adhere to the former Vote concerning the Disposal of the King's Plate: And the Committee for the Three associated Counties are to prepare Reasons to be offered at a Conference, in Confirmation thereof.

Delinquents Compositions.

Resolved, &c. That the Committee for the Three associated Counties shall have Power to treat with, and present the Names of such Persons, within the said Three Counties, as desire to come to a Composition for their Delinquency.

Earl of Thanett's Fine.

Resolved, &c. That the Fine set upon the Earl of Thanett shall not exceed the Sum of Eight thousand Pounds.

Resolved, That the Earl of Thanett shall forthwith pay Five thousand Pounds.

Resolved, That, after the Five thousand Pounds is paid, and Security given at Goldsmiths Hall, to pay such further Sum of the said Three thousand Pounds as this House shall think fit, the Sequestration of his Estate shall be taken off.

Resolved, &c. That Three thousand Pounds of this Five thousand Pounds, of the Earl of Thanett's Fine, shall be borrowed of the Committee at Goldsmiths Hall; to be disposed of for Payment of the Forces at Abbington, and other Parts, under the Command of Major General Browne: And Sir Henry Mildmay is ordered and enjoined to deliver so much of the King's Plate to the Committee at Goldsmiths Hall as will amount to Three thousand Pounds; to remain there as Security for the said Three thousand Pounds so to be borrowed: And, in case the Committee be not satisfied the Three thousand Pounds within a Month, That then the said Committee at Goldsmiths Hall shall be at Liberty to melt the same.

Ordered, That Sir Humphry Tufton do acquaint the Earl of Thanett with this Order; and return his Answer.